B&T APC Range report, comparisons and groups

OP, I hope you don't mind if I put these here. I had mine out a few nights ago and managed to get 2 sub MOA groups out of 5 groups fired. Hardly real conclusive based on the small number of rounds fired, but i think it proves that these guns are sub MOA capable at least. Fired with a 2.5-8 Leopold Mark4.
This group is Hornady 75gr Steel Match.
0YTR1ou.jpg

And this one is Hornady 55gr TAP.
qUlJLkK.jpg
 
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Humm interesting, I'll try the 75 grainers if I can find some next time I'm out.

Surprising considering the twist rate, but that is the science of experiments.

Nice shooting
 
8 ball said:
OP, I hope you don't mind if I put these here. I had mine out a few nights ago and managed to get 2 sub MOA groups out of 5 groups fired. Hardly real conclusive based on the small number of rounds fired, but i think it proves that these guns are sub MOA capable at least. Fired with a 2.5-8 Leopold Mark4.
This group is Hornady 75gr Steel Match.
0YTR1ou.jpg

And this one is Hornady 55gr TAP.
qUlJLkK.jpg
Click to expand...

Very good to see.

What is your rig set up like??
 
Stock gun with the vert grip taken off and a Leopold 2.5-8 Mark 4 thrown on it. I was also surprised by the 75 grain stuff! Plan on doing a more thorough range report over the long weekend. Not wanting to hijack the thread, just want people to see that these fine rifles are indeed sub moa capable. (mine anyway)
 
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but it is my understanding that the AR Tube Adapter is non-folding. So great, you can throw on a CTR with riser to correct the horribly flawed comb-height and fixed LOP, but then you have to compromise by giving up the folding stock's convenience. Hardly an ideal fix for $300 after tax and shipping! May as well spend $500 for the "enhanced" B&T buttstock and have full functionality along with adjustability. At least that was my line of reasoning. It is no small hit in the pocketbook though, considering that a $4k, 2017 rifle should have never left the factory with a 1980s buttstock featuring badly-flawed ergos...

And with that, I will get off my B&T buttstock soap-box...
 
I have listened to all the feed back and a report is already on its way to Karl Brugger. I recognised the "poor" butt stock from the very beginning but you need to remember that that the original design was for a lightweight police carbine. To make her non restricted we have taken a lightweight carbine, added a heavy 18.6 inch barrel and turned her into a heavy "varmint" rifle. I prefer the folding/retractable butt stock as the comb is 1/2 inch higher but the first public opinion on CGN was to stay with the stock you have.

I have asked if we can get the folding retractable butt stock with a higher cheek piece, these are removable and some butt spacers to lengthen the LOP. I am also seeing if we can get this as standard on the next shipment.

We have the AR stock adapters available from stock, they allow other options but, as has been pointed out, they do not fold.

More to follow as I hear back from the factory.
 
On HK style stocks you are supposed to press the cheekbone on that round plastic part of the stock right behind the receiver.

Try that with extended irons and you'll get a perfect sight picture.
 
Mr Wolverine said:
I have listened to all the feed back and a report is already on its way to Karl Brugger. I recognised the "poor" butt stock from the very beginning but you need to remember that that the original design was for a lightweight police carbine. To make her non restricted we have taken a lightweight carbine, added a heavy 18.6 inch barrel and turned her into a heavy "varmint" rifle. I prefer the folding/retractable butt stock as the comb is 1/2 inch higher but the first public opinion on CGN was to stay with the stock you have.

I have asked if we can get the folding retractable butt stock with a higher cheek piece, these are removable and some butt spacers to lengthen the LOP. I am also seeing if we can get this as standard on the next shipment.

We have the AR stock adapters available from stock, they allow other options but, as has been pointed out, they do not fold.

More to follow as I hear back from the factory.
Click to expand...

Thanks wolverine, nice to hear that you are listening and seeking us options. A better folding stock (higher, longer) would help a lot.
 
Mr Wolverine said:
I have listened to all the feed back and a report is already on its way to Karl Brugger. I recognised the "poor" butt stock from the very beginning but you need to remember that that the original design was for a lightweight police carbine. To make her non restricted we have taken a lightweight carbine, added a heavy 18.6 inch barrel and turned her into a heavy "varmint" rifle. I prefer the folding/retractable butt stock as the comb is 1/2 inch higher but the first public opinion on CGN was to stay with the stock you have.

I have asked if we can get the folding retractable butt stock with a higher cheek piece, these are removable and some butt spacers to lengthen the LOP. I am also seeing if we can get this as standard on the next shipment.

We have the AR stock adapters available from stock, they allow other options but, as has been pointed out, they do not fold.

More to follow as I hear back from the factory.
Click to expand...

Hi Mr Wolverine,

Thanks for following up.

In an early posting you mentioned that the adjustable folding stock is not as "rigid" as the standard folding stock? That's the reason I went with the adapter, is that still your opinion? If not I am wondering if I can change directions before I install the adapter, please let me know how we can discuss thanks.
Mr Wolverine said:
I agree with you a cheek weld is very important. We have been advised that the skeleton stock is more rigid that the stock with the cheek piece and that this stock (Skelton) with a strap on pad like Voodoo offer is the best way. We will also have some butts with the cheek piece available as an option.
Click to expand...

BTW. Does your feedback to B&T include the seemingly odd finishing marks some folks have reported? E.g. Heat treat after finishing, some ejection port marks, machining marks on bolt head? Although I understand they are not functional impacting.
 
The enhanced factory stocks are nice, however someone (Dlask?) could fab an AR stock adapter for this quite easily? It doesn't fit the blocky theme as well, but everyone has like 10 AR stocks lying around, don't they? :)
 
Danimal247 said:
The enhanced factory stocks are nice, however someone (Dlask?) could fab an AR stock adapter for this quite easily? It doesn't fit the blocky theme as well, but everyone has like 10 AR stocks lying around, don't they? :)
Click to expand...

We have lots of B&T AR stock adapters in stock, they are not that simple as you have to transfer the APC buffer into the adapter.
 
norlandgeese said:
Hi Mr Wolverine,

Thanks for following up.

In an early posting you mentioned that the adjustable folding stock is not as "rigid" as the standard folding stock? That's the reason I went with the adapter, is that still your opinion? If not I am wondering if I can change directions before I install the adapter, please let me know how we can discuss thanks.


BTW. Does your feedback to B&T include the seemingly odd finishing marks some folks have reported? E.g. Heat treat after finishing, some ejection port marks, machining marks on bolt head? Although I understand they are not functional impacting.
Click to expand...

Given that the stock is retractable there is a very slight movement there but nothing that I would be concerned about, the higher comb far out ways that minor movement in my opinion. Yes we can change out your adapter, we only brought in 5 of these stocks, due to lack of interest, and one is staying on our rifle, so only 4 available right now. We can of course order more.

I did mention the discolouration on the bolt carrier.
 
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