Another 'legality' question, I may get burned..

BMacT

BMacT

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Hi folks.
I do own firearms, I have a PAL, so I know 'some' of the regulations.
However, I'm wondering about importing (from the U.S.) a lower than 500 fps pellet or bb rifle, or pistol.
If I buy one at Walmart in the U.S. and bring it home, where will I go wrong?
It's not technically a firearm, so don't have to declare it as such at the Canadian border, what about having it in my posession as a non-resident in the U.S.? (i.e. like the rules about ammunition and components etc.)

I'm looking for a reasonably cheap, smaller pistol and/or rifle to get my grandson started with safe gun handling and marksmanship. I'm Scottish, so I'm not puttin' out 'real' money until he shows some interest and/or ability, and the stuff in the States is cheaper.

Any thoughts?

Thanks, Bill.
 
You will have a problem if it's an airsoft gun you plan on bringing back across the border.
 
BMacT said:
I'm wondering about importing (from the U.S.) a lower than 500 fps pellet or bb rifle, or pistol. If I buy one at Walmart in the U.S. and bring it home, where will I go wrong? It's not technically a firearm, so don't have to declare it as such at the Canadian border
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You still have to declare it. The CBSA agent will want to know whether it meets the Canadian definition of firearm. Keep the packaging to show the agent. You'll have no problem.

what about having it in my possession as a non-resident in the U.S.? (i.e. like the rules about ammunition and components etc.)
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Under U.S. federal law, an airgun is not a firearm. The only thing you'll need to check first are the laws of the respective state(s) and municipalities in which you will find yourself. That particular state, or that particular city, might expressly forbid it.

Any thoughts?
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Check state and local laws.
 
I recently moved from Bugtario to BC and I drove through the US to save on time and fuel with the moving van. I had zero problems at either border crossings, but when i answered "yes" to if i had any firearms on the truck they wanted to see my pal and all the registration certs. I was very organized, so it was very simple. They did not seem to care about the 10,000+ rounds of ammo tho!!

I would only do it if you have ALL the info you might need..
 
Thanks for the replies. I'll feel a little less worried about it although I can't think of anything I'd be doing that would be 'wrong'. Unless of course there are local or State laws that don't allow non-residents to purchase pellet/bb guns. I will check on that.

And, I always declare stuff when I cross the border. I don't mind paying any fees I'm supposed to, I'm prepared to do that. Besides, our son works for CBSA so I guess I have to be good. :)
 
Father,
You may or may not have been on sketchy ground with the US guys, wrt the ammo. Dunno that for sure though. Done is done though, too.

The Canadian side is worried about what you bring in. The US side worries about what you buy there and carry out (export) and they are the ones that could potentially make your life miserable. It's not the Customs stuff, it's the Homeland Security stuff that'll burn you, as far as export controls.

The US has a fair bit more open interpretation of what is a Firearm, compared to our rules. Black powder muzzle loaders, any air arms, etc, as well as a lot wider variety of Antiques, are not considered to be firearms under their rules, but are under ours.

And then, as Wendell says, you gotta keep track of several different layers of local laws.

As far as cheap airguns goes, have you been on the Canadian Airguns Forum? Shop from home! :)
There are several older rifles around, that are generally smaller than what you find in the stores these days, that would be good first guns for a kid to plink with.
Some of the Slavia's and Diana rifles come to mind, as well as some of the BSA springer rifles.
Or you could hook up on the classic starter, the Crosman 760 multi-pump pneumatic. If you get a decent used one, you can afford to hack down the stock or buy a second stock to hack. They will shoot pellets or BB's, and the force required to load up is within reason. It takes a few seconds to get the next shot downrange, so there is some time to think about shot control, and that like.

Worth checking out the stuff on the CAF 'for sale' sub!

Cheers
Trev
 
trevj said:
local laws.

As far as cheap airguns goes, have you been on the Canadian Airguns Forum? Shop from home! :)

Or you could hook up on the classic starter, the Crosman 760 multi-pump pneumatic. If you get a decent used one, you can afford to hack down the stock or buy a second stock to hack. They will shoot pellets or BB's, and the force required to load up is within reason. It takes a few seconds to get the next shot downrange, so there is some time to think about shot control, and that like.

Worth checking out the stuff on the CAF 'for sale' sub!

Cheers
Trev
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x2 Yes, there are some dirt-cheap options down there (US) but lots of good value here. CAF (as mentioned) has a very active B&S section if used is OK, but online dealers like D&L airgun in BC are great people to deal with. I'd keep your $ in Canada if I were you, especially buying new. I also don't buy anything gun-related at Canadian Tire (who sell airguns) because, should I have an issue, I'd hate to have to deal with some 17 yr. old twit at store level. At least when you buy from a dealer, you can CALL that dealer with questions/issues should they arise.

BTW~Crosman 760's, and most Crosman pumpers are pretty bullet proof designs. The first gun I ever held was a 760, the first one I bought was a 1377 with a 1399 stock. Sort of a carbine-sized rig.
 
The US border officers did not care one bit about the ammo. I was bringing over 18 long guns and they were interested in that, but i had all paperwork (which they examined) so it was a 5 min crossing. All of the rifles were locked in lockers and all had trigger locks right at the rear of the truck in case they wanted to open and inspect, but neither crossing did. The US Officers said i should play it safe and get a hunting license in every state i drove through in case highway patrol pulled me over. I didnt and took my chances. The Canadian officer was a little bit more thorough, but as soon as he saw my PAL and all the paperwork he was super polite. I was expecting trouble as I do look like a criminal with full tatoo sleeves on both arms, shaved head and big beard. They didnt care! Smooth crossing both times.
 
I have looked around in Canada. I like Slavias it was my first pellet rifle and I got good at shooting flies of the porch railing with it. The main reason I was asking is that the last time I was down in the U.S. I saw a Crosman BB CO2 pistol kit for about $25.00. I couldn't find anything here for that. I figured it was worth a try for him to get used to a pistol.
I very definitely will 'shop at home' when looking to upgrade for myself (I'd like another Slavia) or getting a better quality one for the grandson later on.

This was more like a 'just for now' thing 'cause it was very reasonable cost-wise. Not a big deal if it breaks, or he doesn't take to it.

Thanks again.
 
Oh yeah, the Crosman 760 pump pneumatic. I've tried one of those and cannot stand the multiple pump process. What I'd like to try is their 1077 repeater, it's CO2 powered.
But I'm not sure if they are available in Canada, if they are it'll be a firearm as it is 625 fps. We'll see.
 
BMacT said:
Oh yeah, the Crosman 760 pump pneumatic. I've tried one of those and cannot stand the multiple pump process. What I'd like to try is their 1077 repeater, it's CO2 powered.
But I'm not sure if they are available in Canada, if they are it'll be a firearm as it is 625 fps. We'll see.
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The 1077 is available in Canada but as you mentioned, it is a firearm. No detuned models available. There are some older detuned models that come up for sale every now and then. The 1077 eats CO2's. I purchased the AirSource upgrade for mine and it is expensive to shoot.

You might be better off getting a Walmart break barrel just to see if they like it. TSC had their Ruger black hawks on sale. One of those would be a good starter too.
 
buying in the states

I bought from Pyramyd air ( awesome selection and prices) and had it shipped to a relative in the states I knew I was going to visit. Upon return, I declared everything and the only hassle I had was the fact that a couple of the pistols were borderline ''replicas" (they both look exactly like the real firearm!) and the guard said that although they were both under 500fps, replicas were prohibited?? Anyhow, he asked a few questions about how I was gonna use them and when I said plinking in the basement, he let me go with them.

Good luck!
 
in Alaska air guns air rifles and black powder are not firearms so us Canaian can get them but if thay are over 500fps thay you will have to regaster them in Canada
 
Just a side note, I don't know where in the spectrum of BB guns you're looking at is, but the Princess Auto flyer came in today (sale starts tomorrow) and it has a .177 BB gun in their Surplus section (page 9) for $33. 426fps, should be good for your grandson to 'try it out' without a lot of money. They never list brand names in their catalog, I don't know who makes this pistol.

Here's the link if you're interested. I'm gonna pick one up for back-yard can popping.
http://www.princessauto.com/images/stories/documents/E25_English.pdf
 
UPDATE: I ended up getting a Daisy 15XT (I think) CO2 powered pistol (1911 style) for $30.00 in the U.S. It is only 480 fps so technically not a firearm. When I came across the border, they asked what I spent, and what I spent it on. I started at the other end of the list and he basically got uninterested after the beer, hair trimmer and underwear, and told me to go ahead. :)
Anyway, it is just about exactly what I was after and it was about $20.00 cheaper than I've seen them here.
I also ordered a Crosman Raven from a local supplier so my grandsons can use it more comfortably than the normal sized one I have.
They really enjoy the plinking. They haven't seen the BB pistol yet, nor the Raven but I'll have them out soon for some SAFE fun.
 
when I bought a airpistol from a US maybe 7 years ago it got ciesed by the customs. (they said it was a replica and therefore prohibited device) I had to write an appeal and did get it back but it was a pain in the ass.
 
Glad you found something.

I bought the BB gun I mentioned from Princess, and I'm disappointed. Accuracy beyond 10 yards is minmal, and it's leaking CO2. I'm lucky to get 2 20-shot clips out of it, as it's leaking while I reload. It's going back.
 
Wendell said:
You still have to declare it. The CBSA agent will want to know whether it meets the Canadian definition of firearm. Keep the packaging to show the agent. You'll have no problem.
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I should have also said, "YMMV", because, in making the above statement, "You'll have no problem", I guess I jinxed myself. Just last week a CBSA agent deemed two of my .177cal BB pistols to be prohibited "replicas" and refused to allow them into the country.:kickInTheNuts:(The very same .177cal BB pistols can still be found on the shelf at mass retailers in Canada; she didn't care.)

So...YMMV.


Under U.S. federal law, an airgun is not a firearm. The only thing you'll need to check first are the laws of the respective state(s) and municipalities in which you will find yourself. That particular state, or that particular city, might expressly forbid it.


Check state and local laws.
Click to expand...

YMMV
 
Yeah, I have purchased several (7+) "replica" bb/pellet pistols from Canadian stores no problem. It may be slightly more expensive than US, but they all make it home with me.
eg: H&K USP - $45.99 from the big US online, $59.99 CDN online.
 
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