Even the US military is cutting down the barrels on their long range precision rifle such as their m24 rifles and M40 series rifle because shorter thicker contoured barrels are more accurate due to less drastic harmonics. Oh and there is a good video you should watch if you believe shorter barrels are less accurate http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tgKjbySsAik and skip to 7:25.
Best "low-maintenance" AR available?
- Thread starter Allene350
- Start date
And I would say a DD MK 18 is what you are looking for. Invest in quality because it will last a long time. Sure norinco sells a reliable and accurate gun but with the steel they use and the manufacturing processes, how long can it last. If you don't shoot a lot sure that norinco is fine but if you plan on shooting a lot buy a quality gun. I personally shoot a DD M4V5 and in the last 5 range trips it's seen roughly 1100 rounds and I have only lubed it once and gave it a light wipe down. It has also run every brand of ammo I've put in it without a hiccup! AE, MFS, norinco 5.56, and hand loads. You should expect these results with any quality AR LIKE DD, BCM, knights, pws etc etc
With the revolver comparison you have to take into account sight radius as well. The longer sight radius will require you to align the sights more precisely.
TDC is right though, all things equal (ie the quality, straightness of bore, concentricity etc) a shorter barrel will be more rigid and therefore produce better consistency, in a vacuum. Add in wind and distance and you're going to want the extra velocity from the longer barrel to combat its effects. The trick is finding the sweet spot where you start to run into diminishing returns from the extra velocity, while still maintaing some degree of rigidity/portability. Sounds like Knights has picked that to be 18" for their rifles, but it will of course depend on the use of the rifle, the cartidge and specific ammunition being used (powder burn rates, bullet weight etc). There is no cut and dried answer that works for every situation.
"...I'm a total newb..." Hi. You have an RPAL? And belong to a club that allows restricted rifles?
"...prefer a 10.5" barrel..." Re-think that. Too much velocity loss and isn't a serious rifle for an FNG.
"......you're supposed to clean an Ar15......?" RSM said he wanted a word with you.
"...prefer a 10.5" barrel..." Re-think that. Too much velocity loss and isn't a serious rifle for an FNG.
"......you're supposed to clean an Ar15......?" RSM said he wanted a word with you.
Accuracy or rather consistency, is the ability of the mechanical device to produce consistent repeatable performance, also known as a grouping. I'm not concerned with the shooter error, poorly mounted or zeroed optics or ammo. When comparing two barrels with identical criteria(aside from length) with identical ammo, the consisteny/accuracy of the shorter barrel will be greater than that of the longer barrel. To what degree is this improved performance? Likely at a level that is all but unnoticeable. The reason a 10.5" isn't the standard issue is two fold. They don't run nearly as reliably as longer guns or guns with mid length gas systems. This is due entirely to dwell time and the design of the rifle. Second, the loss in velocity has a negative effect on terminal performance as well as long range accuracy due to wind drift etc. There is a happy medium that can be found, and 14.5 or 16" rifles are the answer. Both retain over 90% of the velocity from a standard 20" barrel while being shorter, lighter and more rigid. A 10.5" or similar length is not suitable for distance work regardless of the improved consistency/accuracy of the shorter barrel, it excels in confined spaces or where weight is an issue. That's not to say one can't make good hits as the video posted above demonstrates. Remember, we are talking about a "shorter" barrel, not the shortest barrel. We could compare the 14.5' or 16" to a 20" and the results are far more favourable for the shorter ones. The 20" barrel is a thing of the past, it offers no advantages over 14.5" or 16" versions. The 18" SPR barrels squeeze the absolute most velocity you can get without adding additional unnecessary weight. Have a look at the figures below for a 20" vs 16". The difference is a 3% loss in velocity, not even worth discussing..
M193, Winchester Q3131 55 FMJ AR-15 16 3202
.223 M193, Winchester Q3131 55 FMJ AR-15 20 3275
Here's a better comparison of a 20"/16"/11.5". An 11.5" barrel is only 57% the length of a 20", a loss of 43% total length. Yet it still puts out 89% the velocity. That's an 11% velocity loss for a 47% length reduction(not to mention weight reduction as well). Sounds like an acceptable trade off to me.
.223 M193, Guatemalan 55 FMJ AR-15 11.5 2915
.223 M193, Guatemalan 55 FMJ AR-15 16 3133
.223 M193, Guatemalan 55 FMJ AR-15 20 3274
http://www.ar15.com/content/page.html?id=213
Sight radius is only an issue for the shooter, it has zero effect on the inherent accuracy of the barrel. Aligned sights are aligned sights, its your misalignment, your poor sight alignment with your eye that is the issue, not the distance between the front and rear. Yes, a shorter radius means smaller errors in alignment equal greater errors on target, but that is a function of the shooter.
How is an SBR not a "serious rifle for an FNG"?? If it runs then it will do the job. Please explain your reasoning.
TDC
- Location
- Richmond, BC
If you're newb, get a Norc 10.5 in for $700. It's low cost. As far as a low-maintenance AR is concerned, well, that really depends on you. If you're talking accessories, the platform itself is inherently a bottomless money pit. If you're talking about general rifle maintenance, like taking care of it, well, that's really up to you as well. Some people never clean their rifles out of principal, squeeze the trigger, it goes bang, who cares about the rest......Like anything with metal parts rubbing and contacting, it will eventually need some sort of maintenance, and if it's not occasionally cleaned and oiled, it will eventually fail. I've heard of people just hosing the thing down with WD-40 on the moving parts, and that's it, but me, I like to tear the thing down and detail clean it everytime I use it. I find it therapeutic, two years after buying one, and the honeymoon is still not dead.
You say your budget is $1200-1700, so save the rest for ammo. With a Norc, you can toss it around, drop it, scratch it and not worry about scuffing up your range/safe queen. If you break your Norc, you wouldn't have lost much. If you buy it now, change your mind later and want a more expensive name-brand AR, you can always throw some Deal Extreme/NC Star cool-aid on your Norc and sell it for $1000 like every other yahoo on EE.
You say your budget is $1200-1700, so save the rest for ammo. With a Norc, you can toss it around, drop it, scratch it and not worry about scuffing up your range/safe queen. If you break your Norc, you wouldn't have lost much. If you buy it now, change your mind later and want a more expensive name-brand AR, you can always throw some Deal Extreme/NC Star cool-aid on your Norc and sell it for $1000 like every other yahoo on EE.
Op budget is 1200 to 1700 for the rifle. If you guys are including accessories and ammo in your budgets you're wrong. That being the case the op should purchase the best quality gear his budget can afford and that's likely a DD rifle, new or used. Saving a few bucks with a used unit is great but saving money should not dictate your purchase.
Tdc
Tdc
AlbertaGunslinger
Regular
- Location
- The Wide Open Prairie
Ruger SR556E, not that pistons are required for reliable ARs but if you are not gonna clean it then a piston is gonna beat a DI gun. SR556 is a great option withing your budget, 16" barrel is good enough for mostly everything you could want. Sure you could go for a HK MR556 with a 10.5" barrel but that would be way out of your price range.
I've got a BCM upper on an NEA lower that ran me right around $1200 after shipping + taxes. You can do pretty good if you shop around. Some people have gripes about NEA's, but as a complete lower mine seems to be doing the trick. Can't go wrong with a BCM barrel, either; mine's dead accurate.
Please ignore everyone that mentions Norinco, NEA, DPMS and do this ^^^^^
Daniel Defense is top tier.
I thought stag went broke? If not stag is good stuff.
Obviously he's CB most weekends.
dangertree
Business Rep
- Location
- NL/ON/FL/PL
You might be thinking about someone else on the broke part?
They were in the news a few months back regarding Connecticut and it's 'assault weapon' ban. You might be thinking about that? Neither Colt nor Stag will go broke over lost CT sales. They're very much ok! Agree, on good stuff though.
dangertree
Business Rep
- Location
- NL/ON/FL/PL
Yes, and a couple of other bits, but generally yes. Many people pick up barreled uppers for different uses and use the same bolt carrier group and charging handle, etc.
