ATRS Modern hunter specs, pics and range reports

cr5 said:
http://www.accuracy-tech.com/long-range-shooting-with-semi-auto/

Decent read on load selection for gas operated 6.5 and shooting techniques for semi auto accuracy
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Speaking from my own experience with Semi-Auto precision rifles I would agree 100% with the article. The major flaw to finding accuracy that everybody overlooks is the shooter himself. The DI rifle is totally different then a bolt gun (many fluff this off as pure folly) with all of the items the author points out as the DI gun will outperform the average inexperienced shooter by a mile. Practice...Practice and understanding how the action can influence the accuracy is very important. Just having proper consistent positioning and a sound controlled hold on a DI rifle can alter the flight of a projectile from shot to shot.

Great post as this may be some of the issues experienced with a number of new MV/H owners.
 
ATRS Shaun said:
That was a good read, thank's for sharing.
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I'm going to use the chrony with my load development after reading the article on that site about reloading for accuracy. They have a few interesting articles on the site.


Sqr said:
Speaking from my own experience with Semi-Auto precision rifles I would agree 100% with the article. The major flaw to finding accuracy that everybody overlooks is the shooter himself. The DI rifle is totally different then a bolt gun (many fluff this off as pure folly) with all of the items the author points out as the DI gun will outperform the average inexperienced shooter by a mile. Practice...Practice and understanding how the action can influence the accuracy is very important. Just having proper consistent positioning and a sound controlled hold on a DI rifle can alter the flight of a projectile from shot to shot.

Great post as this may be some of the issues experienced with a number of new MV/H owners.
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I have a feeling it's a bigger reason than most realize when it comes to accuracy with a semi auto.
 
cr5 said:
I'm going to use the chrony with my load development after reading the article on that site about reloading for accuracy. They have a few interesting articles on the site.




I have a feeling it's a bigger reason than most realize when it comes to accuracy with a semi auto.
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I know for me, I came from a precision bolt action perspective and the Modern Hunter was my first precision semi-auto. I had a hell of a learning curve in the reloading side of it, and also a lot of experience to gain in shooting it.

I didn't just whip up some magical loads and have success in a day, it was frustrating and painstaking in contrast to load development on any of my bolt actions. On two separate occasions I wound up with a bullet jammed into the lands and powder all through the action because of my reloading error, one of which was 6 rounds in after driving all the way out to Rocky Mountain House... I've tried a taper crimp, roll crimp, and factory crimps and in the end I've settled on an extra step through my Redding Type S match neck bushing sizing die (after I use the small base die) with a smaller than usual bushing to get the neck tension that will keep the bullet in place with the tremendous force the AR10 bolt carrier generates.

In total it probably took me nearly 3 months getting out almost every weekend to get most of the details settled on my reloads. Thank god for Gold Medal Match mixed in there to keep my sanity.

And all through that load development ... I got practice behind the gas system. I'm not about to be setting any records, but I do half descent, and I know "the process" has improved my skills as a shooter.
 
M16LR.50 said:
regarding buffer weight... is a heavier buffer really required?
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Do you feel the carrier hitting your shoulder as it bottoms out in the buffer tube?
The only way to really tell is to try a heavier buffer or spring (only change one thing at a time) and if it still cycles correctly you're good. An adjustable gas block is a better way to control it if you feel your rifle is overgassed for the ammo you are using.
 
So I did a little more loading and testing today, 35 rounds and one FTF which was another bolt over cartridge which is probably a magazine problem, I set that one to the side and will keep a record of which mags have issues. Seems to work fine with the JP silent captured buffer system with the heavy spring.
Best load was 43.1gr of H100V under a 129gr SST which made a 3 shot 0.5 moa group but when I made 5 more to test again it did 1.9moa, 3 went into 0.6moa but 2 wandered off. I blame myself for the crappy 5 shot group and will be making more of these for further testing. ES on the five was 16fps and were just over 2700fps MV.
Loaded up to 44gr but those had a little more primer flow around the firing pin dimple so stopped increasing charge.

As a side note the charging handle stayed locked forward except for one string of higher charge loads.

Gave it a good cleaning and lube so it's ready for the next outing.

Disclaimer, I am posting powder charges for my results with my 6.5 Creedmoor Modern Hunter. I can not guarantee these loads are safe in your rifle so work up carefully checking for signs of pressure as you go. I accept no responsibility for damage or injury if you copy these loads and use them in your rifle.
 
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I have to say your posts and testing criteria are the best I have seen. Love your data driven approach and how the data drives your descion making. I am building a 6.5 creedmoor and have been going back and fourth between bolt and AR. I have used your site and data to help guide me through the process. Thank you for all the good info, your site really helped me get comfortable trying to get into prescion shooting and informed me of what I was getting myself into.
 
cr5 said:
So I did a little more loading and testing today, 35 rounds and one FTF which was another bolt over cartridge which is probably a magazine problem, I set that one to the side and will keep a record of which mags have issues. Seems to work fine with the JP silent captured buffer system with the heavy spring.
Best load was 43.1gr of H100V under a 129gr SST which made a 3 shot 0.5 moa group but when I made 5 more to test again it did 1.9moa, 3 went into 0.6moa but 2 wandered off. I blame myself for the crappy 5 shot group and will be making more of these for further testing. ES on the five was 16fps and were just over 2700fps MV.
Loaded up to 44gr but those had a little more primer flow around the firing pin dimple so stopped increasing charge.

As a side note the charging handle stayed locked forward except for one string of higher charge loads.

Gave it a good cleaning and lube so it's ready for the next outing.

Disclaimer, I am posting powder charges for my results with my 6.5 Creedmoor Modern Hunter. I can not guarantee these loads are safe in your rifle so work up carefully checking for signs of pressure as you go. I accept no responsibility for damage or injury if you copy these loads and use them in your rifle.
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Has any MH/V owner tried an alternate buffer system from the JP Silent Captured System? I have found that my AR rifle gas system cycling varies from load setup to load setup with the JP. The silent system is tuneable with the number of weights and spring options but it can be time consuming to find the correct setup.
 
Sqr said:
Has any MH/V owner tried an alternate buffer system from the JP Silent Captured System? I have found that my AR rifle gas system cycling varies from load setup to load setup with the JP. The silent system is tuneable with the number of weights and spring options but it can be time consuming to find the correct setup.
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I wouldn't spend too much time on the buffer system as long as it's cycling reliably. Once you settle on a load you can spend some time fine tuning it. Pretty much just keep going heavier till it stops cycling then go back till it's reliable again, go back a couple steps to make sure it cycles in the field if your shooting from a little less than ideal position and you don't have your shoulder behind it nicely.
It won't change the accuracy or anything like that, all you're doing is making it run smoother by balancing the recoil system to force exerted on the carrier by the gas system. You will notice a smoother recoil and it won't be beating up the action as much.
As I said earlier though, if you feel you need to add a bunch of weight and increased spring rates an adjustable gas block would be a better way to get things under control. The JP captured system is more for fine tuning and not really for hiding the fact the rifle is severely over gassed.
I think I'll be looking into adding an adjustable gas block to mine down the road. I'm not sure it actually needs it but it isn't overly expensive and after owning my KelTek RFB and seeing how it can let you tune to shoot any load smoothly I like the idea of having one.
I eventually plan to have a light varminting load, a mid weight coyote load and a heavier hunting/long range load. This is one of the reasons I started with the 129gr instead of going heavy with a 140gr, if I find a nice load for the 129gr it will cover all bases for a while and let me move onto load development for one of my other rifles.
 
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Hit the range today with my freshly installed Proof research barrel (thanks Shaun). Disclaimer: shot at 40 yards at Pheonix Range, no rear rest, rubber block front rest. Not every pull was perfect, more than a couple errors on my part. I'm sure this makes all the data worthless but I am more than happy, plus it was a lot of fun. I tried to focus on ammo meant for this type of platform but had 10 rounds of Norma match left in the safe so it snuck in there. Can't wait to stretch the legs at some distance, the balance was substantially improved with the carbon fibre barrel. It's definely lighter, after 20 or so rounds I went to the gun counter and grabbed myself an enhanced rubber butt pad for the UBR.

Targets are 1" square graph paper.

5 round groups except the single group which was 10rds, moderate pace, no cool down between shots, couple minutes between groups.

Ammo used:
Hornady Black 155 and 168gr AMAX
Norma BTHP Match 168gr
Federal Fusion MSR 150gr
168gr A-Max and IMR 4895 S&B primers handloads loaded for old barrel, will be starting a new workup as they were a little hot in the new barrel.

In my estimation the 155 gr Hornady Black was the best shooter and would be worth trying if you are looking for factory ammo ($37-box).







 
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Uisge said:
Hit the range today with my freshly installed Proof research barrel (thanks Shaun). Disclaimer: shot at 40 yards at Pheonix Range, no rear rest, rubber block front rest. Not every pull was perfect, more than a couple errors on my part. I'm sure this makes all the data worthless but I am more than happy, plus it was a lot of fun. I tried to focus on ammo meant for this type of platform but had 10 rounds of Norma match left in the safe so it snuck in there. Can't wait to stretch the legs at some distance, the balance was substantially improved with the carbon fibre barrel. It's definely lighter, after 20 or so rounds I went to the gun counter and grabbed myself an enhanced rubber butt pad for the UBR.

Targets are 1" square graph paper.

5 round groups except the single group which was 10rds, moderate pace, no cool down between shots, couple minutes between groups.

Ammo used:
Hornady Black 155 and 168gr AMAX
Norma BTHP Match 168gr
Federal Fusion MSR 150gr
168gr A-Max and IMR 4895 S&B primers handloads loaded for old barrel, will be starting a new workup as they were a little hot in the new barrel.

In my estimation the 155 gr Hornady Black was the best shooter and would be worth trying if you are looking for factory ammo ($37-box).







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Thought I read that the UBR wouldn't work on a MH, glad to see that is not correct and I may have to put mine on and see how I like it.

I'm also going to throw a big thanks out to ATRS, I went in on Monday morning with my rifle and they were able to fit me in and smooth out the back side of the barrel extension lugs so they don't scrape up my brass as badly on ejection any more and they also polished up the feed ramps for me. Great service squeezing in an out of town customer to save me from having to drive 4 hours each way to come pick it up at a later date.

As soon as the weather gets a little better I'll be doing some more load testing (maybe tomorrow) :p
 
The UBR works but requires a little file work. Nothing major just take it down until the slide doesn't hit the stock. I left mine so it just touches the stock when all the way back, it's slowly wearing a little groove in what's left. And that's a great idea, I noticed the lug scratches as well. And I second that, they fit me in on short notice as well for the barrel swap. Can't wait for that 6.5 Grendel Varmint! Gotta get some guns sold!
 
Uisge said:
The UBR works but requires a little file work. Nothing major just take it down until the slide doesn't hit the stock. I left mine so it just touches the stock when all the way back, it's slowly wearing a little groove in what's left. And that's a great idea, I noticed the lug scratches as well. And I second that, they fit me in on short notice as well for the barrel swap. Can't wait for that 6.5 Grendel Varmint! Gotta get some guns sold!
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If mine was in 308 the scratches would bother me less since I have sooooooo much 308 brass but 6.5cm is kinda pricey for brass. I can't afford to replace it every couple loadings.
Once they release the MV 6.5 grendel version I may have to sell my ACR to fund a MV in 223 with a second upper in 6.5. Maybe once my Cadex sells I'll use the money from that towards a MV :)
Decisions decisions, what to sell to pay for the new toys.
 
cr5 said:
If mine was in 308 the scratches would bother me less since I have sooooooo much 308 brass but 6.5cm is kinda pricey for brass. I can't afford to replace it every couple loadings.
Once they release the MV 6.5 grendel version I may have to sell my ACR to fund a MV in 223 with a second upper in 6.5. Maybe once my Cadex sells I'll use the money from that towards a MV :)
Decisions decisions, what to sell to pay for the new toys.
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All this hype around the mv in 6.5 grendel really got me looking at this seriously. It would be a great hunting combo for our retarded NB hunting regs, since you can't target shoot or carry a rifle in the wild anywhere except at a range or in the wild with a hunting license. Since Varmint hunting is almost year round it makes sence but the problem with that is only .22 and down cartrige are alowed for varmint (.22lr,.223, 222, 22-250, etc).

So with that my 223 upper would be great for varmint and a 6.5 gren. Would be awsome for dear!
 
Prepped 50 pieces of brass and put together another 10 rounds of 43.1gr Hybrid 100V under 129 SST's. Hopefully be able to get out of the house tomorrow to test them and see if the work ATRS did on the barrel extension helps my brass.
 
Did some more testing today, 43.1gr of Hybrid 100V still doing ok but decided to try Varget.
All test loads shot well but the best was a 3 shot group of 38gr which gave 0.7 moa. I went up to 38.2gr which is book max in my Hornady manual with no pressure signs and since ATRS worked their magic on my barrel extension my brass is much happier.
I'll be making more with 38gr of varget for further testing, velocity was about 50fps slower than with Hybrid but depending on the next round of testing I can live with a couple more clicks of elevation correction. Another big plus is that I have close to 15 pounds of varget in the cabinet :)

6.5 Creedmoor, 129gr SST, Federal 210M primers, Hornady brass.
 
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