Backup Sights on Hunting Rifle

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bhunts

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SW Ontario
I once saw a rifle scope get wrecked by a minor slip and fall on some wet rocks. Something like that can put a quick end to your hunt. A spare rifle is a good idea, but a trip back to the truck can waste a precious hunting day. That's not acceptable either, so I started searching for a reliable backup solution that could be implemented in the field. After looking at many products, here's what I settled on.

- Warne Maxima Quick Detach rings and Maxima bases (Weaver style)
- NECGS (New England Custom Gun Service) peep sight for Weaver bases
- NECGS Masterpiece banded front ramp
- NECGS Sourdough bead

I am very pleased with this system. I can switch between scope and iron sights in one minute. No tools required. The scope is removed by a simple turn of the lever. The peep sight mounts directly onto the rear scope base. Just hand tighten the set screw. It 's a solid fit. There is no change in accuracy when I switch back and forth. The scope and peep sight both maintain zero.

While hunting, I carry the peep sight in my pack until needed. At the range, I can easily practice with either system. The NECGS peep sight is adjustable for windage and elevation. It is very accurate. Much better than any v-notch sight. The front sight ramp has a plunger lock to switch beads. They offer a variety of front bead types, including fiber optic. I chose the Sourdough because the solid steel cannot break off in the bush. NECGS makes quality stuff, and happily ships to Canada.
 
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Additional note

A few notes on the banded ramp:

When ordering the banded ramp from NECGS, provide the exact barrel diameter at the muzzle (use calipers).
The banded ramp is shipped unblued and requires gunsmithing skills for installation.
If you epoxy the banded ramp, you simply need to finish it as desired.
If you solder the banded ramp, you may have to refinish all the metal.
I went with soldering and a Parkerized finish for the whole rifle.
 
Additional note

A few notes on the front bead:

If the front bead height is not right, the rifle will shoot too high or too low.
Getting the correct front bead height is tricky, as each rifle has different barrel contours.
When ordering the front bead, provide the exact distance from the top of weaver base to the top of the barrel at the muzzle.
NECGS will suggest the correct bead height, and they will exchange the bead if necessary after testing.
 
That is really good info. I've been looking for a system that had thate capability to shoot over weaver sights - this looks perfect. :)
 
Thanks for that information. I'm sure it will be very valuable for many on here.

I have a couple of rifles with "tip off" scope mounts so I can tip the scope off to the side and use the rifles iron sights.
 
bhunts said:
A few notes on the front bead:

If the front bead height is not right, the rifle will shoot too high or too low.
Getting the correct front bead height is tricky, as each rifle has different barrel contours.
When ordering the front bead, provide the exact distance from the top of weaver base to the top of the barrel at the muzzle.
NECGS will suggest the correct bead height, and they will exchange the bead if necessary after testing.
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Since I'm lousy at math and can never find my calipers when i need them, what I do is buy the tallest sourdough (0.394" ??)

then set your peep sight to the middle of the elevation range, and file the sourdough to elevation right at the range.

If you ever diecide to switch to a bead, you will have your elevation to start from.
 
That's definitely different, but what's wrong with regular open sights and a quick detach scope? If you have to go to a gunsmith anyhow for installation, may as well be permanent and far more solid and repeatable. Different strokes for different folks I guess.
 
Gunsmith

By the way, the front sight installation and parkerizing for this project were done by Casey at TacOrd in Newmarket, ON (tacord.com). He does excellent work.
 
358 BLR said:
Thanks for the info, it's good to know that such an option is available. Does the diameter of the "peep hole" (for lack of a better term) come in various sizes?
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The NECGS peep sight is supplied with two aperture discs (.93" & .125"), as well as two elevation slides (one for use with a flat style base and another for use with deep channel bases).
 
bhunts said:
A peep sight is far more adjustable and accurate than any v-notch sight. It is also much easier to use in low light.
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More adjustable and accurate yes, but generally harder to see the front sight through the peep in low light.

I just figure it's one more thing to lose. A rear v-notch is permanently attached. This set-up would seem fine if a person wanted to use the rifle with open sights or scoped, but has its limitations as a back-up system. I like open sights, but not if I have to attach them everytime I want to use them.
Personal preference I suppose.
 
bearkilr said:
That's definitely different, but what's wrong with regular open sights and a quick detach scope? If you have to go to a gunsmith anyhow for installation, may as well be permanent and far more solid and repeatable. Different strokes for different folks I guess.
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The problem with that is that a lot of the factory open sights aren't usable with the weaver bases in place. PIA to have to unscrew the bases to use the sights. I might like a shallow V open sight better than the aperature, i think.
 
Very nice bhunts. I have aperture sights on most of my rifles as well, either as a back up sight or as the primary sight. The brass inset on your front sight is excellent and is the same as I have on my ZG-47. Unfortunately shooting effectively with irons is lost on the majority of today's hunters. For them, the best back up sight would be a second scope mounted in QD rings.
 
Open sights

I am definitely a believer in having open sights as a back-up system. With a peep sight, you can remove the disk, and get a larger hole for sighting, much like the Ghost Ring sights.

However, the peep sight has a disadvantage when you have a scope mounted. It sticks out a lot, and interferes with any scope mounting. If you carry it in a pack, it is useable, but one more thing that might get lost. And anytime you have to mount a sight, it should then be zeroed. Not really the best idea to zero a rifle in your immediate hunting area - it tends to make the Game Animals nervous.

The open "V" sight has a few advantages. It is permanently mounted, and it is zeroed all the time (unless hit or disturbed.) With the advent of the scope sight on rifles today, the use of open sights has declined considerably. In fact, there are quite a few shooters today who really do not know how to use and adjust open sights. And how many shooters really take the time to practice with open sights?

Yes, open "V" sights are not as accurate as a peep sight. If we look at the original concept of the peep sight, it was developed for target shooting and for long range shooting. If we honestly look at the average range a game animal is shot, I think you will find that it is well under 200 yards and closer to 100 yards in most cases. Out on the Prairies, there is a lot of open ground, but the Cedar swamps of the East, and in the mountains and the dark timber of the West, you have a hard time seeing 100 yards let alone 200. And this is over 50 years of hunting experience, and a lot of long range target shooting speaking here.

A "V" type open sight is rugged, reliable, and almost foolproof. (However, fools are very ingenious.) Almost every Army in the World has used them, and if we look at the Mauser rifle system, or the British SMLE system, they were in use for decades. As far as accuracy goes, if a SMLE can put rounds into a Figure 11 target, (approximately 14x16 inches) at 500 yards, then why can you not hit a Moose or Deer at less than 200 yards.

A back up system is just that - to back up and salvage a hunt when the primary sight system is damaged and not useable. You might have to sneak up 50 yards or so closer to your target, but you are still able to hunt with your rifle. One of the funniest TV episodes of a Canadian hunting show had the Host in Northern Manitoba hunting Moose. It appears he brought along ONE rifle that had no open sights, ONE scope mounted on the rifle, and a BOW AND ARROWS. His scope (a very expensive one -what else?) was damaged in transit, so he resorted to the Bow and Arrows to attempt to keep hunting. A Moose waked in front of him at about 70 yards. It was out of range for the Archery equipment, but would have been an easy shot if our Hero would have had a set of open sights on his Super-Duper Magnum rifle.

And let's consider the frequency of how many times we really HAVE to resort to the open sights. In over 50 years of hunting, all across Canada, I can think of only FOUR times that I have had to go to open sights. Two have been from a dropped rifle, one from a scope failure, and once when a horse stepped on my scabbard. That averages to once ever 12 1/2 years. However, I was able to keep hunting for the rest of the day, until I got back to Camp or Home where a spare scope was available. Without open sights, it would have been the end of the Hunt right there and then.

In conclusion, all of my HUNTING rifles have open sights on them, either as a back-up or a primary sighting system.
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buffdog said:
I am definitely a believer in having open sights as a back-up system ... In conclusion, all of my HUNTING rifles have open sights on them, either as a back-up or a primary sighting system.
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Buffdog, thanks for your extensive comments. I completely agree with your conclusion. Backup sights are essential in case of scope damage. It doesn't happen often, but the hunt must go on no matter what. For that reason, I chose the peep sight. I want to be be able to comfortably shoot at 100 yards without a scope. No problem with this sight.

I must repeat that this NECGS peep sight does not need to be zeroed each time. It always returns to zero after mounting. This way I have the best of both worlds: no rear sight to interfere with scope visibility, and an excellent backup solution in my pack if required.
 
buffdog said:
I am definitely a believer in having open sights as a back-up system. With a peep sight, you can remove the disk, and get a larger hole for sighting, much like the Ghost Ring sights.

However, the peep sight has a disadvantage when you have a scope mounted. It sticks out a lot, and interferes with any scope mounting. If you carry it in a pack, it is useable, but one more thing that might get lost.
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I agree fully with your post. Me, I'm too good at losing things, so I went with a peep like this that I can't lose .........

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