Bird Shot in your Home Defense Shotgun

Can-down said:
I've never heard anyone suggest that birdshot would not penetrate to layers of 1/2" drywall, I think the same concept that has people saying it's not enough to be a guaranteed first shot incapacitating load against a motivated threat, would suggest that after going through a thin wall, it likely won't kill anyone on the other side.
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Only took two posts after this one for someone to do exactly that.
 
I live in Canada.

My first weapon of defense in the event of an unwanted guest in the house is a can of bear spray. Next is a baseball bat.

My shot gun is buried beneath so many levels of secure lock-up that yes, in the event of an invasive goose or rabid mallard, given enough time I could go to the locked man cave, then to the locked gun cabinet, then to the the locked ammo locker, unite the shotgun with a shotshell with #2 birdshot and then protect my household from said invasive waterfowl.
 
Joejinx said:
If you already made the tough decision to shoot another human being, usually means that your life is most likely in danger... so why use something that might not stop someone? Might as well pick up a 10/22.
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Because I'd rather injure an intruder than kill my child? Each person has a different situation, but in my case my risk tolerance for over-penetration is exactly zero. One shot may not be immediately fatal, but it will certainly be effective.

When you talk about making the tough decision to shoot, knowing your back stop and whats beyond is one of those considerations. I'd rather have a weaker load that makes me more likely to be confident in the shot, then having a hot load that means I can't pull the trigger because innocent bystanders could get hit.

But lets be clear: There is zero chance that a well placed load of #9 shot won't stop someone. The goal is to win the gun fight, not trigger some Hollywood head explosion triple back-flip instant murder-death-kill.

PS, its not like we are talking about single shot break action shotguns here. If the first round of #9 doesn't get the job done there are 7 more behind it, with a fielders choice of slug and buck in the side saddle for when the over-penetration isn't a concern.

First good hit on target usually wins, and you keep shooting until there is no threat.
 
Rugdoc said:
I live in Canada.

My first weapon of defense in the event of an unwanted guest in the house is a can of bear spray. Next is a baseball bat.

My shot gun is buried beneath so many levels of secure lock-up that yes, in the event of an invasive goose or rabid mallard, given enough time I could go to the locked man cave, then to the locked gun cabinet, then to the the locked ammo locker, unite the shotgun with a shotshell with #2 birdshot and then protect my household from said invasive waterfowl.
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I too live in Canada. It takes me precisely 5 seconds to go from the supine position in the master bedroom to obtaining and loading a firearm from legal storage. Obviously slower if the clock starts when I'm asleep.

Store your firearms as you see fit, but don't pretend that your excessive storage situation has anything to do with the laws of Canada.
 
Cameron SS said:
If the first round of #9 doesn't get the job done there are 7 more behind it, with a fielders choice of slug and buck in the side saddle for when the over-penetration isn't a concern.
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Cameron SS said:
I too live in Canada. It takes me precisely 5 seconds to go from the supine position in the master bedroom to obtaining and loading a firearm from legal storage. Obviously slower if the clock starts when I'm asleep.
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That's impressive. You should do 3 gun, if you aren't already.
 
I bought 2 X half size vault/safe. I am intalling one in the living room ans one in the bedroom, i am doing that today. If SHTF happen, i will not be very far from a safe… Laws make it expensive in kanadea...:)
 
My grandpa used to always tell us the time he caught his neighbor stealing chickens. Old single shot 12g with rock salt to his arse stopped him.
 
Cameron SS said:
Because I'd rather injure an intruder than kill my child? Each person has a different situation, but in my case my risk tolerance for over-penetration is exactly zero. One shot may not be immediately fatal, but it will certainly be effective.

When you talk about making the tough decision to shoot, knowing your back stop and whats beyond is one of those considerations. I'd rather have a weaker load that makes me more likely to be confident in the shot, then having a hot load that means I can't pull the trigger because innocent bystanders could get hit.

But lets be clear: There is zero chance that a well placed load of #9 shot won't stop someone. The goal is to win the gun fight, not trigger some Hollywood head explosion triple back-flip instant murder-death-kill.

PS, its not like we are talking about single shot break action shotguns here. If the first round of #9 doesn't get the job done there are 7 more behind it, with a fielders choice of slug and buck in the side saddle for when the over-penetration isn't a concern.

First good hit on target usually wins, and you keep shooting until there is no threat.
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Exactly, and the average North American home’s maximum straight line range is 10 yards or less. (Read that years ago. Can’t recall where). And the vast majority of encounters in the US were at 7 yards or less.

I think Paul demonstrated it well: bird shot is clearly lethal at those ranges, but if one were to miss, it WILL pass through a wall, but becomes almost non lethal in the adjacent room.

A 12ga loaded with birdshot is the perfect choice for home defense. Which is exactly why I keep a light equipped 9mm pistol and mags in a biosafe in my nightstand. :p


To me, the question of 12ga suitability isn’t about penetration and lethality, it’s about wieldability. (Is that even a word?.... I mean: how easy you can maneuver through your home with it).

A full size shotgun is likely too long to maneuver through hallways and doorways easily. But even short shotguns require 2 hands to securely hold. (Especially those with bird’s head grips). Everyone’s got their own situations of course, but for me, if I need to move through my house with a gun in the dark, tripping over toys, stepping on legos, fumbling for light switches or trying to herd kids back into their rooms... The ability to have complete control over my firearm with a single hand, and the other hand available for everything else is going to be paramount.

Also, my shotgun doesn’t fit I’m my nightstand ;-)
 
CV32 said:
That's impressive. You should do 3 gun, if you aren't already.
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Being able read the law, design a readily accessible storage situation that is compliant and load a gun quickly doesn't necessarily translate into winning competitions, but thank you for the compliment, if it was intended as such.

I've yet to have a chance to do three gun. Would love to give it a go, although something about throwing perfectly serviceable shotguns into empty rain barrels seems weird to me. As does taking shots at 50 meters with a shotgun while you have a perfectly good AR on your back. I'm in that school of people who think the only thing to shoot at it with a shotgun while you already have an AR and a pistol is a door knob or a hinge, and that abandoning serviceable firearms is a chargeable offence. But hey, looks like a fun sport regardless. I bet I wouldn't come last. I also bet that despite how much I practice, the guys who come first practice 10 times as much as I do.
 
Win120 said:
My grandpa used to always tell us the time he caught his neighbor stealing chickens. Old single shot 12g with rock salt to his arse stopped him.
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Please don’t take this as a slight towards your grandfather, but...


Every time someone brings up “rock salt in a 12ga” the story is NEVER first-person. It’s always “My grand dad...”, “my neighbor...”, or “a farmer I knew growing up...”. It’s never a first hand experience.

Paul, from the op, also has a video on rock salt, and it shows just how useless it is. It’s too light. You’re less likely to get complete powder burn. Even if you do, it mostly disintegrates in flight, and the remaining particles lack the weight and hardness needed to penetrate.

[YouTube]5BY_sD3MvTY[/youtube]
 
Cameron SS said:
Being able read the law, design a readily accessible storage situation that is compliant and load a gun quickly doesn't necessarily translate into winning competitions, but thank you for the compliment, if it was intended as such. I've yet to have a chance to do three gun. Would love to give it a go, although something about throwing perfectly serviceable shotguns into empty rain barrels seems weird to me. As does taking shots at 50 meters with a shotgun while you have a perfectly good AR on your back. I'm in that school of people who think the only thing to shoot at it with a shotgun while you already have an AR and a pistol is a door knob or a hinge, and that abandoning serviceable firearms is a chargeable offence. But hey, looks like a fun sport regardless. I bet I wouldn't come last. I also bet that despite how much I practice, the guys who come first practice 10 times as much as I do.
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Its a lot of fun. And time (especially time spent reloading), is a huge component.
 
Cameron SS said:
I too live in Canada. It takes me precisely 5 seconds to go from the supine position in the master bedroom to obtaining and loading a firearm from legal storage. Obviously slower if the clock starts when I'm asleep.

Store your firearms as you see fit, but don't pretend that your excessive storage situation has anything to do with the laws of Canada.
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ya we're gonna need video of this..bonus points if you are wearing a speedo and covid 19 mask. :evil:
 
Striker said:
ya we're gonna need video of this..bonus points if you are wearing a speedo and covid 19 mask. :evil:
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If your buck naked and armed with a shotgun..... bird shot works fine.

Just the sight of a naked man with a shotgun will get most people questioning their comfort level and whether or not they really want to fight or flight..... :)
 
Can-down said:
If your buck naked and armed with a shotgun..... bird shot works fine.

Just the sight of a naked man with a shotgun will get most people questioning their comfort level and whether or not they really want to fight or flight..... :)
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An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure...

Pro level: Start getting the paper at the end of the driveway butt naked. Word will spread, and you’ll never need to worry about a home invasion.
 
kodiakjack said:
Please don’t take this as a slight towards your grandfather, but...


Every time someone brings up “rock salt in a 12ga” the story is NEVER first-person. It’s always “My grand dad...”, “my neighbor...”, or “a farmer I knew growing up...”. It’s never a first hand experience.

Paul, from the op, also has a video on rock salt, and it shows just how useless it is. It’s too light. You’re less likely to get complete powder burn. Even if you do, it mostly disintegrates in flight, and the remaining particles lack the weight and hardness needed to penetrate.

[YouTube]5BY_sD3MvTY[/youtube]
Click to expand...

No worries. Fact or fiction it made him well known because of it, even today. But knowing him a slug would have been his first choice.
 
kodiakjack said:
An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure...

Pro level: Start getting the paper at the end of the driveway butt naked. Word will spread, and you’ll never need to worry about a home invasion.
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Exactly, mind set is everything, fortune favors the bold.... :)
 
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