Best HD option in .223?

I hope we never have to be in this situation, PK.

And I hope your instinctive point and shoot theory works for you. I believe we should train up to a good flash sight picture whenever possible, not go for instinct at 3am and adrenaline gushing. But that’s just me. Have a good night.
 
shawn said:
Dude you really need get some training and do some research

Where does this muscle memory put the sights when this is happening? Between your eye and the target.

Whether or not you get hard front sight focus is irrelevant, you are still aiming with the sights. You have these weird preconceptions that are simply not supported by science or reality. It like you started to get the info on this but started on chapter 5 skipping all before and ending at chapter 8 ignoring all after.

Shawn
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You said it yourself "muscle memory put the sights" "Between your eye and the target"

Muscle memory did it for you, not your vision

Bingo, you just proved my point.
 
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PinaKaleada said:
You say "muscle memory put the sights" "Between your eye and the target"

Your muscle memory did it for you, not your vision

Bingo, you just proved my point.
Click to expand...

:rolleyes:

You are right my vision did not raise my gun, wow you just proved sights are useless and should not be included with guns LOL

Shawn
 
shawn said:
:rolleyes:

You are right my vision did not raise my gun, wow you just proved sights are useless and should not be included with guns LOL

Shawn
Click to expand...

Muscle memory allows you to repeat the position at where the sights would align. Aka practice natural sight alignment.

Therefore when muscle memory is developed, you wouldn't need to align the sights for your gun to repeatedly be at the same location in stress.... at 5m

You literally proved my point. I can't find a better way to conclude the discussion. Thank you.
 
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PinaKaleada said:
I think....

I believe...

I believe...

I just suspect...
Click to expand...


You can stop now. You don’t know what you’re talking about. You don’t understand the physiology involved or the neuroscience when building and strengthening neural pathways with proper training, or the physiological responses of the body under extreme stress.

One thing that does seem pretty clear by your attempt at describing POA/POI, is that you probably don’t use your sights very often.

As others have suggested, get some proper training, and learn to properly and accurately shoot a pistol while using your sights.
 
PinaKaleada said:
Muscle memory allows you to repeat the position at where the sights would align. Aka practice natural sight alignment.

Therefore when muscle memory is developed, you wouldn't need to align the sights for your gun to repeatedly be at the same location in stress.... at 5m

You literally proved my point. I can't find a better way to conclude the discussion. Thank you.
Click to expand...

Your ignorance is just sad. Especially since you refuse to actually listen to the people that have/do this for a living. Also do you not notice how not a single person has agreed with you? Do you not think if I am wrong and all the current modern gunfight technique is wrong and all the instructors that teach this are wrong that at least one other person would agree with you? Or do you think you have come up with something revolutionary that has never been seen before?

Like your sights LOL

Shawn
 
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wicked_police said:
You can stop now. You don’t know what you’re talking about. You don’t understand the physiology involved or the neuroscience when building and strengthening neural pathways with proper training, or the physiological responses of the body under extreme stress.

One thing that does seem pretty clear by your attempt at describing POA/POI, is that you probably don’t use your sights very often.

As others have suggested, get some proper training, and learn to properly and accurately shoot a pistol while using your sights.
Click to expand...

It would be more constructive to tell me why I’m wrong, than to just say I’m wrong.

Let’s say I’m ignorant and full of crap. Could you please at least explain where I’ve been mistaken in POA/POI and physiology? I’ll admit I’m wrong if you can tell me why.
 
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shawn said:
Your ignorance is just sad. Especially since you refuse to actually listen to the people that have/do this for a living. Also do you not notice how not a single person has agreed with you? Do you not think if I am wrong and all the current modern gunfight technique is wrong and all the instructors that teach this are wrong that at least one other person would agree with you? Or do you think you have come up with something revolutionary that has never been seen before?

Like your sights LOL

Shawn
Click to expand...

Stop being combative. We agree with each other and you already summarized it nicely as "muscle memory put the sights" "Between your eye and the target"

From Oxford dictionary:
Muscle memory, noun, the ability to reproduce a particular movement without conscious thought, acquired as a result of frequent repetition of that movement.

Refocusing vision away from threat to notice the sights are off, then adjusting the front sights to align the three dot is far from without conscious thought and takes more than muscle memory to reproduce. Definitely not what I want from frequent repetition.

But of course you knew that already, I’m just unpacking your own words for you in a precise way. (Even though you did show disinterest with precise language in post #135)
 
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PinaKaleada said:
Stop being combative. We agree with each other and you already summarized it nicely as "muscle memory put the sights" "Between your eye and the target"

From Oxford dictionary:
Muscle memory, noun, the ability to reproduce a particular movement without conscious thought, acquired as a result of frequent repetition of that movement.

Refocusing vision away from threat to notice the sights are off, then adjusting the front sights to align the three dot is far from without conscious thought and takes more than muscle memory to reproduce. Definitely not what I want from frequent repetition.

But of course you knew that already, I’m just unpacking your own words for you in a precise way. (Even though you did show disinterest with precise language in post #135)
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Sorry dude you are still wrong

Your theories on gun fighting based on plinking that some how muscle memory doesn't apply to sight pictures is simply retarded. Get over it

Shawn
 
shawn said:
Sorry dude you are still wrong

Your theories on gun fighting based on plinking that some how muscle memory doesn't apply to sight pictures is simply retarded. Get over it

Shawn
Click to expand...
Muscle memory is a motor function. It happens without conscious thought by definition.

To find and adjust a sight picture is a conscious thought.

However this doesn’t matter to you does it? All you do is dismiss and say it’s wrong.

But bro, you said it yourself in post #158, you just don’t want to agree we’re on the same page.
 
Are we still at it?

To find the sight is not a conscious thought. It is instinctive due to muscle memory as you put it. There is no adjustment of sight picture either. We are not shooting groups at 25yds. That’s why it’s called a flash sight picture. You put sights on center of mass and go.

I agree there is an element of training here to groove the muscle memory to get the sight picture. A novice shooter may have problems here at 3am and resort to hip shooting and blasting away without aim. But this is not proper training and dangerous.
 
Still alive said:
Are we still at it?

To find the sight is not a conscious thought. It is instinctive due to muscle memory as you put it. There is no adjustment of sight picture either. We are not shooting groups at 25yds. That’s why it’s called a flash sight picture. You put sights on center of mass and go.

I agree there is an element of training here to groove the muscle memory to get the sight picture. A novice shooter may have problems here at 3am and resort to hip shooting and blasting away without aim. But this is not proper training and dangerous.
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Yes I understand. The whole exchange with Shawn is about anything within 5 meters. And whether it helps with hit rate.
 
PinaKaleada said:
Yes I understand. The whole exchange with Shawn is about anything within 5 meters. And whether it helps with hit rate.
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And I just explained above that it depends on who is doing the shooting, like your video of the decent shooter. A decent shooter can likely do it due to muscle memory and quickly acquiring the flash picture at 5m. There is no change of aim for a center of mass hit at 5m. Guaranteed.

A novice or normal shooter may make a hit but will just as likely miss even at 5m if shooting with “ instinctive pointing”. A bad grip and jerking the heck out of the trigger in poor light, can do bad things, even at close distances.
 
Still alive said:
And I just explained above that it depends on who is doing the shooting, like your video of the decent shooter. A decent shooter can likely do it due to muscle memory and quickly acquiring the flash picture at 5m. There is no change of aim for a center of mass hit at 5m. Guaranteed.

A novice or normal shooter may make a hit but will just as likely miss even at 5m if shooting with “ instinctive pointing”. A bad grip and jerking the heck out of the trigger in poor light, can do bad things, even at close distances.
Click to expand...

You’re right, I totally agree that’s how it is. It absolutely depends on proficiency.
 
PinaKaleada said:
You’re right, I totally agree that’s how it is. It absolutely depends on proficiency.
Click to expand...

So you agree that using sights are better than not? And it all depends on the proficiency of the shooter?

Which means that you agree that less proficient shooters may just point and shoot and hope for the best? Is this not dangerous? Why are you advocating this technique then?
 
android-android said:
Suggesting to members of this board that Section 28, specifically para (a) sub para (i), permits them to purchase a firearm for home defense is misleading and irresponsible.
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I don’t think Shaun was suggesting anything. He merely said that it is in the Act. Also, this information should have been covered in the CRFSC and should not be new to anyone on this site.
 
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