>For starters the OP asked for non res RIFLES NOT SHOTGUNS, so STOP >mentioning shotguns!
Actually, the first post on this thread simply mentioned "gun" so...SHOTGUN, SHOTGUN , SHOTGUN!!!!
>The lever gun is a joke when compared to other action types, sorry.
No need to apologize. I agree with your logic but I think this question is open to so many considerations that there really is no pefectly "logical" answer. I do think the one absolute is to "have a gun". All else is secondary.
>The lever was at its peak when it was the latest design to hit the hills. >Those days(years) are long long gone. As for relying on a pump gun over a >lever. Yes, its a wise idea. The pump action firearm(usually a shotgun) is a >much simpler mechanical device than the lever gun. Clearing a stoppage in >a pump gun is also much easier than that of a lever gun. Follow up shots >are simplified with a linear movement as opposed to the pendulum motion of >a lever gun. Magazine capacity of the pump is similar or less than that of >some lever guns so no advantage there. The only other advantage is the >ammo availability and versatility(ability to run all rounds found) so long as >we're talking about shotguns. Which we aren't...
SHOTGUNS...sorry;-) Again, your logic is impecable here but if the time factor of a linear vrs pendulum motion is really that critical then I would suggest that the time it takes to do a mag change with the 858 vrs the XCR makes the latter the hands down winner. No only that, the 10rnd mag availability of the XCR is a huge advantage.
I say this based on the premise we are completely legal and have the resources to choose what we think is best. I'm also taking into consideration we get to test our individual firearms.
Most of us here will do that and have lots of ammo but my initial respose was based on my personal understanding of SHTF. I think we have to think a little outside of ourselves and look at it from the perspective of the average guy just trying to survive and protect his family. He may have to borrow a gun from a friend, and barter for ammo. In this part of Canada there are 30-30's everywhere. They work well, don't draw attention, are easier to hide than most guns and ammo can be had for a long time after most other types get hard to find. I also like that it works well with cast bullets. Something to consider if ammo becomes scarce.
It is a gun for a certain type of SHTF sitiation if you will. The army is not after you and you are not being regularly attacked by armed gangs. There are sporadic crimes by people desparate for food and supplies and you have to take advantage of the oportunity to harvest game and provide defense.
>ver guns are a poor choice if one has the choice to make.
I would provide the link but apparently you can get in trouble for doing it. Google "Gabriel Suarez lever action". He lays it out better than I can.
This thread is posted in the black and green rifles forum, not GD or the shotgun forums. Hence the direction of non res RIFLES. I suppose you could get away with a shotgun sporting a rifled barrel and run slugs, but a shotgun is a poor choice no matter how you dress it up.
As you said, the key is to have access to a firearm, any firearm. After that, its a personal choice which should be heavily influenced by logic.
Your statement about 10 round magazines in an XCR are rather moot. Maintaining or keeping a non res rifle handy(say in the trunk or behind the seat) is the primary reason for an non res in the first place. Being legal prior to a collapse is critical if you wish to make it to the beginning of the show. After sugar goes to sh*t all bets are off. If you feel the need to openly brandish a firearm or use one against another human. The magazine restrictions imposed on us now are of no relevance. Should you need your non res rifle before society collapses, then yes, the 10 round magazine offers an advantage.
If we are discussing the thread topic with the average non prepared joe in mind, we're wasting our time. For those who have neither the desire nor forethought to prepare, any firearm will be both better and worse than any other selection. Any firearm is better than no firearm. However, in the hands of the inexperienced, any firearm is just as bad as no firearm, and often worse. The best selection of medical devices is of little use to the guy with no formal training. Same goes for firearms. The inexperienced with a rifle may very well get themselves shot simply for possessing such a tool. If you're going to carry/brandish one, you better be prepared to use it.
I've read Mr. Saurez's article about lever guns. I agree they are capable, but they are no match for a modern semi auto. The caveat here being the operator. As I mentioned above, the best tools in the hands of the untrained or poorly trained is of little advantage. If the lever is all you have, work with it.
TDC
