And the other headscratcher - a rolled cartridge belt

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maple_leaf_eh

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Finally, I have three cartridges with the most unusual rim I can remember. The brass is formed like a conventional magnum belt, but it looks rolled into place. The bullets are similar to the other bronze-looking bullets I posted. Nominal diameter is .43 cal or 11mm, and case length is 54.5mm. There are four indistinct characters on the head. The most legible one looks like P M H 95.

https://imgur.com/a/wyR2TcO
 
that link is to the imgur page. you have to use a share link
Mxzm22g.jpg
 
OK...this made me curious...

My google fu seems to lead me to this

11,4 x 57 R Reformado (Cuban)

I found this pic but the link takes yo to a page without the pic if that makes sense

bWv4Uyd.jpg


Here is the link that the pic above was associated with

https://forum.cartridgecollectors.org/t/unknown-11-15x57/8963
 
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Pirotechnica Militar Habana , made Havana Cuba 1895, Spanish Reformado ctg with manufacturing error. Seems there are several specimens known
 
The Specimen that I have has the same compression ( belt) ring as the one in your first picture ( upper left ) the distance wise . Head stamp ,starting at the top going clock wise S,A,1,91. Some one before me has marked it as 43 Spanish . Bronze bullet that is pie crimped just below the grease Grove . The bullet tip is flat with a embossed X . Nice to know some history about it .
 
buzzmagoo said:
The Specimen that I have has the same compression ( belt) ring as the one in your first picture ( upper left ) the distance wise. .... Nice to know some history about it .
Click to expand...

Buzz, you and the original collector come from the same part of the country. Do you have any provenance for yours or how long you've had it? Do you remember where you got it or who had it before you?
 
I have had it for maybe 10 years if memory serves I got it from a old collection ( bottom of a junk box ) more than likely bought it as a group pick . Sherbrook Que . I like different / weird ammo .
I also noticed from the pictures the bullets look to be seated at different depths .
 
Looks like it got scrunched during reload.
The Spanish military reloaded spent brass to save money.
Which is why the head stamp is flattened.
 
buzzmagoo said:
I have had it for maybe 10 years if memory serves I got it from a old collection ( bottom of a junk box ) more than likely bought it as a group pick . Sherbrook Que . I like different / weird ammo .
I also noticed from the pictures the bullets look to be seated at different depths .
Click to expand...

A couple of the bullets are loose in the cases. I measured the case length with a micrometer.

Will double check the lengths other people have asked about. In particular to estimate how much of the wall has been bulged out by the roll.

I agree that the head should be stepped like a modern 7.62x54R, and firing flattens out the curve badly enough to the markings. With many examples in circulation claimed here and on line, I tend to disregard any idea that these rounds were released from the arsenal in unshootable condition. For all the effort to reuse cases, the Spanish would have salvaged whatever components they could. It seems more likely that in private hands these cartridges were scarce and therefore valuable. The shooter chose to keep the deformed cartridges after damaging them trying to chamber a round. Maybe as warnings, for some hoped for reloading, or just because the bulges were so spectacular.
 
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