Antique Handgun - What Would You Reccomend?

[Clotho]

antiqueguy: is the inability to use the firearm frequently a function of it previously being used thoroughly, or purely it's age? If the former, would looking for one in superb, rather "un used," condition change this?

The inability to use the firearm as frequently as a modern firearm is primarily due to the inferior metal used in even the best antique firearms. The steel of that time doesn't even come close to the steel used today even if it looks similar on the surface. Since the metal isn't as strong the design of the frame is even more important if you want longevity. Break action revolvers are an inherently weaker design than solid frame revolvers.

At present, there is a window of opportunity to use these antiques without licence or permit.
The legislators didn't intend to create this opportunity; it is accidental. There was never the intent to make it legal to go armed with antique handguns.

Does anyone really think that it is going to last?

For that reason, I would not buy an expensive, altered revolver. The alterations may make it a better shooter. The firearm's value is as a licence free shooter. The alterations will also have permanently degraded its value as an antique.
When the situation changes, and it is no longer legal to go armed with an antique revolver, the value and desirability of these altered shooters will collapse.
Quality unaltered antiques will retain value, based on their merits as antiques.

So, look for pieces that have inherent value, not an inflated value based on a temporary situation.

^- This is excellent. I wish that everyone interested in antiques understood this.

Dingus would be the man to ask.

Without doubt, Dingus contributes to the board. He is also the primary source of altered Webley's. (See quote by Tiriaq) Understandably he knows a great deal about these. He recommends reloading for antiques which is excellent.

That being said, If you wanted an unbiased opinion on a car would you expect one from the Ford salesman?

 

[Brutus]

If you do not mind the slower rate of reloading and increased maintenance, the BP cap and ball six guns, or muzzleloading pistols (antique or modern manufacture) will really test your desire to get in touch with your historical side. The fringe benefit of replicas is reduced purchasing cost, although one becomes tied to a pistol range.

 

[The Kurgan]

Swiss; heck yeah ( the parts are numbered as to the order needed to dis-assemble IIRC),just underpowered of course. But you can't shoot any animals with it anyhow. marauding pop cans perhaps...French stuff has an excellent reputation; just under powered cartridges.

Hey, I take exception to that
100 grains going 900 fps would (and did) ruin anybody's day. Yes, the parts (both strawed and blued) are numbered. These guns were built with same care and precision as a Swiss watch of the time. The Swiss, like the Swedish, were decades ahead of the rest of the world in terms of metallurgy: these revolvers are solid and over-built. They're true gems and not many are out there. I highly recommend them.

I highly doubt the anti's will the change the status of unaltered, original antiques that shoot their intended cartridges... they have WAY larger "obstactles" to overcome first.
Having said that, shoot today and enjoy today, as you never know what tomorrow will bring. My old grade school friend recently passed away at the young age of 43! You never know.

 

[Clotho]

If you do not mind the slower rate of reloading and increased maintenance, the BP cap and ball six guns, or muzzleloading pistols (antique or modern manufacture) will really test your desire to get in touch with your historical side. The fringe benefit of replicas is reduced purchasing cost, although one becomes tied to a pistol range.

I am happy to recommend modern BP firearms to anyone that I think might appreciate them. Part of the fun of being able to shoot BP is doing it outdoors. I understand that not everyone has access to an outdoor range.
Shooting BP is a different animal. It can be a unique experience. The sound, the recoil, the thwump.. the smell. It is all very tactile. This coupled with the confidence in a proven design with greatly improved metal(urgy) makes for a very fine afternoon. It is perhaps a bit sad that this much fun is restricted in Canada by class.

Hey, I take exception to that
100 grains going 900 fps would (and did) ruin anybody's day. Yes, the parts (both strawed and blued) are numbered. These guns were built with same care and precision as a Swiss watch of the time. The Swiss, like the Swedish, were decades ahead of the rest of the world in terms of metallurgy: these revolvers are solid and over-built. They're true gems and not many are out there. I highly recommend them.

I highly doubt the anti's will the change the status of unaltered, original antiques that shoot their intended cartridges... they have WAY larger "obstacles" to overcome first.
Having said that, shoot today and enjoy today, as you never know what tomorrow will bring. My old grade school friend recently passed away at the young age of 43! You never know.

Sir, I agree with most of what you say and I grant you the caveat that I believe I am familiar with the particular 1892 you now have in your possession. It was one of a group of fine examples that I observed but I believe yours was the one with the exceptional holster. I regret that I didn't purchase it myself.

When you use the words "solid and over-built" I am inclined to think in terms of today, suggesting that they might be up to the task of modern pressures and loads. I believe you mean "solid and over-built" in terms of 1892 technology.

I am going to have to research the Swiss contribution to metalurgy now. I am familiar with the French contribution at the time but I didn't know the Swiss or the Swedish were even so prolific. There is no doubt that they were able to produce fine metal as attributed by their firearms. Where did you read about this first?

"I highly doubt the anti's will the change the status of unaltered, original antiques that shoot their intended cartridges."

Yes. You, Tiriaq, myself and many others all agree on this.

 

[jethunter]

Buy one in the US, way cheaper than the overpriced stuff here.

Actually this isn't really guaranteed like it was a few years back.

- US economy has picked up a lot, Americans are buying antique guns again and demand in the US is driving their prices up.

- Canadian dollar has dropped in value by close to 15% in the last year and a bit. By the time you pay priority shipping from the US and the exchange rate, there isn't nearly as much savings as there used to be.

- the worst part of buying from the US for me is that about 1/3 of the guns were received with problems and wear that was not accurately described by the original seller. It's a bit of a gamble. Finding a reputable dealer in the US helps. Generally speaking I trust the sellers here on CGN a lot more than I do the sellers in the US.

 

[The Kurgan]

I am going to have to research the Swiss contribution to metalurgy now. I am familiar with the French contribution at the time but I didn't know the Swiss or the Swedish were even so prolific. There is no doubt that they were able to produce fine metal as attributed by their firearms. Where did you read about this first?

I have former Unversity colleague, and gun nut who is the 'go to' on all things steel. I have not been in contact with him for several years, however, I will call him.
Basically, it has been rather well known that the Swedes, French, and later Swiss and Beligians, developed ordnance steels that were well ahead of the steels used by other nations just prior to the turn of the century. I would never, however, say that the steels used in the mid to late 1890's are superior to modern steels, but they are plenty strong enough to handle their intended cartridges. Fiocchi, up to 2012, made commercial ammo for the Swiss 1882 (and Swedish Nagants). They push 108 grain FMJ's 865 fps. Compare that to the BP military loads of the time: 108 grain FMJ's going 690 to 710 fps. So, if Fiocchi is confident in the stength of the Swiss 1882's and Swedish Nagants, I am also. I have never, ever, read of a Swiss 1882 grenading by using the modern Fiocchi loads. I spent months researching antique pistols prior to purchasing the Swiss 1882. I never regreted my purchase. However, as noted by others, they're not "hand cannons". Personally, my handloads are slightly more than twice as powerful as a typical 22LR, and that is exactly what I want for target shooting. One last comment I would like to make is that more often than not, Swiss 1882's regardless of their age, usually come with mirror perfect bores. I wonder why?

 

[Brutus]

^Seems I vaguely remember that Samuel Colt used Swedish developed silver steel (?) in at least the barrel section of his Colt 1860.

 

[Clotho]

I have former Unversity colleague, and gun nut who is the 'go to' on all things steel. I have not been in contact with him for several years, however, I will call him.
Basically, it has been rather well known that the Swedes, French, and later Swiss and Beligians, developed ordnance steels that were well ahead of the steels used by other nations just prior to the turn of the century. I would never, however, say that the steels used in the mid to late 1890's are superior to modern steels, but they are plenty strong enough to handle their intended cartridges. Fiocchi, up to 2012, made commercial ammo for the Swiss 1882 (and Swedish Nagants). They push 108 grain FMJ's 865 fps. Compare that to the BP military loads of the time: 108 grain FMJ's going 690 to 710 fps. So, if Fiocchi is confident in the stength of the Swiss 1882's and Swedish Nagants, I am also. I have never, ever, read of a Swiss 1882 grenading by using the modern Fiocchi loads. I spent months researching antique pistols prior to purchasing the Swiss 1882. I never regreted my purchase. However, as noted by others, they're not "hand cannons". Personally, my handloads are slightly more than twice as powerful as a typical 22LR, and that is exactly what I want for target shooting. One last comment I would like to make is that more often than not, Swiss 1882's regardless of their age, usually come with mirror perfect bores. I wonder why?

If you find out more from your friend then please share with us. I remember reading how the French had made great strides in metallurgy to the point that it became a military secret for some time. I had never heard this about any of the other nations but it is certainly possible.