Antique pistol use

atomicsauace

atomicsauace

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Got some questions about antique status pistols.Are they legal to use anywhere a longarm can be used or for hunting?What would be the best pistol to purchase if I didn't want to reload and wanted to be able to buy commercial ammo in a common cal.
 
Legal where non resticteds can be used.
So far no hunting although I don't know why. Will take a legal challenge I guess.
Learn to load, it's fun and it aint rocket science.
 
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Usually if the handgun is chambered in a commonly available cartridge, it's not a prescribed antique, although there are exceptions where its been rechambered. Some of the rechambered guns aren't going to be suitable for using commercial ammunition because its too high of pressure for a gun that was most likely made to burn black powder cartridges. As for hunting with it, you'd have to check your local hunting rules to see if its prohibited for that. Those laws would be provincial.
 
I beleive you can get 7.5 Swiss, 8mm Lebel and 455 Webley ammo from Fiocchi. None are terribly available or inexpensive. You really should consider reloading.
 
.44 Special, but Winchester Cowboy loads only, if you have $4500 for one of the "hot-rodded" Colt SAA that come up in the EE from time to time.
 
1892 Lebel 8mm service revolvers are as well made and modern in function as any gun you'll find. 90 gr 8mm bullets, .30-20 brass (cut to size) and a couple grains of Trail Boss and you're good to go. Work-a-day guns can be had for well under a grand$
 
Pete04 said:
Legal where non resticteds can be used.
So far no hunting although I don't know why. Will take a legal challenge I guess.
Learn to load, it's fun and it aint rocket science.
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Who says you can't hunt with a handgun? I have the letter from Ontario MNR saying its perfectly legal as long as it is possesed in accordance with federal law. Seeing as we can legally discharge antiques anywhere a long gun can be discharged, It is legal to hunt with an antique handgun in Ontario. I just don't own anything antique that's accurate enough to hunt with.....
 
tactical870 said:
Who says you can't hunt with a handgun? I have the letter from Ontario MNR saying its perfectly legal as long as it is possesed in accordance with federal law. Seeing as we can legally discharge antiques anywhere a long gun can be discharged, It is legal to hunt with an antique handgun in Ontario. I just don't own anything antique that's accurate enough to hunt with.....
Click to expand...

Maybe read my post before slagging me.
I said "I don't know why" I'm all for it but have not heard of anyone doing it so far. I believe it will result in a legal challenge. I don't hunt or I would. Besides I have my own legal battles as a "so called collector"
If all thats stopping you from hunting is a gun, I'll lend you a Webley. Should be as deadly and accurate as any crossbow at 30 yrds.
Let me know when and where for the exchange and good luck to you.
 
BC I believe defines its hunting rules by what may be used rather than what is prohibited, so we're out for antique hunting. Looks like they've specifically said no handguns in bc.
 
CeeZer said:
Are true antiques even considered to be a 'firearm' as per FA?
Click to expand...

legal antiques are not firearms in some situations and are firearms in others. In BC for example, it is illegal to hunt with a handgun so if you were caught hunting with an antique handgun it would be a modern firearm. If you were carrying it for bear protection or had it in camp for target practice, it would be an antique. It the hunting example, the burden of proof would be on the possessor as to whether or not he/she was not hunting if you were checked in the bush during hunting season while carrying the antique handgun.
To clarify my first statement, antiques become firearms when used in a crime. In practical terms they are also modern when it comes to display and storage. They are not firearms for licensing and registration

cheers mooncoon
 
Mooncoon, I don't think antiques are subject to the same storage laws as modern firearms. They only need to be stored unloaded, and when transported there are additional rules (from RCMP CFC):

Safety Regulations
Under the Firearms Act, antique firearms must be stored, displayed and transported unloaded.

If you are transporting your antique firearms and need to leave them unattended*, leave them in your vehicle’s locked trunk or similar compartment. If your vehicle does not have a trunk or compartment, lock the vehicle and leave the antique firearms inside and out of sight.

Antique handguns must be locked in a heavy-duty, non-see-through container that cannot be easily broken open during transportation.

* Unattended means a vehicle that is not under the direct and immediate supervision of an adult (18 years of age or older) or a minor (with a minor’s licence).
 
Grizzlypeg said:
Mooncoon, I don't think antiques are subject to the same storage laws as modern firearms. They only need to be stored unloaded, and when transported there are additional rules (from RCMP CFC):
Click to expand...

That is why I qualified my statement with "in practical terms". There are differences but to cover your bum, you would be wise to store them the same as any other gun or certainly any other long gun. To me the question is not what is legal if you are prepared to go to court and pay major legal expenses, it is what is practical in not going to court in the first place while still enjoying the relative freedom of owning the antique.

cheers mooncoon
 
I have thought about adding a repro should stock to one of my original cap/ball revolvers for muzzle loading deer season. Perhaps add a long barrel too.
I will look into this.
Good post!
 
one more time:

Regulations Prescribing Antique Firearms

SOR/98-464

CRIMINAL CODE

His Excellency the Governor General in Council, on the recommendation of the Minister of Justice, pursuant to the definitions “prescribed”a and “antique firearm”a in subsection 84(1) and to subsection 117.15(1)a of the Criminal Code, hereby makes the annexed Regulations Prescribing Antique Firearms.

a S.C. 1995, c. 39, s. 139

Registration September 16, 1998

REGULATIONS PRESCRIBING ANTIQUE FIREARMS

PRESCRIPTION

1. The firearms listed in the schedule are antique firearms for the purposes of paragraph (b) of the definition “antique firearm” in subsection 84(1) of the Criminal Code.

COMING INTO FORCE

2. These Regulations come into force on December 1, 1998.

SOR/98-472, s. 3.

SCHEDULE

(Section 1)

BLACK POWDER REPRODUCTIONS

1. A reproduction of a flintlock, wheel-lock or matchlock firearm, other than a handgun, manufactured after 1897.

RIFLES

2. A rifle manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges.

3. A rifle manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging centre-fire cartridges, whether with a smooth or rifled bore, having a bore diameter of 8.3 mm or greater, measured from land to land in the case of a rifled bore, with the exception of a repeating firearm fed by any type of cartridge magazine.

SHOTGUNS

4. A shotgun manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges.

5. A shotgun manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging centre-fire cartridges, other than 10, 12, 16, 20, 28 or 410 gauge cartridges.

HANDGUNS

6. A handgun manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges.

7. A handgun manufactured before 1898 that is capable of discharging centre-fire cartridges, other than a handgun designed or adapted to discharge 32 Short Colt, 32 Long Colt, 32 Smith and Wesson, 32 Smith and Wesson Long, 32-20 Winchester, 38 Smith and Wesson, 38 Short Colt, 38 Long Colt, 38-40 Winchester, 44-40 Winchester, or 45 Colt cartridges.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Under the current legislation, "any antique firearm" is not a "firearm" for the following purposes:

1. Firearms Act: None of the provisions of the Firearms Act, including those requiring registration, licences, ATTs and/or ATCs, apply to any "antique firearm."

2. CC s. 91 and 92: Possession of any "antique firearm" without a licence or registration certificate is legal.

3. CC s. 93: Possession of any "antique firearm" at any location is legal.


4. CC s. 94: Being in a motor vehicle with any "antique firearm" is legal.


5. CC s. 95: Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" (which is also a "restricted firearm" or a "prohibited firearm"), or one with readily accessible ammunition is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.

6. CC s. 99: Transferring or offering to transfer any "antique firearm" is legal.

7. CC s. 100: Dealing in any type of any "antique firearm" is legal.

8. CC s. 101: Transferring any "antique firearm" is legal if the transfer apparently violates the Firearms Act.

9. CC s. 103 and 104: Importing or exporting any "antique firearm" is legal.

10. CC s. 105: Not reporting the loss or finding of any "antique firearm" is legal.

11. CC s. 106 and 107: Not reporting the destruction of any "antique firearm" is legal, and knowingly making a false report of that type to a firearms official or the police is legal.

12. CC s. 117.03: A peace officer who finds a person in possession of any "antique firearm" is not authorized to demand that the person present a licence, registration certificate, ATT, and/or ATC.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------



ANTIQUE FIREARMS-storage,transport,display




14. (1) An individual may store, display or transport an antique firearm only if it is unloaded.


(2) An individual may transport an antique firearm in an unattended vehicle only if


(a) when the vehicle is equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is in that trunk or compartment and the trunk or compartment is securely locked; and



(b) when the vehicle is not equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is not visible from outside the vehicle and the vehicle, or the part that contains the antique firearm, is securely locked.



(3) An individual may transport an antique firearm that is a handgun only if it is in a locked container that is made of an opaque material and is of such strength, construction and nature that it cannot readily be broken open or into or accidentally opened during transportation.
 
Pete04 said:
Maybe read my post before slagging me.
I said "I don't know why" I'm all for it but have not heard of anyone doing it so far. I believe it will result in a legal challenge. I don't hunt or I would. Besides I have my own legal battles as a "so called collector"
If all thats stopping you from hunting is a gun, I'll lend you a Webley. Should be as deadly and accurate as any crossbow at 30 yrds.
Let me know when and where for the exchange and good luck to you.
Click to expand...

I didn't mean to offend you. I believe you are 100% right that it would result in a legal challenge if the wrong officer or CO happened upon you in the field. I already own a Webley MKII but don't feel comfortable with it as a hunting gun as accuracy is less than ideal at 20 yards. I'll build a custom antique rolling block pistol before attempting to hunt.

BTW I have already notified my local CO and he agrees that it's not illegal but would probably get me in hot water if the wrong cop stopped me....
 
"...It is legal to hunt with an antique handgun..." Isn't legal to hunt with any handgun other than a sub-500fps air pistol in Ontario.
 
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