Best Scope for F Class

X-fan said:
As far as S&B scopes go I'm going to suggest that they were primarily designed as a tactical scope.

After looking at the 300 yard Canadian F-class target Jerry posted :)eek:) I would think most competitors would find the S&B reticles a bit too heavy and the 25 power a little on the light side.

From what I can see the March looks like the Rolls Royce of the F-class world...With a cost to match.

Hard to beat Nightforce.
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S&B with P4F Reticle are not at all Heavy, with 25power out to 500meter to 1200yeard no problem.
 
I am sure the P4F would be find for Fclass, very clear, I shoot those 3&1/2" clay pigeon 500-600 meter no problem.
If I was Doing Fclass, I would pick!.
 
For F class, I want the ability to see well enough to adjust my aim as little as 1/4" at 500m. You can't when the reticle is wider then the amount you want to adjust.

High mag w/ very fine reticles is desired.

The FCH on my SIII covers approx 1/8" at 300m. I can put the cross hair ON the scoring ring.

For pretty much any other form of shooting, that is TOO fine.

Reticles and click value DO make a difference in F class. Smaller better....at least for me.

If someone invented a 1/10 or even better a 1/16 min click, they better have ALOT of CNC's to crank them out.

Jerry
 
noneck180 said:
My opinion is that the objectives aren't big enough for the amount of magnification some of these scopes have,, 42 X out of a 56mm objesctive doesn't make sense to me..but I am no expert..
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I agree, no sense what so ever.... but I am no "expert" either. It reminds me the Chevy-Ford hp war...V8 vs V10 not that 500hp is realy needed and nobody wants to pay for gas but " we did it b/c we can". The same here- "our 50x50mm scope beats your 45x45mm" when everybody knows that human aye shrinks down to min 2mm dia under full sun and they still push that c*ap on us. If exit pupil is less than 2mm on scope ( and binoculars ) then the whole scope is heavily "compromised".
 
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noneck180 said:
My opinion is that the objectives aren't big enough for the amount of magnification some of these scopes have,, 42 X out of a 56mm objesctive doesn't make sense to me..but I am no expert..
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the Human eye compensates for the amount of light transmitted through a scope. If you were mounting one on a film camera, yes, the amount of light reaching the film would be less than an equivalent scope with a larger objective, but one of the down-sides to a large objective is a very narrow depth of field(focus) . Not a biggie when shooting at known fixed distances, but for varmint hunters, this can be a pain. It is definitely true that the more power you dial-in, the lest light that is transmitted through a scope. Even the excellent NF 12-42's have a noticible loss of image "density" at max power.

Furthermore, the real difference (Mechanical repeatability notwithstanding) between top-end high-magnifcation, variable power scopes, is the edge-to-edge clarity. There is no such thing as a cheap scope (<$1000) that maintains distortion-free edge sharpnness as clear as the centre. In photographic lenses, the clarity of image with a wide-open aperature really reveals the truth of its optical quality.

High Magnification, Brightness, edge-to-edge sharpness: Pick any two
 
It's been said before, but I think it bears repeating- glass and mechanical quality are not the same thing as overall suitability for a given purpose. " What's the best scope?" is not a good question. "It should be what's the best scope for this purpose?" I'd be going S&B all the way for a top flight Tactical rfile. The NF BR scopes simply work for F class, thanks to their 1/8th adjustments, reticle choice, optical quality, and adjustment range. It sounds like Sightron's newest offerings fit the bill as well, but I havn't managed to check them out yet. About the only complaint I have about my NF BR's- I have (2) 12-42's- is the 6 minutes per revolution adjustments. I'd rather have 5 or 10 to make the math easier. I'm sure the overall quality of the S&B is equal or maybe even better than the NF, but I don't know about ajustment value or reticle choices.

March seems to have made huge inroads into NF's foothold in the F class market, but I'd suject that it might be more of a specialist proposition than a new F'er might want to tackle.


A 12-42 NF BR is the standard right now. If it was me, I'd mount a 20 minute rail, and use Burris Signature Zee rings. This will give you maximum flexability to use the elevation and windage in your scope. This setup, on the rifle you discribe, should be more than capable to win any F/Tr match, anywhere. Shoot this setup for a while, and you'll probably decide that you want to make some changes, but you might not too. I've been shooting F/Tr for the last 5 years, on two continents, and about the only thing I haven't changed is the scope. In fact, I bought a second.
 
mpwolf said:
About the only complaint I have about my NF BR's- I have (2) 12-42's- is the 6 minutes per revolution adjustments.
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Forgot to mention that indeed the SIII 10X50 has 10 mins per revolution. That is such a godsend for us math challenged types. yep, Sightron listened.

Most of their other SIII have 15 mins per rev. Not bad as many will be able to cover their distance in one rev to 2 revs. Way better then dialing and dialing round and round counting in 6, or 8.

It would be very easy for Sightron to put a mechanical stop on the turrent and it could make a decent zero stop turrent. Some of their other 1" SII Big Sky scopes have 20 mins per rev. That is very fun and easy to use.

Here is a quirk that is both positive and negative.

The markings on the inner sleeve of the 10X50 turrent has ZERO in the middle then go 1,2, 3 out in either direction.

For windage, this is one of the first scopes that I have seen and it is a superb feature. Shim the scope with the Burris rings to center the windage and you are on the ZERO marking. Dial away and you will always remember where your orig zero was.

For F TR in a gale, dialing more then 1 revolution is a very real possibillity.

Unfortunately, it is also on the elevation turrent. No biggie if you are only using the top half of travel - approx 25mins but for an F TR shooter who needs 30 to 40 mins, you will have to start at a "2" and work up through 1, then 0, then 1, 2, and 3.

For a match shooter at fixed distances, again, no biggie as you just remember such a distance is such an elevation setting BUT for a varminter or LR shooter can be more problematic as you will have to keep track of the numbers. Very uesable of course, but not a no brainer as it so easily could be.

Now if they ever changed the markings on the elevation turrent to 0 on the bottom and work their numbers up (like most turrents), they will have covered ALL the bases.

Yes, I have suggested this to them - so simple to change. Not sure if we will see it.

Beyond that, I have very little to fault the product BUT time will uncover any issues if there are some.

Jerry
 
Jerry it really is amazing how it seems that scope manufacturers really truly seem to know very little about shooting, and how scopes are used for shooting (and I include the big-dollar top of the line ones in this).
 
It's always hard to make a decision like this, the NF seems to be the way to go, jerry the sightron sounds good, but i just dont know enough about it, as well in my eyes it's an untested product, doesn't seem as though that many people have used them ( i could be wrong).

I'm waiting to hear an exact eta on a S&B and from that i will make my decision. It' either the NF or the S&B, honestly i would prefer the S&B for no reason other than i like the brand, but waiting months for it will drive me insane.
 
Several of the SIII Sightrons were offered last year. Response has been ballistic ever since. The company itself has been around for a long time - since 1993.

Sightron is way behind in trying to fill orders which they are trying hard to correct.

So the scope has survived 1yr in the field but in limited numbers. No complaints that I have read and I have had no issues with my scopes or those that I have sold.

This year will see sales increase many times so there will be a much better sense of shooters response and product performance.

So far, so good...

Jerry
 
i'm guessing for F class people would prefer a scope with second focal plane reticles, that way the reticles is magnified along with the image?

Is this correct?
 
If you want to look at S&B scopes for F class you might want to search out the European F class community as they are more familiar with the scope then North American shooters.

Like others I have an NF 12-42 BR and am please with it and it is the standard in optics for F class. That being said if available I would like to get a March scope as their optical quality is as good or better then NF and a big plus is the 12 oz saving with the March
March 24.08oz vs. Nightforces 36oz BUTT and this is big it will cost you almost $100 an oz to get the weight savings. NF costs about $1,400 while the March is $2,500 range. THe other plus is that it has 10 moa pre turn vs. 6 of the NF Br model. The weight saving and other features are very appealing and will be something I purse in the future.

There are a couple of in-depth articles in the UK target shooter magazine about these scopes March is in the Feb 2010 addition and as luck would have the S&B 12-50 in the October 2009 issue.
http://www.targetshooter.co.uk/

If you’re set on the S&B knock yourself out and buy it there isn’t enough field data on the big 12-50 for the rest of us to drop that kind of money but if you want to be one of the first…let us know how it works out.

2nd focal plane is the preferred option for F class as the reticle will stay the same size over the course of the power range and allow you to hold more precisely at the longer distances.

Best of luck
Trevor
 
First Focal plane the reticle enlarges with the target, Seconds Focal plane the reticle does not get bigger. How much power you have in a scope depends on how far your want to shoot. The more magnification, the less verticle adjustment you will have. A lot of guys shoot NF 5.5-22x56 scopes at well over 1000 yards because being at only 22 power still give you lots of elevation. This shouldn't be a problem at 1000 yards but once you get into really long range shooting you need that elevation adjustment.
 
Jerry,
Which model of Sightron would be comparable to the 12-42 X 56 NF 's I've used for 1000 yards ? I was looking around their site and i'm trying to get my head around the different models.

Mike.
 
The other thing you would have to look at is the Elevation and Windage clicks.

The S&B PMII that I looked at this weekend was in milrads (approx 1/3min per click) which IMO is far to course for the game we play, at least for my style it is.
 
CyaN1de said:
The other thing you would have to look at is the Elevation and Windage clicks.

The S&B PMII that I looked at this weekend was in milrads (approx 1/3min per click) which IMO is far to course for the game we play, at least for my style it is.
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That's my only concern w/ the S&B. I'm quite sure the mechanics and glass are up to the task, but I would be less than content w/ 0.1 milrad adjustment, if indeed that is what they have.
 
My Schmidt and Bender PMII 12-50x56 has the P4F reticle and 1/8 MOA adjustments.This scope is simply amazing but it certainly isn't cheap..I am usually in the "cry once" and be done with it camp.Beware of the MARCH as it only has a 5 year NONtransferrable warranty.
 
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