Barrel break-in ...

K0na_stinky said:
Its really hard to prove that.

Did you notice that your barrel was cleaning easier to clean, and that is why you switched from shooting once to a 5 shot group, then to a 10 shot group? Or were you just horny to shoot? Some times it takes more then 5 shots to smooth out any spots that don't agree with your bullets.

Clean with a copper solvent so you get an idea of any copper fouling.
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Plenty of discussion and evidence to support the fact. There's zero evidence to support the belief that breaking in a barrel is of any value. Gail McMillan of the McMillan fame posted a long explanation of just what barrel break in isn't doing, he also listed many many championships and world records set with his barrels that had zero break in performed.

Much of the break in propaganda was pushed by custom makers who saw it as a way to increase sales. You waste X number of rounds breaking it in means you have X number of rounds less life in the barrel, which means you buy a new barrel sooner. Break in is a waste of time and ammo. Shoot the gun, clean it, enjoy.

TDC
 
My way ,shoot normaly dont overheat the barrel and use metalics brush ONLY when you have no other choice, a good solvent and a patch is all you really need... Cheers. JP.
 
TDC said:
Plenty of discussion and evidence to support the fact. There's zero evidence to support the belief that breaking in a barrel is of any value. Gail McMillan of the McMillan fame posted a long explanation of just what barrel break in isn't doing, he also listed many many championships and world records set with his barrels that had zero break in performed.

Much of the break in propaganda was pushed by custom makers who saw it as a way to increase sales. You waste X number of rounds breaking it in means you have X number of rounds less life in the barrel, which means you buy a new barrel sooner. Break in is a waste of time and ammo. Shoot the gun, clean it, enjoy.

TDC
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An anecdotal story that is not based on evidence... as if 10 or 20 shots that may be used if one decides to 'break' a barrel in is going to shorten barrel life by any amount of measurement.

If one decides to break a barrel in, those 10 or 20 shots may be used in checking pressures and sighting in... oops I just wore my barrel out... :rolleyes:

Lilja, Kreiger and Speedy are not the three stooges here ...
 
I dont believe in breaking procedure neither, when i get to the range with my new Nemesis 308, i will clean before, will set up my scope and zero it , while shooting a hundred rounds in a couple of hours and i will run a patch tru at the end, oil a bit et voila, breaking in is over... Cheers. JP.
 
caramel said:
I dont believe in breaking procedure neither, when i get to the range with my new Nemesis 308, i will clean before, will set up my scope and zero it , while shooting a hundred rounds in a couple of hours and i will run a patch tru at the end, oil a bit et voila, breaking in is over... Cheers. JP.
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After that initial 100 rounds does it copper foul?
 
Barrel seasoning options not discussed

Have been enjoying the banter about. :popCorn:

Now may be time to add the tubbs option. Suggest you let the barrel tell you what it needs. If coppering is an issue, the single, or multi shot procedure may help. My Shilen Select match cleaned up with litte or no coppering in a couple shots. And yes, Tubbs TMS was used, with no detectible throat movment. But a couple shot clean process may have resulted in the same coppering result.

With custom or factory barrels I have come accross burrs or marks in the leade (not uncommon and practically unavoidable.) So If machining left burrs or marks then only shooting will help. A 5 shot string of TMS has also eliminated this issue without ill affect in my barrels, and has effectively seasoned my precision barrels. It also helped with a burr and factory defect which left pitting in a precision barrel after 700 shots.

So you may wish to explore this practice you may want to but it comes with a caveat. You just may have to accept a loss of any perceived warrantee. For me it was not an issue. I use what has worked for me. My two bits......
 
guntech said:
An anecdotal story that is not based on evidence... as if 10 or 20 shots that may be used if one decides to 'break' a barrel in is going to shorten barrel life by any amount of measurement.

If one decides to break a barrel in, those 10 or 20 shots may be used in checking pressures and sighting in... oops I just wore my barrel out... :rolleyes:

Lilja, Kreiger and Speedy are not the three stooges here ...
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So do tell, just what does 10-20 rounds "actually" do to the barrel that the next 10,000 won't? If break in is required to "smooth, flatten, clean, debur etc" the barrel. Why waste the time trying to zero a rifle that hasn't been broke in?

The Anecdotal story is directly from Mr. McMillan's mouth and supported by many championship wins with unbroken barrels. Other than wasting ammo and reducing the life of your barrel(to any degree) there is nothing wrong with barrel break in. Its simply a waste of time and ammo that has yet to be proven effective at improving anything. Until/unless something has been proven factual, its mythical crap and ranks up there with responsible government, faith in humanity, and religion.

TDC
 
TDC said:
The Anecdotal story is directly from Mr. McMillan's mouth and supported by many championship wins with unbroken barrels. Other than wasting ammo and reducing the life of your barrel(to any degree) there is nothing wrong with barrel break in. Its simply a waste of time and ammo that has yet to be proven effective at improving anything. Until/unless something has been proven factual, its mythical crap and ranks up there with responsible government, faith in humanity, and religion.
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My buddy wasn't sure what the barrel break in procedure was when he had my first custom gun made, so he asked Ted Gaillard.

"Just shoot the f*cking thing"

Works for me!
 
TDC said:
So do tell, just what does 10-20 rounds "actually" do to the barrel that the next 10,000 won't? If break in is required to "smooth, flatten, clean, debur etc" the barrel. Why waste the time trying to zero a rifle that hasn't been broke in?

The Anecdotal story is directly from Mr. McMillan's mouth and supported by many championship wins with unbroken barrels. Other than wasting ammo and reducing the life of your barrel(to any degree) there is nothing wrong with barrel break in. Its simply a waste of time and ammo that has yet to be proven effective at improving anything. Until/unless something has been proven factual, its mythical crap and ranks up there with responsible government, faith in humanity, and religion.

TDC
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Read what Lilja and Kreiger and Speedy have to say about it on their websites. Maybe even send them an email and discuss it...
 
I fail to see how some voodo proceedure can improve your barrel. I can see if the inside is so rough that copper fouling will create dangerous pressures. If my custom match tube was so rough that it needed me to jump through hoops to ensure the first hundred rounds made it out of the tube safely I think I'd be looking elsewhere. The only advantage I can imagine with these shoot, clean, shoot, etc is it may take less time to remove any copper that may have built up at the end of the day by spending that time cleaning at the range. That said I think custom barrels are known for how little they foul compared to factory so we are back to shoot it and when your done for the day clean it.

The real test is will you void your warranty if you don't follow the break in proceedure. Also how could they possible prove you didn't?

In the end it's your barrel, if spending an hour getting off 10-15 rounds makes you feel better follow the proceedure.
 
I will only break in my barrel if you guys sing voodoo incantations while wearing pink panties. If not, I'll keep shooting at least 100-200 rounds before cleaning.....
 
TDC said:
Barrel break in is a myth. Clean it, shoot it, clean it when you're done.

TDC
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Couldnt agree more with this. If you were to ask a metallurgist, a nickel says they'd tell you a barrel will wear the same on the 75-80th shot as it will from teh first to 5th shot. Decent looking groups for first shooting session. The average vertical dispersion looks near equal for each grouping, which indicates some fiddling with the powder charge could be adjusted either direction to snug everything up.
 
I've always found this an interesting topic. Opinions about "barrel break in" vary widely among riflemen with a whole hell of a lot more experience than I have, (as most do). Opinions I've read range from "Just shoot", to a super involved "Remington" regimen involving a couple of hundred rounds, (I'm sure you can find this with some googling).

Anyhow, I decided to follow a break in procedure using 10 x 1 for starts, then 5 x 2, then 4 x 5 for 40 rds total. On the one hand its a pain in the arse but on the other hand, who doesn't enjoy shooting a new firearm ?

As the OP now knows, the mission is to chase copper and, though you only have my word on this, I swear my barrels (just hammer forged factory jobs) foul less as a result of the effort. Some will think I'm deluded and that's ok. I'm aware the topic is contentious so I'm as unoffended as I am convinced :D.

My .338 LM had me worried at first. During my first 10 shots initial patches came out bright blue and both sweets and JB's paste were needed before I could produce a white, copper free patch between shots. Happily, by the end of the procedure, 5 shots leave only the faintest hint of CU on a first patch soaked in Boretech Copper Buster. Mission accomplished IMHO.

You can wreck a barrel cleaning it. If, therefore, you're going to do all this cleaning it is wise IMHO to spend a few bux on a proper rod and guide and educate yourself as to the do's and dont's of cleaning so you know enough not reverse brushes inside the barrel and how not to bang up your crown. Care to the point of being pedantic and determination to produce a perfectly clean patch before taking the next shot add to the tedium of doing this but I think its also what makes it work.

My List:

Bore guide by TK Nowlan.

Polished stainless rod, not coated.

Nylon brushes

Sweets / Bore Tech Cu Buster.

JB bore baste

Bore tech Eliminator.

Plenty of cotton patches

A Day

Now all this probably has some experienced guys either rolling their eyes or pissin themselves laughing. I'm not, as I've already said, an experienced rifleman but an experimenting duffer. Still, the experiment has me convinced the effort is worthwhile and thus far, I haven't buggered any barrels (3),, so there you have it, my opinion :p.
 
Shilen break in procedure:
"Break-in procedures are as diverse as cleaning techniques. Shilen, Inc. introduced a break-in procedure mostly because customers seemed to think that we should have one."

Goes to show Shilen had no need for a break in procedure until a bunch of customers seemed to think they needed one. With a lapped match barrel it's just a waste of good cleaning supplies & bullets/powder/primers.

Now in a factory built rifle barrel, there may be some merit to a barrel break in procedure, but it's hard to say without buying 2 rifles with identical barrels (impossible) & doing a comprehensive break in on one & not on the other & see if it makes a difference. I'd be willing to do some testing if anyone wants to donate two new rifles ;)
 
For copper fouling is Remington 40X good?
Anyone tried it?

I am using Hoppe's #9 Benchrest and it's write on the bottle COPPER SOLVENT...Is it realy a copper solvent?

And all factory HB .308 I have tried(a lot) Where shooting tighter groups when fouled???

I think I am lost...:D
 
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