Anyone have more info on this Hopkins and Allen XL no.3?

[Tyockell18]

Hey guys,

I have this Hopkins and Allen XL no. 3 NY. It's in .32rimfire but only has the 1.5 inch barrel.

I have never seen another one, nor pictures of them and can't seem to find any information on productions numbers or if it was even an available option.

The barrel looks like factory original. If someone did do a custom cut job on it, it looks identical to original both sight and crown wise.

Anyone know anything of interest on this gun?.

 

[NorthCoastBigBore]

According to Webster ("Suicide Specials" pages 134-35), the XL No.3 came standard with a 2 5/8" barrel so yes, it suggests a special order. The No.4 (in .38 RF) shows standard barrel lengths starting at 1.5" and that is the only model listed as coming standard with the 1.5". Interesting piece for sure.

"...The frame may be either flat or round sided; either type has a removable sideplate on the left. The front sight is a brass half-disc blade, the rear sight a raised, notched lip in the topstrap. The cylinder is the safety type, fluted with the locking notches in the rear..." Some other miscellaneous info (rifling, safety, grips, trademarks etc), I can put up the rest if you want.

NCBB

 

[Tyockell18]

According to Webster ("Suicide Specials" pages 134-35), the XL No.3 came standard with a 2 5/8" barrel so yes, it suggests a special order. The No.4 (in .38 RF) shows standard barrel lengths starting at 1.5" and that is the only model listed as coming standard with the 1.5". Interesting piece for sure.

"...The frame may be either flat or round sided; either type has a removable sideplate on the left. The front sight is a brass half-disc blade, the rear sight a raised, notched lip in the topstrap. The cylinder is the safety type, fluted with the locking notches in the rear..." Some other miscellaneous info (rifling, safety, grips, trademarks etc), I can put up the rest if you want.

NCBB

Hmm, ok thanks for the info. I figured as much really, only ever saw the .38 RF's in this barrel length.

Interesting, I guess she is a special ordered gun then.

I think I'll take her out for a test fire next weekend, it works perfectly. The bore is still almost pristine as well, although it probably groups like a shotgun anyways lol!

 

[dingus]

There very well made guns thats a rare barrel length for sure. I have a very rare H&A XL No 6 in 41 RF with a cylinder on a crane that flips open to reload like a french 1892, its a very rare gun they sell for over $1500 in the USA.
alot of H&A are very collectable yours falls into that group, nice score.

 

[NorthCoastBigBore]

There very well made guns thats a rare barrel length for sure. I have a very rare H&A XL No 6 in 41 RF with a cylinder on a crane that flips open to reload like a french 1892, its a very rare gun they sell for over $1500 in the USA.
alot of H&A are very collectable yours falls into that group, nice score.

Agreed, H&A has a real collector following. And interestingly enough, H&A, Numrich Arms and Hood Firearms Co. (and a couple others IIRC - all based in Numrich during the time) had a lot of interrelation in terms of the people who started/operated/managed them. Somewhere I have a couple pages of research I dug up, mostly found by reading up on Norwich Ct itself. By way of example, Charles A Converse, one of the four founders of Hopkins & Allen, was also one of the first shareholders of Hood Firearms Co. (and IIRC a few others). From what I can tell I think Converse was primarily providing financing but the link is there and it is substantial as he is held out as being more than just a shareholder; and the guys working in the shops also bounced around a lot. He sold his share of H&A to Merwin & Hulbert which led to that relationship between H&A, and M&H. Interesting reading, I think it was a neat place to be around (and in that booming industry) back in the 1870's.

A lot of those guys involved in the industry had a lot of neat ideas and came up some very interesting one-offs that never really took off (or, like the swing-out cylinder Dingus mentions, took off but in other venues/with other companies). H&A had some ingenuity for sure. Some ideas didn't make it into production but you can find them in the many, many patents registered by the owners/shareholders/operators of these companies.