Barrel Length for hunting

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Go4snypr

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I am looking at buying a new fire arm that I would like to use for hunting. The problem is I am hooked on black tacticool rifles. I am just wondering, what barrel length is too short to hunt with. I am thinking of buying an XCR-M with the 18 inch barrel on it. With it being a .308, the caliber is large enough for me to hunt legally with it here in Saskatchewan, but is it a practical buy for hunting big game?? I have only been into guns for about a year now and all I own is a couple .22's and a shot gun. I dont know anything about what calibers are good for hunting or barrel length or any of that. I don't need hater answers either, if you dont like black rifles that is fine with me, I just want to know if this rifle would be practical in any way to hunt with, or if I would be better off throwing my shoe at the deer. (maybe this should be in the black rifles forum, not sure). Thanks.
 
A .308 with an 18.5" barrel doesn't give up much muzzle velocity compared with typical 22"-24" barrels found on most big game rifles. It will work just fine.
 
I don't hate "black rifles" just don't feel they are particularly well suited to hunting. The balance, fit and ease of handling a well designed traditional hunting rifle are far superior to any black rifle. Black rifles are essentially modelled after military long arms and were designed to fit a specific set of requirements, far different than those for a good hunting rifle. You can hunt with one if you like but you are unnecessarily handicapping yourself. But it's a free country(as least so far).
 
Mike Webb said:
I don't hate "black rifles" just don't feel they are particularly well suited to hunting. The balance, fit and ease of handling a well designed traditional hunting rifle are far superior to any black rifle. Black rifles are essentially modelled after military long arms and were designed to fit a specific set of requirements, far different than those for a good hunting rifle. You can hunt with one if you like but you are unnecessarily handicapping yourself. But it's a free country(as least so far).
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I don't know that you handicap yourself while using a black rifle, but I'll definately agree that they aren't really for me while hunting. I do however love to blast away at the range with the black rifles.
 
Mike Webb said:
I don't hate "black rifles" just don't feel they are particularly well suited to hunting. The balance, fit and ease of handling a well designed traditional hunting rifle are far superior to any black rifle. Black rifles are essentially modelled after military long arms and were designed to fit a specific set of requirements, far different than those for a good hunting rifle. You can hunt with one if you like but you are unnecessarily handicapping yourself. But it's a free country(as least so far).
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Handicap?

I have an 18.5" barreled 308 with an overall length of 26"! Unless you've never walked bush in your life, you will realize that is FAR from a "handicap". My whole gun is almost the same length as the average traditional rifles barrel!

In addition, its completely modular and able to break down in seconds with no tools....I don't have a single "traditional" rifle (and theres got to be close to 100 around) that I can break down to clean/fix in literally seconds with no tools.

Lastly: The gun is as good at 15m when dogging as it is at 250m on watch thaanks to the "non traditional type" sighting system.

It's ugly as ####...and it gets the old fuddy types at the camp just riled right up....but holy cow does it do a good job on deer and bear. I gotta freezer full of one-shot proof of that ;)
 
Mike Webb said:
I don't hate "black rifles" just don't feel they are particularly well suited to hunting. The balance, fit and ease of handling a well designed traditional hunting rifle are far superior to any black rifle. Black rifles are essentially modelled after military long arms and were designed to fit a specific set of requirements, far different than those for a good hunting rifle. You can hunt with one if you like but you are unnecessarily handicapping yourself. But it's a free country(as least so far).
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You could say the same thing about milsurps, but alot of people are still using them. If the old fudds don't like what you're using, tell them they can buy you a gun they approve of, or they can stay in camp and do dishes and cook meals.
 
too loud at the range,and still very loud in the field. short barrel is a no go.borrow one short barrel from a friend and shoot a few rounds,you will not like it. LOUD....

I can't appreciate those seasoned hunters keep pimping out short barrel to new hunters. it is like passing hard drug to a teenager
 
While 20 or 22 is probably the norm, I would say the rifle you shoot best offhand is the best choice. Personally I like the weight in front of me of a long barrel when I am shooting, but not when I am climbing. This year I am going to hunt with a full length Mauser , 29 inch barrel and all. I am not quite as quick as I am with a carbine, but I shoot it very well, and I would love a photo of it across a set of moose horns.
 
Mike Webb said:
I don't hate "black rifles" just don't feel they are particularly well suited to hunting. The balance, fit and ease of handling a well designed traditional hunting rifle are far superior to any black rifle. Black rifles are essentially modelled after military long arms and were designed to fit a specific set of requirements, far different than those for a good hunting rifle. You can hunt with one if you like but you are unnecessarily handicapping yourself. But it's a free country(as least so far).
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Aren't military rifles designed to be balanced and easy to handle since they are meant to hunt the ultimate prey that shoot back; other humans with rifles looking to shoot them?


To the OP, I used to hunt with a Norinco M-14 with a barrel shortened to 18.5". The only handicap I found was it was a tad heavy which is easily offset with a 3 point or two point sling. My M-14 would come with me on week long hunting trips. I mainly get out on foot to hunt instead of ripping up and down logging roads in a truck or quad. The added benefit of 2 or 3 point sling is it keeps the rifle up front which I prefer anyways. I'm not a big fan of traditional slings which encourage you to sling your rifle on your shoulder.
 
homer76 said:
Aren't military rifles designed to be balanced and easy to handle since they are meant to hunt the ultimate prey that shoot back; other humans with rifles looking to shoot them?
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Well, that kind of design makes it ill adapted for a prey that will not shoot back and has no backup. Just like a 3500 Ram is not made for pizza delivery.
 
Matt308 said:
explain
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How can I make it more plain ? You are hunting. You have your gun in your hands and an animal in front of you. Provided you have the least amount of know-how, the animal does not see you as a menace and is not armed. It will not retaliate. You are unbelievably safe. No life depends on you shooting this animal before it shoots back at your platoon.

A military rifle is thought out and designed for a situation where gunshots are exchanged, sight acquisition is fast and fire rate high. Two or three lost bullets are no big deal if you hit the enemy enough with what's in your magazine so that you can take control of the situation.

A hunting rifle on the other hand, is thought out for the situation where there is no danger. You do not want to hurt or disable the animal, you want to put it down for meat. You do not want it to leave the premises and let you take over, you want it's body for meals (and some of you trophies). Fast sight acquisition is not as much a priority as precision, and you should make every bullet count. You have (almost) all the time in the world, and even a second and third chance with another animal in your sector, if need be.

It is a wholly different situation, your mindset will be wholly different, so will be how your body act.
 
CaffeineSam said:
How can I make it more plain ? You are hunting. You have your gun in your hands and an animal in front of you. Provided you have the least amount of know-how, the animal does not see you as a menace and is not armed. It will not retaliate. You are unbelievably safe. No life depends on you shooting this animal before it shoots back at your platoon.

A military rifle is thought out and designed for a situation where gunshots are exchanged, sight acquisition is fast and fire rate high. Two or three lost bullets are no big deal if you hit the enemy enough with what's in your magazine so that you can take control of the situation.

A hunting rifle on the other hand, is thought out for the situation where there is no danger. You do not want to hurt or disable the animal, you want to put it down for meat. You do not want it to leave the premises and let you take over, you want it's body for meals (and some of you trophies). Fast sight acquisition is not as much a priority as precision, and you should make every bullet count. You have (almost) all the time in the world, and even a second and third chance with another animal in your sector, if need be.

It is a wholly different situation, your mindset will be wholly different, so will be how your body act.
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LOL....really? Holy cow. f:P:

Since you are speaking with authority though, I gotta ask....are you a professional hunter or are you a soldier? 'Cause with those "statement of facts", you gotta be one or the other......(BTW, you know that ALL sporting rifles are patterned after military rifles....right? LOL...Did ya think rifles were invented by hunters? :D)


Im gonna play devils advocate.....for those of us that don't limit ourselves to bambies....does that mean a black rifle would be perfect for hunting animals that hunt us back? :stirthepot2:
 
Black rifles have 3 limitations:
  1. extremely high lock time (as high as 1/6 second)
  2. often heavy
  3. short barreled 308 Win ballistics
What does that mean:
  1. you need to practice if you want to shoot accurately in non-prone positions and need to learn how to stabilise a rifle
  2. depends on physical condition: a well trained individual does not care much about 2-3 extra pounds (but it will kill an unfit hunter)
  3. 308 Win is an excellent all-rounder but the short barrel means a 50-75 yards shorter effective range
Proper training and motivation can easily solve issue 1) and 2).
Issue 3) is not an issue for medium sized game but is a limitation for long range hunting and means that large game hunting is restricted to medium range.

It's your choice, just make sure that you understand what are the implications.

If possible you should try a good 24" 270/30-06 Win bolt-action rifle and a 308 Win Norinco M14 at 200 yards target to see the difference right away.

Alex
 
AlexF said:
Black rifles have 3 limitations:
  1. extremely high lock time (as high as 1/6 second)
  2. often heavy
  3. short barreled 308 Win ballistics
What does that mean:
  1. you need to practice if you want to shoot accurately in non-prone positions and need to learn how to stabilise a rifle
  2. depends on physical condition: a well trained individual does not care much about 2-3 extra pounds (but it will kill an unfit hunter)
  3. 308 Win is an excellent all-rounder but the short barrel means a 50-75 yards shorter effective range
Proper training and motivation can easily solve issue 1) and 2).
Issue 3) is not an issue for medium sized game but is a limitation for long range hunting and means that large game hunting is restricted to medium range.

It's your choice, just make sure that you understand what are the implications.

If possible you should try a good 24" 270/30-06 Win bolt-action rifle and a 308 Win Norinco M14 at 200 yards target to see the difference right away.

Alex
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Why exactly are you comparing apples to oranges?

A 270/30-06 to a 308, like that shows some kind of difference between "black" rifles and "hunting" rifles?

Why not compare a .308 black rifle to a .308 bolt rifle? Wouldn't that be at least a reasonable comparison? :confused:

("lock time"...in a *hunting* rifle making a difference...now I've really heard it all. :rolleyes:)
 
why are you all debating nonsense with nonsense.

true answer is .. you will not notice the barrel length difference. provided you do real life tests at ranges deemed probable for game to be downed at
 
Go4snypr said:
I am looking at buying a new fire arm that I would like to use for hunting. The problem is I am hooked on black tacticool rifles. I am just wondering, what barrel length is too short to hunt with. I am thinking of buying an XCR-M with the 18 inch barrel on it. With it being a .308, the caliber is large enough for me to hunt legally with it here in Saskatchewan, but is it a practical buy for hunting big game?? I have only been into guns for about a year now and all I own is a couple .22's and a shot gun. I dont know anything about what calibers are good for hunting or barrel length or any of that. I don't need hater answers either, if you dont like black rifles that is fine with me, I just want to know if this rifle would be practical in any way to hunt with, or if I would be better off throwing my shoe at the deer. (maybe this should be in the black rifles forum, not sure). Thanks.
Click to expand...

With an 18" barrel, an XCR-M would be a restricted firearm. It could not be legally used for hunting.
 
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