BCL 102 chipped extractor, Norinco ammo

Suther said:
Hmmmm... If enough people complain (or if one person complains enough times maybe?) maybe they'll change it in future batches?
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or maybe they already have in the new batch...... frankly the only "real" qc issues are gas rings and tight chamber on a very small percentage of rifles.

but haters are going to hate either way...... the rest of us will soldier on with a fine firearm.
 
I've been saying this for a while.
Until they stop trying to make a $1600 dollar semi auto shoot like a $5K precision bolt gun (which none of them seem to do anyway) I'm out. This seems to make the rifle unreliable due to tight chambers causing feeding, extraction problems etc
Just make it a $1600 dead reliable, semi auto with standard rack grade AR10 accuracy and lighter barrel profile. Good to go.
They're so close yet so far away with this rifle, it's frustrating.
The fickle Canadian gun consumers confused demands for a precision bolt gun, heavy barreled, balanced semi auto NR, $1600 black rifle NO SUBSTITUTES may have had something to do with it......
 
jmiddy said:
cr5

so do you own BCL102 or on a preorder
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If you're implying that if I don't own one I don't know what I'm talking about you're wrong. I am fully capable of reading and being objective. I've owned a couple AR-10's, more AR-15's than I can count and numerous 308 based semi autos over the years. I'm simply not so desperate for a NR semi that I'm willing to overlook deficiencies reported by others just because most of the rifles so far have been ok. If you own one that is working well then I'm happy for you but pretending nothing is wrong when there have been as many negative reports as there have is ignorant. I understand we're talking about a small percentage of rifles with problems, my issue is that there are very few of these in customers hands so far which translates into a higher than what I consider acceptable percentage of problem firearms, if it was one rifle every thousand that had bad gas rings or whatever that's not bad but when it's one in thirty that's not a real good percentage and the chances of buying one that has issues is higher than I like. Does anyone know how many rifles were in the first delivery? 50? 100? And how many guns have has issues? 4? 5? Not many, but more than there should have been considering how few rifles were in the first batch.
If you have any experience with AR-15's and AR-10's you'd know that gas rings should easily last a couple thousand rounds not a couple hundred. Why are they failing early? I don't know, that is where owning one so I could look closer would help.
For a company with an Aerospace division I expect a higher level of QC and consistency. These are firearms after all, there is a high likelihood of injury or death if the unit malfunctions, if they can send them out with bad rings or a bad bolt there's just as much chance of something critical being out of spec causing a catastrophic failure, so far we've been lucky. They're not building fender flares for pickups, I expect the level of QC to be a lot higher considering what they're selling.

The rifle has a lot of potential but until they can build 99% of them right I'll wait. I have plenty of non restricted black rifles to play with while I wait.
I do own NEA products that I'm very happy with and am not a hater, just not blind to their history and don't want to throw my money down till they sort out their issues. They're close, but not quite there yet.
By the way, as for the rifle itself, from what I see, if they ditch the "match" chamber and get their consistency up to par I'd be happy with what they are selling for the price they are asking. It's what many people have been dreaming about for years but NEA/BCL just needs to improve on their consistency, this is exactly what ruined their sales years ago, too many people having to use the warranty on a new rifle that the final inspection before leaving the manufacturer should have caught.
 
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cr5 said:
If you're implying that if I don't own one I don't know what I'm talking about you're wrong. I am fully capable of reading and being objective. I've owned a couple AR-10's, more AR-15's than I can count and numerous 308 based semi autos over the years. I'm simply not so desperate for a NR semi that I'm willing to overlook deficiencies reported by others just because most of the rifles so far have been ok. If you own one
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snipped your wall of text
didnt imply anything just asked a question

I dont have mine yet 2nd order waiting, I reload, can walk my way around changing things on AR's, I fully expect this rifle to be just fine, change trigger, mount scope, reload rounds and shoot the rifle, that is all im hopping for and if by chance im not happy I will change the barrel out myself.

take care
 
Travis Bickle said:
I've been saying this for a while.
Until they stop trying to make a $1600 dollar semi auto shoot like a $5K precision bolt gun (which none of them seem to do anyway) I'm out. This seems to make the rifle unreliable due to tight chambers causing feeding, extraction problems etc
Just make it a $1600 dead reliable, semi auto with standard rack grade AR10 accuracy and lighter barrel profile. Good to go.
They're so close yet so far away with this rifle, it's frustrating.
The fickle Canadian gun consumers confused demands for a precision bolt gun, heavy barreled, balanced semi auto NR, $1600 black rifle NO SUBSTITUTES may have had something to do with it......
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Man, considering the accuracy of the thing it should have had a light contour barrel for sure. When I said that too, before anyone had even shot one, I heard "lol hit the gym".
 
Joel said:
Man, considering the accuracy of the thing it should have had a light contour barrel for sure. When I said that too, before anyone had even shot one, I heard "lol hit the gym".
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Yeah lol
That's a classic. My M14 is just as heavy all around and I shoot it all day.
It's not a weight issue. It's a confusing design issue. It's that they put a big honking f**k off barrel on it with a nuns ###### tight chamber to try and make it some kind of precision black rifle to appease the majority of Canadian Gun owners who measure a gun only by whether it can put 3 rounds of precision hand loaded ammo into 1/2" group at 100 meters or something.
Now it's just a pointlessly heavy NR black rifle with rifle to rifle inconsistency and reliability problems with average/above average accuracy depending on luck of the draw lol

I couldn't care less about chasing the bolt gun accuracy in a semi gas gun dragon at $1600. It's foolish. I will take 2 MOA and 100% reliable with any ammo any day.
I'm content to wait a long time for them to maybe hammer out the reliability issues in the distant future or maybe just publish any information at all about the rifle.
Even if you could rebarrel it, AR10 barrels are pricey and because of the apparent top secret code of silence surrounding any basic specs on the rifle, you may not even be able to mount what you bought and be stuck and out a lot of cash. Buying a new AR10 barrel and installing it will bump this thing well up over the $2K mark at that point. Into the same market as used FAMAE's, XCR-M's etc Hell there's a used RFB up for $2300 right now.

I will say the one I shot twice now, can shoot well once you have found ammo it likes. But it's picky. Very picky. I doubt the heavy barrel on it makes any difference in the accuracy whatsoever, once it heats up it stays fackin' hot for a long time.

Big meh on the 102 for now for me anyhow.
 
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Travis Bickle said:
Yeah lol
That's a classic. My M14 is just as heavy all around and I shoot it all day.
It's not a weight issue. It's a confusing design issue. It's that they put a big honking f**k off barrel on it with a nuns ###### tight chamber to try and make it some kind of precision black rifle to appease the majority of Canadian Gun owners who measure a gun only by whether it can put 3 rounds of precision hand loaded ammo into 1/2" group at 100 meters or something.
Now it's just a pointlessly heavy NR black rifle with rifle to rifle inconsistency and reliability problems with average/above average accuracy depending on luck of the draw lol

I couldn't care less about chasing the bolt gun accuracy in a semi gas gun dragon at $1600. It's foolish. I will take 2 MOA and 100% reliable with any ammo any day.
I'm content to wait a long time for them to maybe hammer out the reliability issues in the distant future or maybe just publish any information at all about the rifle.
Even if you could rebarrel it, AR10 barrels are pricey and because of the apparent top secret code of silence surrounding any basic specs on the rifle, you may not even be able to mount what you bought and be stuck and out a lot of cash. Buying a new AR10 barrel and installing it will bump this thing well up over the $2K mark at that point. Into the same market as used FAMAE's, XCR-M's etc Hell there's a used RFB up for $2300 right now.

I will say the one I shot twice now, can shoot well once you have found ammo it likes. But it's picky. Very picky. I doubt the heavy barrel on it makes any difference in the accuracy whatsoever, once it heats up it stays fackin' hot for a long time.

Big meh on the 102 for now for me anyhow.
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So don't ####in buy it.
 
i bought one on the second preorder,
if it has reluability issues with xm80 it will get the dpms bolt, and cam pin upgrade
if still reliability issues it will get a new barrel, I will go with a lighter barrel at that point
 
This is why I was reluctant to comment on the issue too ;)

The weight of a barrel doesn't mean much. It is well machined from a good blank, or it ain't.

The fact that they are so dang picky really makes me wonder about things like chamber and bore alignment, etc. Usually when a rifle really likes some ammo and really hates others, something there is out of whack.

The tight chamber literally serves no purpose. Reminds me of when people lap a USGI bolt into a Nork M14 and have like one thou of clearance and call it a "match chamber". No, you have match headspace maybe. The rest of the dimensions are quite generous. Still shoots fine! I would much rather know that the chamber was cut concentrically with the bore and it was well crowned, and if it was a different design, that the threads were cut square with the chamber and bore as well. (After having been taught to dial indicate off the outside of the barrel *LOL* this was a bit of a eureka moment.)

Anyway, if the people who bought it like it, I am really happy for them. It IS pretty cool that you can have that gun in an NR format. All I am sayin is it should shoot just as well if not even better with a thinner profile barrel.
 
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cyphie said:
I have shot a few hundred rounds of norc in my 102 with no problems.
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The problem with this comment is that you need to realize that if your rifle feeds and extracts Norinco ammo reliably it means BCL/NEA f'd up cutting your chamber and instead of the "match" chamber your rifle was supposed to have it was cut sloppy. It worked out in your favor this time but it was a screw up from the manufacturer. Either that or your batch of Norinco is off spec, 50/50 chance of either considering the manufacturers involved. Try some Norc from another crate and see if it still feeds.


mikethebike said:
i bought one on the second preorder,
if it has reluability issues with xm80 it will get the dpms bolt, and cam pin upgrade
if still reliability issues it will get a new barrel, I will go with a lighter barrel at that point
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You realize that by the time you're finished upgrading the barrel, bolt, trigger, handguard, grip, stock you will have the same money into an NEA rifle as a Modern Hunter would have cost you? The only issue the MH has is the "match" chamber which was a mistake on that rifle as well but least if you find ammo it likes you can get consistent accuracy, so far the 102 looks like a 2 moa at best rifle if you take your time and keep the barrel cool but more like 4-5 moa if you let it get hot.
First thing I would change is the barrel, they look good but are obviously not well stress relieved.
 
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