Best WW1/WW2 SMG ?

I posted this in another thread to show the variety of
heat shields/handguards that were put on Suomis.
Pic is stolen from the net.
suomi_zzp.jpg

From left
-KP/-31,
-KP/-31 SJR with compensator,
-Korsu-Suomi (the vacuum-cleaner like nozzle was for
for gas disposal when firing from enclosed spaces as bunkers),
-Tank-Suomi,
-and Barrel Unit SS-II, that is a silenced variation of model 1995.


As for the title of the thread,
the reality is that in ww1 there were very few SMG's.
From those few ones in ww1, I vote for the good ol' Bergmann.
It's actually the one that indicated the SMG direction in the military.
 
There has been several threads on stens here of late, and I have even put one together myself. I like them because of the simplicity, a more basic weapon would be hard to envisage. It is also an easy weapon for almost anyone to put together precisely because it is so basic. The trouble with stens is that at the end of the day they really are a heap of crap when compared to almost everything else.

I like several WW1/WW2 smg's, but to me one that stands out way above the rest is what I would describe as a first generation smg, the Suomi KP-31. I would rate it the best due to the reasons listed below. ( not necessarily in the correct order)

1) Exellent accuracy.

2) Superb firepower, especially with its 71 rnd drum

3) Longer range than most smg's

4) Quick change barrel and barrel jacket.

5) Fully adjustable sights.

6) Rate of fire vacuum regulating valve.

7) Detatchable trigger group.

8) Takes a wide variety of magazines.

9 ) Last but by no means least, the outstanding workmanship and materials of the entire weapon, it was made to last and it just oozes quality. It is absolutely beautifull.

I can only think of one downside, and that is it's weight.

The Suomi KP-31 was a very expensive gun to produce, it was this that lead to it's demise.

All that is great, but a Suomi weighs 12 lbs!!

Best SMG of WW2? Both Germans & Allies seemed to really like the Beretta SMGs.

For my money the Sten Mk V was the best PRODUCTION SMG of WW2, as it combined the best features of the Mk II with improved balance & ergonomics.

Stens have the downfall of the obcellecent MP28 magazines, though the Mk II Sten mag went a long way towards solving those issues.
 
Time and again, believe it or not, during ww2 the Sten MkII outperformed the Thompson SMG in reliability tests, especially in desert environments. This despite the Thompson's "superior" magazine.

The Thompson lends artificial confidence because it is so well machined, but the Sten was functionally superior. Reference: Sten Machine Carbine by Laidler.
 
... My vote would go to the Australian "OWEN GUN" ( Machine carbine) ..developed in WW2 and still in active service, and prized by both the Australians and others, through the Vietnam Conflict. Out performed the Sten 11, Thompson and MP40 in Australian Trails, and believe it or not, interest was displayed by the Canadian Government in 1941 ( Request for specifications and copies of the filmed Tests conducted ) ...'Sten Mk.11 being a close second, due to distribution and innovative design / manufacturing ! ..... David K.
 
Can't remember the source, but read that the Stens, if dropped, were prone to go off by themselves, spinning around until the magazine was empty. Soldiers fired them holding on their side with the magazine up as they were less prone to FTF. Also read that the Thompson was well thought of in Korea, with Brits and Canucks picking them up if they got a chance. Smoky Smith won his VC with a Thompson in Italy. Of course they were horribly expensive to manufacture.
 
Can't remember the source, but read that the Stens, if dropped, were prone to go off by themselves, spinning around until the magazine was empty. Soldiers fired them holding on their side with the magazine up as they were less prone to FTF. Also read that the Thompson was well thought of in Korea, with Brits and Canucks picking them up if they got a chance. Smoky Smith won his VC with a Thompson in Italy. Of course they were horribly expensive to manufacture.

Old myth.

If you had the bolt on a sten closed and a loaded magazine, and the gun was dropped, it could go off once. But this was not the approved way of carrying the sten, it was supposed to be open and the cocking handle locked into it's safety slot. You could drop it 10 feet and it would not go off.

If a sten did run away, it would not spin around and around either. Laidler did a test with a similar open bolt gun (the sterling) and it just sat there happily chugging away.

There was a tendancy for the Brit made stens to eventually suffer from a droopy magazine well. This only happened to the brit made ones and not to the Cdn made guns. So it is possible that holding the gun sideways might make it work, but I think if you try it, unless you are left handed, you would look like a pretzel trying to fire it.

Smokey Smith won his VC primarily with a PIAT was my understanding.

While I am kind of partial towards the sten as a good gun, my preference is weighed heavily by it's being the right gun at the right time. Simple, cheap, and easy to produce, it was what England needed in 41. There were more elaborate SMGs, but England had neither the time nor the money to spend on an elaborate gun.

My vote for the best SMG would have been the Patchett/Sterling. It improved on many of the stens features, and once it evolved into the mk4, it served many nations into the 80s and 90s.
 
sten by far ..cheap to make(as close to a throw away gun as you'll find it was that cheap), did the job ,broke down into small enough parts to fit into a big coat or small bag .worked well when dirty used captured ammo (9mm) made in any small shop, easy to train partizans to use,made by the millions and even copied by many including the Germans
My 2c
 
Back
Top Bottom