Barrel leading - CONFUSED!

358Scout

358Scout

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I have two rifles in which I use can use reloaded lead bullets.

The first is a Remington 700 in 458 Winchester Magnum. With 400 and 500 grains as long as I dont exceed 1700 fps I have no problems and its relatively accurate 1.5 - 2". It has a 1:14 twist and since I don't shoot it all day I load everything with Speer jacketed 400gr. With this I get 3/4" groups at 100 yds. Love to shoot this thing and watch things come apart like 1 liter water bottles, phone books, even got the squirrel on the opposite side of the poplar tree but that I think was a result of wood splintering,

My other rifle is a Marlin 1894 Cowboy in 45 Colt. I'm using Hornady 250 gr XTP with 22.3grs H110 (book velocity 1300fps). It's great and accurate. But at the cost of bullets and shooting 50 to 100 (200yd silhouettes) per sitting - its getting expensive. I need to go to lead. I talked to a couple of guys at the handgun silhouette range. They tell me their guns lead up around 900 fps. HOW SO SINCE MY OTHER RIFLE NEEDS TO GET INTO IN THE 1700 - 1800 RANGE. The Marlin has the Ballard 1:36 twist so that's a long spin for a bullet.

I understand the lead hardness may play a roll but I don't cast and would need to get equipment and go to gas checks at these speeds, so I'm told.

What I want, is to develop one (1) load with relatively the same trajectory calibrated to my aperture sights with out worrying about leading.
 
There is alot to know about casting and cast bullets. But once you get the hang of it, it is not all that difficult. I am running a 44mag Marlin rifle from 850fps for plinking rds (200gr) up to 310gr at 1400fps, just starting with a 245gr Keith mold that I want up to 17-1800fps, but have not shot it yet. I do not use gc's. The only one that even has a GC shank is my 310gr and I use paper patch for that with sub 1" groups at 100yds.

In my opinion and most one of the most important things about cast is the size. If the size is wrong, it just will not work. bad leading and accuracy.

check out www.castboolits.com there is a ton of info there on the forum.

Hope this helps, Matt
 
what they told you is true. I've found handguns to be more finicky about lead hardness too. But then, cartridges like the 45 colt tend to use plain base bullets, no gas check, and the pressures are low, so obturation becomes an issue with hard bullets.
Lots of reasons for leading up.
It is possible to get up to 1200fps or so, at low Colt pressures, without serious leading, and even then, it may take a few rounds to be a problem.
It it may take some playing on your part to get the right combination.
 
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as long as the bullet fits correctly, usually a thou or two oversized is best, and the alloy hardness is correct it should not lead that bad with a gaschecked bullet at the velocities you'll be shooting at. but some guns shoot soft bullets better than hard and vice versa.

Properly sized bullet, proper hardness, gascheck over 1400fps, proper ammount of appropriate lube... usually will result in minimal leading.

however there are a multitude of other causes of leading such as tooling marks, barrel constrictions, chamber and throat dimensions, etc etc...

one good tip i've gotten recently is to make sure to remove all traces of copper from your bore before shooting cast bullets as that can also lead to leading. all you can do is try some in your gun to see how they perform.

if i were you i'd PM a brief description of your dilemma to ben hunchak. he'll hook you up.
 
I would take a lead "egg" fishing sinker, oil the bore and push it through- that'll give you the diameter at its smallest dimension. Then mike your Cast boolits and see if they are a couple of thou oversize..
 
I agree, because I have used plain base bullets to 2000fps, the most important factor is having them the right size, hardness is secondary, I do however find that a gas check is the next best thing to proper sizing if you want to run up the speed.
 
I had a Marlin 1894 in .45 Colt and it shot the 250gr XTP bullets very well. You couldn't push cast bullets to 1000fps regardless of the alloy. It pretty much hated cast bullets as it had the roughest barrel of any rifle I've ever owned. Just looking down the barrel you could see the tool marks big time.

Others I've spoken to have had good results with soft alloys in the same model rifle.

I find that you really can't put a specific speed limit on how fast you can shoot lead. It depends on the barrel, bullet alloy, lube, and bullet design.

Chris.
 
ben hunchak said:
I agree, because I have used plain base bullets to 2000fps, the most important factor is having them the right size, hardness is secondary, I do however find that a gas check is the next best thing to proper sizing if you want to run up the speed.
Click to expand...

Powder and lube is a factor as well.
I used 357 mag 158gr bullets with 700X once and the barrel leaded up beyond belief.
 
ben hunchak said:
I agree, because I have used plain base bullets to 2000fps, the most important factor is having them the right size, hardness is secondary, I do however find that a gas check is the next best thing to proper sizing if you want to run up the speed.
Click to expand...
I fully agree with the comment on size, but take a bit of issue with the comment on hardness being secondary. At least with low pressure stuff, like his 45 colt, or my own 44-40.
I've found that pure lead, with just a few wheel weights added, produces a bullet that shoots most accurately for me, with little leading at 1200, or even if I push 1400fps. There, accuracy drops off.
Plain base in rifles like the 45-70, I use pure wheel weights, and have shot those at 2000 fps without leading (just bruises) :).
In both cases, the bullets will be tight in the bore, the 45-70 likes them as cast, that's 3 thou over bore size.
With the 44-40 in my 1892, I'm screwed, because the chamber won't let me use anything larger than .428, only a thou above bore size. But I can use very soft bullets, and achieve the results I want through obturation.
 
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