Best loads for bear?
- Thread starter collector67
- Start date
I don't recall where the original poster hinted he was mortified of any bears.
Back on to the O.P.'s topic, slugs and practice as a few others suggested. The Challenger slugs sold by Cabelas/SIR have a decent reputation for hardness somewhere in between a regular foster-type slug and a Brenneke.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
The chances of having a problem with a bear go up with the amount of time you spend in bear habitat. If you don't live in a place where a bear might chase you into the house as happened to a local fellow here recently, then your chance of having a dangerous bear encounter are less than might be the case here. Conversely if you are in the business of providing bear security to the public, your chances of having a dangerous bear encounter increase exponentially.
I don't like buckshot for big game. I carry some in my side saddle in case my dog gets badly injured and we are miles from help or in case we cross paths with a rabid fox. Other than that the use of buckshot is a very specific one, such as when a bear must be destroyed in a crowded area such as a town or a congested camp site. It is unlikely that the pellets would exit the target so buckshot is a better choice than slugs in such circumstances, although naturally any shooting around other people must be done with greatest of care regardless of the circumstances. The light individual pellet weight from buckshot and the low impact velocity are what limits penetration. If the range to the bear has caused the pattern to open so that it causes multiple minor wounds rather than a single massive wound, it's effect is greatly diminished. Expect to have to shoot more than once and probably several times.
If you carry a shotgun for bear defense, slugs are the correct answer to the ammunition question. I like Brenneke, but they are factory loaded to a lower velocity than either Federal or Challenger. They also have lighter recoil, so if I have to make a fast follow up shot it is quicker to get back on target than with faster slugs. The wound cavity from the Brenneke has been discussed at sufficient length that it does not need to be repeated here. Perhaps they have the best balance between weight and velocity to ensure maximum penetration, where faster slugs might either break up on large bones, or limit their penetration due to excessive expansion. Having said that Garry Shelton, as bear wise a fellow as you are likely to meet, thinks highly of the Federals. My complaint against the Federals is that the deep set primer might result in misfires in some guns, as they say the scariest sound in the world is a click when one expects a bang.
I don't like buckshot for big game. I carry some in my side saddle in case my dog gets badly injured and we are miles from help or in case we cross paths with a rabid fox. Other than that the use of buckshot is a very specific one, such as when a bear must be destroyed in a crowded area such as a town or a congested camp site. It is unlikely that the pellets would exit the target so buckshot is a better choice than slugs in such circumstances, although naturally any shooting around other people must be done with greatest of care regardless of the circumstances. The light individual pellet weight from buckshot and the low impact velocity are what limits penetration. If the range to the bear has caused the pattern to open so that it causes multiple minor wounds rather than a single massive wound, it's effect is greatly diminished. Expect to have to shoot more than once and probably several times.
If you carry a shotgun for bear defense, slugs are the correct answer to the ammunition question. I like Brenneke, but they are factory loaded to a lower velocity than either Federal or Challenger. They also have lighter recoil, so if I have to make a fast follow up shot it is quicker to get back on target than with faster slugs. The wound cavity from the Brenneke has been discussed at sufficient length that it does not need to be repeated here. Perhaps they have the best balance between weight and velocity to ensure maximum penetration, where faster slugs might either break up on large bones, or limit their penetration due to excessive expansion. Having said that Garry Shelton, as bear wise a fellow as you are likely to meet, thinks highly of the Federals. My complaint against the Federals is that the deep set primer might result in misfires in some guns, as they say the scariest sound in the world is a click when one expects a bang.
If you are concerned about bears only load with what you want to use on the animal not silly warning shots. Buck and slugs go bang too.........
Trying to save a few cents when life is concerned is well.....stupid.
Bears are fast, if you doubt me go try to out run one.
Hell, if you dont want to hurt the bear maybe the best bet is to stay out of his yard!!
Applefarmer
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Lime Stone City
A few things I've learned about Black Bears from experience :
1. Don't Panic
2. The bear can have my fish, and I'll just back away.
3. Don't get between the cubs and Momma
4. Just because your picking wild blue berries with a dozen others, doesn't mean it's one of your friends or family that just sat down to pick on the other side of the bush. Again, Don't Panic, there's other bushes and back away slow and easy and the bear can have my berries in the pail if he wants as well.
5. I've had the shotgun there with me, but have yet to shoot a bear, loaded with 12ga 3" slugs. Common sense, don't panic, you might find as I have the bear is very close 3' or so before you know it's a bear your next to. Shotgun slung over the shoulder with your hands full doesn't do you much good. So don't startle the bear.
1. Don't Panic
2. The bear can have my fish, and I'll just back away.
3. Don't get between the cubs and Momma
4. Just because your picking wild blue berries with a dozen others, doesn't mean it's one of your friends or family that just sat down to pick on the other side of the bush. Again, Don't Panic, there's other bushes and back away slow and easy and the bear can have my berries in the pail if he wants as well.
5. I've had the shotgun there with me, but have yet to shoot a bear, loaded with 12ga 3" slugs. Common sense, don't panic, you might find as I have the bear is very close 3' or so before you know it's a bear your next to. Shotgun slung over the shoulder with your hands full doesn't do you much good. So don't startle the bear.
Thanks everyone, for your input... some very interesting replies! Is there any specific type/weight of slug recommended for bears? I have heard that sabot rounds offer better penetration, whereas "normal?" slugs can be more brittle and fragment into just the surface tissue. I agree, I will probably never have to use it, but I have had a few encounters with bears where I had nothing on me but a lockblade and the pucker factor was pretty high. In June I was camping outside Lillooet and I came across no less than 6 bears, and I wasn't too worried as I had my M44 carbine with me, but that sucker is too damn heavy to tote around on a 15KM hike. Bottom line: If I had to use my shotty against a bear it would be a last resort, and I wouldn't want to have to track a wounded one through the bush to finish it off. Anyone recommend a good name brand and model of slug/sabot round that will do the job quickly and humanely?
I'd be willing to spend the actual $1.00 extra and have buckshot or a slug in place. In a real bear attack you might be lucky to get off even one round - why would you want it to be birdshot? Makes no sense at all.
My only bear encounter was at 72 deg North after an impromptu camping trip due to bad weather. We landed the helicopter and waited the weather out, with nothing more than a crappy beat up over/under shotgun and slugs, all 5 of them. The big white bear closed in realy fast on us, probably thinking he'd get a good supper out of us. My PETA-member, vegan-hippy co-pilot would have killed me with the remainder slugs if I killed the endangered species. From the roof of the helicopter, I managed to scare off the big bear with the 1st slug at close distance before I had to put the second one between it's shoulder blades - I had heard before that polar bear had very thick skulls. Anyways, I promised myself after that situation that I would never be stucked in a position like that. I'll have a more suitable shotty with way more rounds and good slugs.
So, slugs ready to go and a good gun...
So, slugs ready to go and a good gun...
MuleyStalker
CGN Regular
- Location
- Wainwright, Ab
After being an outfitter here in Alberta, I've had more than a few close encounters with bears. Running a bear baiting operation will do that , I guess. Anyway, I found that 000 buck worked better than 00, as far as penetration went on a broadside bear )usually right through or the pellets ended up under the hide on the far side), and 000 also has really good stopping power. Three bears shot during follow-ups, and not one got up after the first shot. I also had some hunters from Illinois come up with their 12 ga slug guns, and they worked great.
Applefarmer
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Lime Stone City
I guess it comes down to live and let live. Been there, done that, and I enjoy knowing the bears are out there. Remington 3" slugs work great if you have to shoot.
More like 40 km/hr. A bear can out run a horse over short distances.
The past three times my great uncle went out hunting and shot a deer, all three times there was a bear (twice was a grizzly) sniffing around for the carcass of the deer! All three times he stood his ground and lit a big fire near the carcass and had a friend stand guard while he cleaned the deer. Once that was done they left in a BIG hurry!
Also a book my grandfather owned was written in the 60's I think (sadly the book was destroyed by water damage). Anyways the book was about bear attacks. One chapter was a Conservation Officer or Park Warden from the Jasper area and he stated that he used a simple .22 to kill problem bears in Jasper and around the park due to people and homes. I was quite surprised when I read that as he stated he only ever used one shot to kill them.
Also a book my grandfather owned was written in the 60's I think (sadly the book was destroyed by water damage). Anyways the book was about bear attacks. One chapter was a Conservation Officer or Park Warden from the Jasper area and he stated that he used a simple .22 to kill problem bears in Jasper and around the park due to people and homes. I was quite surprised when I read that as he stated he only ever used one shot to kill them.
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- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
Bear bang then OO or OOO buck then slugs.
Personally I believe it is a poor practice to fire non-lethal ammunition in the same gun as lethal ammo. Particularly bear bangers have a nasty habit of leaving partial barrel obstructions, particularly if you have a detonation in the barrel. This tends to occur from time to time. It could also lead to a situation where when you need to respond quickly with lethal ammo and you essentially have an empty gun or nearly as bad, shoot a bear with a lethal round when you expected a cracker shell.
The correct procedure is to work in pairs where the shooter with the lethal ammo backs up the fellow with the bear scare gun. If you are alone, the correct answer is to carry a scare pistol and have the shotgun loaded with lethal ammo. Neither am I a fan of buckshot for big game, but that's another issue.
