APC223-SA Final specifications - place your order now.

Mr Wolverine said:
I would have to ask, I would think it highly unlikely if the bolt head had to change. What did you have in mind? Remember we will see a .308 next year.
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450 Bushmaster and 30 Remington AR, Herron Arms is currently building me a bolt head for the ACR that will work on both cartridges as the rim size is very close and the 284 win was the parent cartridge for both designs

308 will be a larger/heavier rifle I would have to assume? Deters from the ability to carry it for hunting just like the XCR M
 
cwblackwell88 said:
What!!
IMG_4241.jpg
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Impressive...I am betting it will be around $4k... :( ...do you have monthly payments available? :)
 
Mr Wolverine said:
Accuracy results, I have just learnt that our sample rifle is fitted with a 1:10 twist that explains why our best groups were with the lighter bullets.

The 477 mm production guns will be 1:9

The short restricted models will be 1:7
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Mr. Wolverine,

The only obstacle preventing me from placing the order is the barrel. I might be in minority, but ideal configuration for me would be using the original B&T barrel specification but in non-restricted length. That would be cold hammer forged barrel with the 1 in 7 twist. I'm aware of pros and cons, but I also believe, that B&T engineers put a lot of thought into their original barrel decision. Here is what the APC 223 PDF on their website says: “The hammer forged barrel is designed for optimal transitional ballistics and long barrel life. This 1 in 7'' twist rate is the best all-around for many different loads and bullet weights.” Those may be just nice words common in promotional materials, but I actually like long life expectancy of cold hammer forged barrels – I want it to last for ages. Many might find it economically unreasonable, but I like playing with heavier 75 or 77 grain ammo and want the barrel to have optimal performance with those heavier bullets – it's a technological hobby. I also like keeping my toys according to their original design specification as much as it is possible in our Canadian context – I believe many of us have that collector's interest, especially when it applies to expensive hi-end products.

As I mentioned, I realize, that I might be in minority, but I believe I'm not the only one. Since this magical number of 20 came up recently, it would be really interesting to estimate if there is enough interest for such configuration, if it's feasible. Maybe we could run a poll?

I realize, that it might take longer than the already confirmed configuration with the 1 in 9 twist. But I would be still willing to wait another 6 months for another batch with non-restricted barrels of original specification and would gladly place an order if such configuration is confirmed.

I apologize if I'm making it overly complicated and thank you for making this huge effort to bring this rifle to Canada!
 
monahov said:
Mr. Wolverine,

The only obstacle preventing me from placing the order is the barrel. I might be in minority, but ideal configuration for me would be using the original B&T barrel specification but in non-restricted length. That would be cold hammer forged barrel with the 1 in 7 twist. I'm aware of pros and cons, but I also believe, that B&T engineers put a lot of thought into their original barrel decision. Here is what the APC 223 PDF on their website says: “The hammer forged barrel is designed for optimal transitional ballistics and long barrel life. This 1 in 7'' twist rate is the best all-around for many different loads and bullet weights.” Those may be just nice words common in promotional materials, but I actually like long life expectancy of cold hammer forged barrels – I want it to last for ages. Many might find it economically unreasonable, but I like playing with heavier 75 or 77 grain ammo and want the barrel to have optimal performance with those heavier bullets – it's a technological hobby. I also like keeping my toys according to their original design specification as much as it is possible in our Canadian context – I believe many of us have that collector's interest, especially when it applies to expensive hi-end products.

As I mentioned, I realize, that I might be in minority, but I believe I'm not the only one. Since this magical number of 20 came up recently, it would be really interesting to estimate if there is enough interest for such configuration, if it's feasible. Maybe we could run a poll?

I realize, that it might take longer than the already confirmed configuration with the 1 in 9 twist. But I would be still willing to wait another 6 months for another batch with non-restricted barrels of original specification and would gladly place an order if such configuration is confirmed.

I apologize if I'm making it overly complicated and thank you for making this huge effort to bring this rifle to Canada!
Click to expand...

We would be happy to look into this, but no promises on the outcome. Thanks for your input.
 
My only concern with this gun is the stock.

With the long barrel the APC will be front heavy and not so fun to shoot off hand.

In the NR configuration i see the APC like a medium to long range semi auto. The Lothar Walther barrel are top notch quality and i'm sure the accuracy will be awesome. You really have to borescope a Lothar Walther to see the finish in these barrels.

The stock will be to low to have a good cheek weld like the Swiss arms.
 
monahov said:
Mr. Wolverine,

The only obstacle preventing me from placing the order is the barrel. I might be in minority, but ideal configuration for me would be using the original B&T barrel specification but in non-restricted length. That would be cold hammer forged barrel with the 1 in 7 twist. I'm aware of pros and cons, but I also believe, that B&T engineers put a lot of thought into their original barrel decision. Here is what the APC 223 PDF on their website says: “The hammer forged barrel is designed for optimal transitional ballistics and long barrel life. This 1 in 7'' twist rate is the best all-around for many different loads and bullet weights.” Those may be just nice words common in promotional materials, but I actually like long life expectancy of cold hammer forged barrels – I want it to last for ages. Many might find it economically unreasonable, but I like playing with heavier 75 or 77 grain ammo and want the barrel to have optimal performance with those heavier bullets – it's a technological hobby. I also like keeping my toys according to their original design specification as much as it is possible in our Canadian context – I believe many of us have that collector's interest, especially when it applies to expensive hi-end products.

As I mentioned, I realize, that I might be in minority, but I believe I'm not the only one. Since this magical number of 20 came up recently, it would be really interesting to estimate if there is enough interest for such configuration, if it's feasible. Maybe we could run a poll?

I realize, that it might take longer than the already confirmed configuration with the 1 in 9 twist. But I would be still willing to wait another 6 months for another batch with non-restricted barrels of original specification and would gladly place an order if such configuration is confirmed.

I apologize if I'm making it overly complicated and thank you for making this huge effort to bring this rifle to Canada!
Click to expand...

Well stated, and you are not alone.

As a lefty, I'm also concerned with putting my cheek on a non-adjustible stock that could see one eating the stock hinge ala G36.
https://www.bt-ag.ch/shop/eng/schul...oldableretractable-polymer-to-bt-apc-and-gl06
B&T have the stocks and adapters for their guns, so it seems sensible to be able to order it set up in the optimal configuration for each shooter, especially when you consider the cost and considerable effort to get these here.
 
beltfed said:
Well stated, and you are not alone.

As a lefty, I'm also concerned with putting my cheek on a non-adjustible stock that could see one eating the stock hinge ala G36.
https://www.bt-ag.ch/shop/eng/schul...oldableretractable-polymer-to-bt-apc-and-gl06
B&T have the stocks and adapters for their guns, so it seems sensible to be able to order it set up in the optimal configuration for each shooter, especially when you consider the cost and considerable effort to get these here.
Click to expand...

Still too low for optic. looks like cheek riser is needed regardless of the stock style.
https://www.bt-ag.ch/shop/eng/schul...-the-lenght-adjustable-and-foldable-apc-stock
 
This is better, this a B&T adapter, it needs a little tweaking but I like it. Now I have a really good cheek weld. LOP is good, I can bring the scope back a little to get correct eye relief. Balance is also much improved but weight is 12.5 lb. we will also swap the cheek piece for that for the AR10 and she will be even better.



Firstly the adapter is OEM, it was designed for a different application but it allowed us to test the concept. You all need to remember that we have taken a firearm that was originally designed as an Advanced Police Carbine (APC) and turned it to a "varmint" rifle so naturally we want to mount large optics, this raises the sight line. I appreciate a correct cheek weld more than most, so I have asked B&T to price the design and manufacture of an adapter that will securely accept any AR15 buffer tube, I have also requested that the tube be raised approx. 18 mm, I think this will allow for a large range of optics to be used and the greatest number of stocks. My rifle in the photo has a 50 mm Obj scope and it is mounted so low that the lens caps will no longer fit, as shown she is set up perfect for me, yet we could adjust the scope up a little and raise or lower the cheek rest according to the shooters requirements. The original stock is fine for an aimpoint which is what it was designed for.

I am looking into different barrel twist, the first shipment will be 1:9, if I want 1;8 I would have to order 100, I am not doing that, I am looking into 1:7 twist, will report back when I have news.
 
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