ATRS MODERN SPORTER piston ?

I can't be of much help on the topic because I've never laid hands on the Superlative piston kit but I did see an SLR posted somewhere (maybe MDI's Instagram?) that was built using the kit.
 
cr5 said:
Why do you want a piston system on a rifle designed to be DI?

What improvements do you expect so see?

A piston system, in my opinion is superior. Hence the reason majority of modern new rifles are piston. Secondly the new improvements companies are making with AR platforms with piston systems is awesome. HK, SIG,pws. Etc.
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XperienceDUDE said:
Why not
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Well I can't think of any better reason than that.

Go for it and be sure to post pics when you're done.


90vette said:
A piston system, in my opinion is superior. Hence the reason majority of modern new rifles are piston. Secondly the new improvements companies are making with AR platforms with piston systems is awesome. HK, SIG,pws. Etc.
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I've owned 2 PWS piston rifles, they didn't do anything my DI rifles couldn't do. They're heavier, they're more expensive, they use proprietary parts making it difficult to source parts, especially a few years down the road when the company has moved onto the next latest greatest way to part us with our money or has gone out of business.

It's a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
Retro fitting is never as good as a rifle designed to be piston driven. My opinion is that if you want a piston driven rifle buy one but don't try to turn something else into one.

I'm sure the Superlative system is a good one but is it going to make the rifle shoot better? Is it going to make it more accurate? What advantage does it have? My piston driven rifles and my DI rifles all shoot more rounds between cleaning than I care to put through them.
Aside from costing as much as 1000 rounds of ammo or a training course which will actually make you a better shooter what improvement should someone expect to see?
 
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They are great when you suppress full auto guns :) Thats why people want them. They add ZERO value for Canadian gunnies.
 
90vette said:
cr5 said:
Why do you want a piston system on a rifle designed to be DI?

What improvements do you expect so see?

A piston system, in my opinion is superior. Hence the reason majority of modern new rifles are piston. Secondly the new improvements companies are making with AR platforms with piston systems is awesome. HK, SIG,pws. Etc.
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You do realize something like the Hk416(sorry as far as piston ARs go this is the only one I have any serious experience with) was developed extensively and utilizes a proprietary bcg. Comparing that to some conversion kit is deeply ignorant.

And its biggest advantage of something like the 416 is short barrelled and suppressed especially in full auto. From an ergonomic standpoint something like a 416 diverts a lot of gas away from your face compared to the di guns which makes it easier to shoot for extended duration. So on a 20 inch or 18.6 inch gun that will never see a suppressor you are gaining nothing but weight. And that isn't an opinion, it is a fact.

You want it to be different, cool, go nuts, but don't pretend it will give you anything a di gun will, because it won't and usually the conversion kits perform worse than the di guns or the dedicated piston designs like the 416 or a pws.
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r34skyline said:
You do realize something like the Hk416(sorry as far as piston ARs go this is the only one I have any serious experience with) was developed extensively and utilizes a proprietary bcg. Comparing that to some conversion kit is deeply ignorant.

And its biggest advantage of something like the 416 is short barrelled and suppressed especially in full auto. From an ergonomic standpoint something like a 416 diverts a lot of gas away from your face compared to the di guns which makes it easier to shoot for extended duration. So on a 20 inch or 18.6 inch gun that will never see a suppressor you are gaining nothing but weight. And that isn't an opinion, it is a fact.

You want it to be different, cool, go nuts, but don't pretend it will give you anything a di gun will, because it won't and usually the conversion kits perform worse than the di guns or the dedicated piston designs like the 416 or a pws.
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I never compared your precious HK to a conversion. That rifle was reengineering by HK to be a piston operated rifle.
It still offers nothing over a DI rifle other than bragging rights to a Canadian shooter.
Heavier, more expensive, harder to source parts.
HK makes fantastic rifles but unless your military or law enforcement and using it where people are shooting back at you I see no justification to spend that much money unless you just have lots of cash and want one.
I'm in no way saying there's anything wrong with the HK or that they aren't a better product, only that as a civilian shooter in Canada there is no advantage to shooting one over any other quality rifle.
 
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Is it just me or is one of you guys screwing up the reply with quote?
I'm not sure who I'm replying to anymore.
I think I fixed it in my reply


Anyway, OP.
If you want a piston kit on your rifle go for it. I'm just not sure what gains you expect to see after spending the money and think a training course or a 1000 rounds of ammo would go further towards seeing improvements on target downrange.
 
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cr5 said:
Is it just me or is one of you guys screwing up the reply with quote?
I'm not sure who I'm replying to anymore.
I think I fixed it in my reply


Anyway, OP.
If you want a piston kit on your rifle go for it. I'm just not sure what gains you expect to see after spending the money and think a training course or a 1000 rounds of ammo would go further towards seeing improvements on target downrange.
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Lmao, he was responding to me. Not you my friend. He was trying to put words in my mouth. He was making an assumption I was comparing a "piston kit" to an actual piston gun as being equal. I'm still trying to figure out how he came to that conclusion. Because no where in my comment did I mention piston kits.
 
cr5 said:
I never compared your precious HK to a conversion. That rifle was reengineering by HK to be a piston operated rifle.
It still offers nothing over a DI rifle other than bragging rights to a Canadian shooter.
Heavier, more expensive, harder to source parts.
HK makes fantastic rifles but unless your military or law enforcement and using it where people are shooting back at you I see no justification to spend that much money unless you just have lots of cash and want one.
I'm in no way saying there's anything wrong with the HK or that they aren't a better product, only that as a civilian shooter in Canada there is no advantage to shooting one over any other quality rifle.
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I was not responding to you. The weight is a detriment however the mr is price competitive if you use the features it comes with.

90vette said:
Lmao, he was responding to me. Not you my friend. He was trying to put words in my mouth. He was making an assumption I was comparing a "piston kit" to an actual piston gun as being equal. I'm still trying to figure out how he came to that conclusion. Because no where in my comment did I mention piston kits.
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My mistake thought you were the same guy asking about the superlative kits.
 
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Alright i get what you guys are saying. It was mostly to have an nr ar that stays clean. And i always wanted a piston ar so i tought why not a MS ! But ill probably stick woth DI and my tin coated lighted bcg from brownells
 
XperienceDUDE said:
Alright i get what you guys are saying. It was mostly to have an nr ar that stays clean. And i always wanted a piston ar so i tought why not a MS ! But ill probably stick woth DI and my tin coated lighted bcg from brownells
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Don't let anyone talk you out of it if that's what you want, it's your rifle and your money.

If you're running a light BCG I hope you have an adjustable gas block, the system needs to remain balanced. If you remove mass from the moving parts you need to reduce the gas or it will push the carrier back harder making it slam into the back of the buffer tube harder than before which counters the point of a light BCG.

r34skyline said:
I was not responding to you. The weight is a detriment however the mr is price competitive if you use the features you utilize.
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I agree that you get what you pay for, I don't think the HK is overpriced, it's just a lot of money for features that are useless to the average Canadian sports shooter.
Like buying a Ferrari to go get groceries at Safeway and never taking it on a track to actually drive it how it's meant to be driven.
 
Okay, I agree with most of what’s been said here, but I will throw in a possible caveat. If you were building a MS or SLR in 7.62 X 39 a piston kit would be a good idea. If you were shooting corrosive at all, the piston will help keep all the “corrosive” out of your internals. Other than that, I have to agree that I don’t see any real advantage.
 
cr5 said:
Don't let anyone talk you out of it if that's what you want, it's your rifle and your money.

If you're running a light BCG I hope you have an adjustable gas block, the system needs to remain balanced. If you remove mass from the moving parts you need to reduce the gas or it will push the carrier back harder making it slam into the back of the buffer tube harder than before which counters the point of a light BCG.



I agree that you get what you pay for, I don't think the HK is overpriced, it's just a lot of money for features that are useless to the average Canadian sports shooter.
Like buying a Ferrari to go get groceries at Safeway and never taking it on a track to actually drive it how it's meant to be driven.
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All valid points and completely agreed on all of them.

And like i said OP. If the piston tickles your fancy get it. Also don't sweat the dirty thing. If your gun is put together with quality components and well lubricated it will easily do 1000-2000 rounds reliably between cleanings.
 
I would consider retrofitting my AR with piston system because full cleaning of AR15 takes more time than my WW2 SVT-40 and because piston system runs colder. And because I shoot both it boggled my mind every time I cleaned them. I had to compromise and settled with "well, AR15 is just a tool that gets used, abused and thrown out", I just wipe BCG with CLP and send couple of patches down the barrel after each shooting, and do full cleaning only once in a season. It's actually very lame excuses, all these "AR15 doesn't need cleaning, just lubing", you know and key word is "excuse". With this approach any given piston system will outperform AR15 as it will be more clean after same number of rounds, but piston rifles crowd clean their rifles because it's so easy and quick and there's no need to come with lame excuses.... I definitely would have liked my AR15 more had it true piston system by design but well, nothing is perfect in this world.
 
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