Best Bolt Action Milsurp

As for the whole best bolt action topic.

I can't comment cause I'm all over the place. One day ill say it's my Kropatschek and the next it will be a k31.

So the answer to "which is the best bolt action milsurp" is

"I don't know"
 
GunsNotPuns said:
No love for the M1903 Springfield? As much as I enjoy shooting many of the rifles mentioned in this thread I think I love shooting the M1903 the most...and if you hunt you can find them in the OP's price range.
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Hmmmmmm, yep I love my 1918 dated 1903 Springfield. It's way up there on my favorites list for sure!!!
 
PinkyPlinker said:
But have you found one that you dug out of the ground that will hit a bottle cap at 1859 yds?
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Closest I've come was an early Remington M1903 with a toasted barrel and somewhat pitted receiver. It wasn't a good candidate for restoration so I sporterised it after installing a new barrel, sporter stock, Redfield Jr mount, Burris 6x scope, Beuler safety and trigger guard/ mag with a hinged floorplate. It's a MOA shooter with 150, 165 and 180 gr handloads and has gotten me some nice deer over the years. No bottle caps and nothing shot beyond 200 years though.;) I like to hunt deer, not just go out and shoot at them.

Springfields never disappoint. As long as the barrel is sound, tights are sight and bedding is good, and quality ammo is used (no dug up stuff) they are consistently good shooters. Mind you, that can be said about many quality bolt action MILSURPS in good condition. I've enjoyed excellent results from extensive shooting of Swede Mausers, P14/M1917 Enfields, MkIII/No4 Enfields, as well as a MkIII Ross and a M27 Finnish Mosin-Nagant.

Its worth remembering that most nations invested a huge R&D effort to develop military rifles that were reliable, safe and sufficiently accurate for their
troops.
 
I havent waded through all the answers but the best bolt action milsurp for a Canadian to own (imo) is a Long Branch No.4
 
Still alive said:
"A beer cap at 1700m"??? With a sniper Mosin? This I got to see!

I don't think I could find a beer bottle cap at 10m let alone hit one at 1700m!
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Methinks the poster meant a "beer KEG cap"........at least with a keg top he'd have a chance of seeing it - and maybe hitting it (with a good deal of luck :d)
 
shredder said:
Methinks the poster meant a "beer KEG cap"........at least with a keg top he'd have a chance of seeing it - and maybe hitting it (with a good deal of luck :d)
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I'm not sure about that. A keg was mentioned and he quickly reverted back to his answer of it was a cap.

If it was a keg how many Microns Of Angle would that be??
 
SemTex is not that hard,and originally the nitro-penta was commonly used in the German 7,92 rounds which were well known as S.m.K l'spür Verbessert used in aviation-issued MG17 and also as I know they were commonly used in MG34 as well-I found some belts loaded with these rounds-they were found in machinegunner's nests.

I heard that some children who lived back in the first decade after the war which almost everyone had guns just for fun,were sometimes heavily injured because they loaded these Verbessert rounds in their K-98 rifles just because they didn't know the markings so they pulled them from the MG34 belts they could find and as I know the best thing that could happen to K-98 if you load it with such round is that you will no longer be able to #### it without a sledgehammer,and most likely it will blow up.

The Verbessert rounds have 17.5 percent higher velocity and so it's pressure is 38 percent higher which means 5 thousand atm.instead of 3,5 thousand which is appropriate for the MG34 thick barrel which withstands maybe everything even the real SemTex or TNT load(never actually tried that madness and never will),so if the receiver is normal milsurp I think that it will work as normal.

And about the sniper Mosin I was telling about-maybe I was simply lucky or something but the real aces sniper challenge during WW2 was when the German snipers were shooting successfully the officer's cap exactly in the star badge on it,as well as Russian sniper aces were doing the same thing with Germans both for terrorising the enemy troops.

The funny thing was that when in 1941 the first German sniper shot couple of cap stars-the scared Russian colonel ordered to strike the forest where that sniper was sitting with 1 Katusha battery(30 vehicles×15 rockets each)and together with two division artillery units (approximately 2 hundreds of 152 or 122mm cannons)so when the heavy like hell strike started atomizing that forest the scared sniper ran out of the tree line and then the whole two regiments(2400 soldiers summarised)all like one opened fire on two guys-the sniper and his assistant with everything they had!So that seems to be like the best fire-show of all times))

Reminds me of the case on the military shooting range when the fox went out of the forest in front of 400 troopers and 5 APC-s several seconds before the shooting training should have been started-and when the major ordered to open fire-all troopers immediately emptied their AK-74 30 round mags and PKP(modernized PKM,called "Pecheneg")100 and 200 round belts as well as all the APC-s emptied their 50 round belts for KPVT HMGs and the funny thing is that not a single bullet hited the each one's personal target-all that bullet swarm was fired in the direction of the poor animal so in first 1/10 of second the dust cloud already covered the place where the fox was and when the dust erased from the air,shivering with the all 400 men's laughter-I saw only couple of orange and white wool small pieces which was all the remaining signs of the fox))So that was possibly a bit rough but funny like hell)))I think that the remainings of those 2 Germans were even smaller than that)))
 
As for the shot which everyone is discussing this hard I can tell you that first of all I made it with 4-32× scope tuned to 32× magnification of course so it was not that hard to see that beer cap.
And besides I am going to repeat that stuff in Canada when my barrel will finally arrive.So if someone wants to see how I will repeat that stuff in Canada(where I am currently situated and will be situated in the observeable future as well)than please advise me where in Ontario(the closer to Toronto the better)I have the possibility of finding enough or at least comparable distance range.And bring me some beer caps of course;-)))

Besides I already wait for the hunting licence in addition to my PAL.So maybe some crop field or anything?And I also ordered the PTRS-41 for my collection plus hunting purpose(as I can not purchase full-auto MG34 or MG42 for example,that will be trustable alternative for hunting bears)and it will arrive in January or February as they said.So everybody is welcome to come and see beer cap shooting in my own executing of them from the mentioned ranges!

And also I will need some gunsmith who can provide the necessary barrel enforcing measures including making the very precision screwing of all the barrel's exterior in order to screw it in the enforcement cylindrical(or conus) piece of metal with the inside matching screwing made-so I mean that it will increase the barrel's thickness because I want to be able load the rounds with 7N14 bullets and pure nitro-penta instead of 2/3 powder with 1/3 of nitro-penta which I used in the case with my That rifle and beer caps.

The 7N14 is my favourite bullet for 7,62×54R among those which are available here,and in that experiment I expect the initial velocity of that bullet from 80 centimetres barrel(which is arriving to me in January I suppose-actually not the barrel from my caps case but even longer plus supposingly the same accurate,after accurising measures I am going to apply to it's bore),will be exceeding 1050 metres per second due to full charge of nitro-penta.Estimating even actually 1100+ metres per second.So it will be the experiment of making the maximised 7,62×54R long range shooting possible.As I counted the tables of distance/velocity in extrapolation,it will remain supersonic until at least 1500 metres from the muzzle end,maybe more.
 
Lee-Enfield – High maintenance British contraptions that only an owner of an old high maintenance British motorcycle or sports car could truly love. For royalist colonials.
03 Springfield- Dangerous Yankee contraptions that require you to do extensive heat-treatment research in order that they not blow up on you. Academics and Historians like them.
Mannlicher - Not very dangerous contraptions, because you will never find any ammunition for them. They appeal to members of the former Austro-Hungarian Empire, along with goulash.
Mosin-Nagant - Too simple to be really called contraptions, they verge on being clubs, although the Finnish ones are well made clubs. Both ice fishermen and seal hunters like them.
Mauser – Billions served. The Big Mac of bolt action military rifles, and just as reliable, tasteless and boring.
Enfield P/14/P17- A bulky copy of a Mauser designed by Lee-Enfield haters who saw a Mauser once.
Arisaka – Japanese copy of a Mauser (see above). Better than a Korean copy of a Mauser.
Ross – Scotch-Canadian copy of a Mannlicher (see above.) Appeals to people who have an opinion about CBC.
 
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Just to keep things in perspective, ballistics tables for a 168gr .308 bullet with a MV of 2800 fps show a bullet drop of 34.75 feet and a wind drift of 18 feet at 1000 yds/914 metres....and we're talking 1700 metres here.

A beer cap can get unlucky at 1000 metres, at least once.;) But then we get back to the perennial question about rifle marksmanship at extreme ranges, "was this shot repeatable or was it just $hit-house luck or something a bit more odorifous ?"

Plunging fire at long ranges was once employed as a useful technique for long range machine gunnery and range tables were developed to plan and predict this. This tactic was used extensively to harass and beat up enemy rear areas in WW1 and was still being employed in WW2.

We had a family friend who was a Vickers gunner in the SLI in Italy and used to talk about "hailing Jerry" with indirect MG fire. Unfortunately Jerry bit back and brassed him up with mortars in return. I visited him in hospital in 1965/66 when he was undergoing an operation to have some of the fragments removed from his arm.
 
That is so damned brilliant I have nothing more to add.

Rob said:
Lee-Enfield – High maintenance British contraptions that only an owner of an old high maintenance British motorcycle or sports car could truly love. For royalist colonials.
03 Springfield- Dangerous Yankee contraptions that require you to do extensive heat-treatment research in order that they not blow up on you. Academics and Historians like them.
Mannlicher - Not very dangerous contraptions, because you will never find any ammunition for them. They appeal to members of the former Austro-Hungarian Empire, along with goulash.
Mosin-Nagant - Too simple to be really called a contraptions, they verge on being clubs, although the Finnish ones are well made clubs. Both ice fishermen and seal hunters like them.
Mauser – Billions served. The Big Mac of bolt action military rifles, and just as reliable, tasteless and boring.
Enfield P/14/P17- A bulky copy of a Mauser designed by Lee-Enfield haters who saw a Mauser once.
Arisaka – Japanese copy of a Mauser (see above). Better than a Korean copy of a Mauser.
Ross – Scotch-Canadian copy of a Mannlicher (see above.) Appeals to people who have an opinion about CBC.
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