Has anyone done this and are there any tricks I would need to know in advance? Any pros or cons or can it be done at all, never tried it. I just picked up 500 nickel plated brass which I intend to use for 3 different calibers and a couple will require some working of the brass, annealing may be advantageous, if possible.
Annealing Nickel Cases
- Thread starter c-fbmi
- Start date
It sounds like he will be necking up or down and cold working the brass. I haven't done nickel before but a good guess would be to time the average brass to fully anneal andmaybe add a second. Or go the really slow way and use tempelaque on every case as its a visual indicator of heat
Treat it like you would any other brass. I've necked up nickel plated 30-06 casings to 33 and 35 caliber without a problem.
When necking up, it's always a good idea to anneal the case.
Even the 35 cal only needed one pass. Didn't require an intermediate bump first.
On thing though, you may want to get tapered sizing balls and make sure you lube the case mouths well before running them through the die. The case mouths will not be straight across and will need to be trimmed true.
When necking up, it's always a good idea to anneal the case.
Even the 35 cal only needed one pass. Didn't require an intermediate bump first.
On thing though, you may want to get tapered sizing balls and make sure you lube the case mouths well before running them through the die. The case mouths will not be straight across and will need to be trimmed true.
I have a fair stash of nickel 270/30-06 brass that I was about to start converting into other calibers and was wondering the same thing.I think I'll just treat them the same as my ordinary plain brass as bearhunter has and have at them.I've been handloading for years but until recently these have actually been the only nickel cases I've gotten my hands on,kind of looking forward to giving them a go.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
It'll be interesting to see what kind of success you have. I've never tried annealing nickled cases, but found that getting a consistent bullet pull with that stuff was an exercise in frustration. One round would grip the bullet securely, the next you could spin with your fingers even after crimping! I finally resized without the expander ball, but even that was less consistent than I preferred. Nickled brass wouldn't be my first choice for wildcatting, but I'm confident that you'll invent a technique to make it work.
I have access to a high quality annealing machine. I will be annealing some nickle stuff in a few
Months. I am going to fire form, and fire my cases 2 times before I anneal. I will let you guys know how it turns out when I do it.
Months. I am going to fire form, and fire my cases 2 times before I anneal. I will let you guys know how it turns out when I do it.
Pretty much mandatory in our experience. Split necks, often right down through the shoulder, being common ... and they tend to show up early too.
One batch of once reloaded Fed 308's had a few crack open just sitting there in the box!.
Have not yet been successfull with tempilac. Could not get the stuff to adhere thick enough to that slippery nickle.
"time the average brass to fully anneal andmaybe add a second."
This ^.
The best we could do in the absense of that tell tale .. subtle .. blue flame to yellowish colour change back behind the neck where the flame fingers re-join.
Chuck 'em up in the drill/driver and ... "one mississippi", ... "two", ....., About 4-5 mississipi's, till their cooked.
If you see any discolouration on the nickle itself, they have been overheated IMO.
Totally agree Boomer.
Very noticable if one ever try's pulling some bullets!. Some of 'em are locked in like a vise, others ....
Had some 6.5/06 reformed from Win. nickle .280's, that sat around a few years till I tryed to salvage the Amax's. No way. Those bullets were trashed coming out of the RCBS collet puller.
As an aside:
The abrasive plating puts deep striations into the bullet shank. Not so easy on the dies either. They will forevermore leave scratches on resized brass cases, especially the neck.
Last edited:
This nickel brass is all new 416 RM in R-P. Hoping to hear from someone who has done it................my concerns are the nickel flaking off or some such thing...........has anyone done it?
Bearhunter, I've been wildcatting and necking up and down for years, but thanks for the advice regardless. I always make an expanding mandrel on my lathe and use a long taper with lots of lube to expand case necks when I need to. I also polish the mandrel to a mirror finish which I find helps immensely and reduces split and uneven necks.
vviking.......you and I were posting at the same time, yours showed up first. So no problem with flaking or the nickel coming off...............I have annealed many, many cases so I would probably just do some equivalent brass cases to establish a time line and carry on using that time line as opposed to discoloration that I use now. You say that the nickel does not discolor until it's too late, correct?
Bearhunter, I've been wildcatting and necking up and down for years, but thanks for the advice regardless. I always make an expanding mandrel on my lathe and use a long taper with lots of lube to expand case necks when I need to. I also polish the mandrel to a mirror finish which I find helps immensely and reduces split and uneven necks.
vviking.......you and I were posting at the same time, yours showed up first. So no problem with flaking or the nickel coming off...............I have annealed many, many cases so I would probably just do some equivalent brass cases to establish a time line and carry on using that time line as opposed to discoloration that I use now. You say that the nickel does not discolor until it's too late, correct?
Last edited:
That means your case is to hard and the necks are springing back after being sized. They need to be annealed
Thats been my experience Douglas ^.
Ive seen the plating worn off the sharp shoulders and neck mouth's, but never yet seen flaking. Good. 'Cause just the thought of nickle bits going 3000fps down bore ?? .
Early days, I overcooked a few due to lack of visual cues. They went dead soft and useless at a point just Before any discoloration of the nickle showed up.
With your savvy, you'll have no problem with any of this.
The other downsides of nickle plated I mentioned, they will still be there, unfortunately.
It's often 'low milage, with inherent issues' brass for some of us. Depends on your purpose/expectations, I suppose.
They sure are pretty, and do stay pretty, though.
Good luck!.
Found this somewhere, no experience myself.
Annealing nickel plated brass does not extend case life.
Here's why: All metals have different properties and different annealing techniques. The concept is to make the metal more ductile without losing strength. Carbon steel is annealed by heating to a given temperature then cooled slowly. Both nickel and brass are annealed by heating to a given temperature then cooled quickly (quenched in cold water). The problem with a nickel and brass combination is the different annealing temperatures. Brass used in cartridges anneals properly at 600 deg F whereas nickel takes 800-1000 deg F (depending on the alloy). If you heat a nickel plated case hot enough to anneal the nickel, the brass will be "over annealed" where it becomes so soft it won't have enough neck tension to hold a bullet and will likely crumple when the case is sized or when a bullet is seated. Likewise, if you heat the neck to 600 degrees, the brass will be fine but the nickel becomes brittle and will flake off when the case is sized or fired.
When nickel plated cases are manufactured, the brass is first annealed at 600 degrees then quenched. Afterwards, the cases are electroplated with nickel at room temperature to maintain the brass properties. The only purpose for nickel plating is to make the cartridge more resistant to corrosion and of course to make them look pretty.
Nickel plated handgun brass becomes brittle when fired and sized, thus reducing the number of times it can be reloaded. Nickel plated rifle brass is not intended to be reloaded, however you can usually squeeze out a few reloads before the necks split.
Annealing nickel plated brass does not extend case life.
Here's why: All metals have different properties and different annealing techniques. The concept is to make the metal more ductile without losing strength. Carbon steel is annealed by heating to a given temperature then cooled slowly. Both nickel and brass are annealed by heating to a given temperature then cooled quickly (quenched in cold water). The problem with a nickel and brass combination is the different annealing temperatures. Brass used in cartridges anneals properly at 600 deg F whereas nickel takes 800-1000 deg F (depending on the alloy). If you heat a nickel plated case hot enough to anneal the nickel, the brass will be "over annealed" where it becomes so soft it won't have enough neck tension to hold a bullet and will likely crumple when the case is sized or when a bullet is seated. Likewise, if you heat the neck to 600 degrees, the brass will be fine but the nickel becomes brittle and will flake off when the case is sized or fired.
When nickel plated cases are manufactured, the brass is first annealed at 600 degrees then quenched. Afterwards, the cases are electroplated with nickel at room temperature to maintain the brass properties. The only purpose for nickel plating is to make the cartridge more resistant to corrosion and of course to make them look pretty.
Nickel plated handgun brass becomes brittle when fired and sized, thus reducing the number of times it can be reloaded. Nickel plated rifle brass is not intended to be reloaded, however you can usually squeeze out a few reloads before the necks split.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
There's lots of room in the landfill for nickled brass. I got turned off the stuff long before it began to show up in bottle neck rifle cases. An old fellow I knew back in Winnipeg loaded .38 Special on a Star Progressive, back when those were state of the art. When I bragged up the shiny new nickled brass I had, and asked if he wanted any, he said no it was really difficult to work on the progressive press compared to yellow brass. I wasn't surprised. But if I have 100 pieces of nickled brass on the property today, I would be surprised. I have 1 .416 Rigby, maybe, 20 .458s (they came with the rifle), a loaded .243 WSSM (that I found at the range) and a handful of .38s, .357s, and .44s. It just seems like a lot more trouble than its worth for a handloader. I suppose if I needed brass and it was all I could get, I'd get enough to get by, but not by choice.
Last edited:
Ya Boomer but when you can get enough of it cheap enough, who cares if a few split prematurely. I plan to use it for my 458 Ruger, 375 Wby and a 416 Ruger which may be way out on the horizon.........not like they will get a lot of use really and I got 525 of them. I may decide I need another 450 Ackley too............
fingers284
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Alberta Cowboy Ranges
I realize this is a "rifle case thread, Boomer made a comment about nickel pistol brass as well. My experience with nickel pistol brass differs significantly from his. I don't notice any difference in press (three Dillons & a Lee) reaction to nickel or yellow brass. I have two sets of carbide dies, RCBS and Lee, both handle nickel equally well.
Re; Nickel flaking. Some of my nickel stuff has been loaded dozens of times. The first 1000 rdns that I purchased in 1973 is still in regular rotation use today. Of the 10's of thousands of rounds loaded in the past years, I have tossed 3 or 4 a year with cracks and can't remember tossing any from "flaking". My nickel brass probably outnumber the yellow by a ratio of 5 to one and I toss as many "yellow" a year from cracks as I do nickel.
Re; Nickel flaking. Some of my nickel stuff has been loaded dozens of times. The first 1000 rdns that I purchased in 1973 is still in regular rotation use today. Of the 10's of thousands of rounds loaded in the past years, I have tossed 3 or 4 a year with cracks and can't remember tossing any from "flaking". My nickel brass probably outnumber the yellow by a ratio of 5 to one and I toss as many "yellow" a year from cracks as I do nickel.
