Birdshot cost?

A-Smith

A-Smith

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I'm curious as to the cost of birdshot for reloading.

My company imports, markets and recycles industrial grade steel shot, but the sizes are generally much smaller than sporting birdshot (usually under .0600")

What is the market price range on 50 Ib bags of #8 steel or lead shot for reloading?

I bet we could do better, if there was enough interest to bring in some coarser material. (cast steel shot)

...also - if anyone is interested in Steel shot under .0600" for any reason - we have material for sale both new and recycled in the GTA. (in any quantity)

Shoot me a pm if I don't respond promptly.
 
A-Smith said:
I'm curious as to the cost of birdshot for reloading.

My company imports, markets and recycles industrial grade steel shot, but the sizes are generally much smaller than sporting birdshot (usually under .0600")

What is the market price range on 50 Ib bags of #8 steel or lead shot for reloading?

I bet we could do better, if there was enough interest to bring in some coarser material. (cast steel shot)

...also - if anyone is interested in Steel shot under .0600" for any reason - we have material for sale both new and recycled in the GTA. (in any quantity)

Shoot me a pm if I don't respond promptly.
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10 pounds of steel is running about 34.00 plus tax and shipping but there would be no market for no. 8 at this stage since most clubs still shoot lead. No.2 ,BB and larger is what most guys are reloading for waterfowl in steel.
Also coarser material would not excite anyone we are trying to get higher quality to improve patterns and reduce wear and tear. I for one would not reload it if not at least equivalent to what we are using now which is not the best for sure
 
Ammunition grade steel shot is made from very low carbon steel wire, cut to length, rounded and annealed. Hardness is probably on the order of HRB 85. I think most industrial grade shot is cast from medium to high carbon, high silicon steel, and used as-cast. What is the hardness of your shot?
 
BattleRife said:
Ammunition grade steel shot is made from very low carbon steel wire, cut to length, rounded and annealed. Hardness is probably on the order of HRB 85. I think most industrial grade shot is cast from medium to high carbon, high silicon steel, and used as-cast. What is the hardness of your shot?
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Technically, that's not actually "shot", but conditioned, probably "double conditioned cutwire (DCCW)"

We do actually import a wee bit of that from Germany, but the cost is about double that of cast shot.

We carry a full range of hardness's, usually measured in Knoop# and Rockwell C.

Here are the specs on our standard stock items:

http://www.whytekinc.ca/Amasteel%20shot%20card.pdf

As far as the cutwire, we Market Material for Frohn Industries, a German Company - which is available in a similar range of hardness.

As you can see, this stuff is much smaller than sporting shot.
 
ben hunchak said:
Steel shot is not as effective as lead and more then double the price, 25 lbs. of lead shot goes for $45 or more.
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My point is - We've got recycled shot < .0600" for about 40 or 50 cents a pound. Unfortunately, there's nothing coarser available in the "reclaim" range.

I'm sure we could beat the stainless prices quoted above (significantly), but we don't normally carry anything that large. I do believe we can get it though.
 
I think you missed my point. Shot for shotguns needs to be soft, the shot you are selling is very hard. The spec sheet you posted showed hardness ranges from HRC 40 to HRC 61. A shooter would be insane to shoot shot this hard, it would destroy the barrel very quickly.
 
BattleRife said:
I think you missed my point. Shot for shotguns needs to be soft, the shot you are selling is very hard. The spec sheet you posted showed hardness ranges from HRC 40 to HRC 61. A shooter would be insane to shoot shot this hard, it would destroy the barrel very quickly.
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Does the shot not ride down the barrel, enclosed in a plastic shot cup....then leave the shot cup when there's no longer pressure from the barrel driving it, and there's wind resistance outside the barrel to create drag and fold the petals back ?
 
blacksmithden said:
Does the shot not ride down the barrel, enclosed in a plastic shot cup....then leave the shot cup when there's no longer pressure from the barrel driving it, and there's wind resistance outside the barrel to create drag and fold the petals back ?
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I'm no expert but I think the hardness has something to do with how much the load compresses. Very hard steel has very little "give" when it's being driven through the forcing cone/choke; even though there is a shotcup, you still run the risk of galling/peening the barrel/choke...
 
3macs1 said:
?? (SAAMI) specification annealed steel. 10lbs. Sizes: #7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1
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Iron is an element, steel is an alloy. Iron is soft, by adding carbon you get steel. Is it not the goal to have "steel" shot as soft as possible? I am no metallurgist but just always was under the impression the steel shot infact iron.:redface:
 
M12shooter said:
Iron is an element, steel is an alloy. Iron is soft, by adding carbon you get steel. Is it not the goal to have "steel" shot as soft as possible? I am no metallurgist but just always was under the impression the steel shot infact iron.:redface:
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Per specs
Steel shot is fabricated from low carbon steel wires and in the process annealed so that the shot has an average max hardness of R15T69 with no individual reading over R15T79. Metallurgy is left open to manufacturer and not detailed in SAAM!
http://www.saami.org/specifications_and_information/publications/download/209.pdf

What I know for sure is what we get in Canada for reloading is pure crap.
 
blacksmithden said:
Does the shot not ride down the barrel, enclosed in a plastic shot cup....then leave the shot cup when there's no longer pressure from the barrel driving it, and there's wind resistance outside the barrel to create drag and fold the petals back ?
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Yes it does, but hard shot can pierce the walls of the wads during setback, this is why when steel (and later iron-nickel-tin-tungsten alloys) became available for loading steel-specific wads also came available. Wads for even soft steel shot are much thicker and tougher than traditional wads.

A second issue is the hammering the shot gives the choke if it is unable to deform and flow through the constriction.
 
This is interesting stuff!!!

Sounds like just about all the steel you folks use is in fact forged cut wire, which yes, I believe can be formed softer than cast.

"Cast Steel Shot" is not made from wire. It is a carbon steel alloy which is formed by passing molten steel through a cascade of cold water, which causes the steel to bead. Once it cools, it can be treated to customize hardness, then screened to size.

"Cutwire" is forged to desired alloy - chopped to size - then conditioned to spherical shape. "Unconditioned cutwire" is cylindrical, as the process implies.

I would assume, that in this (shooting) industry, the cutwire continues to be called "Shot", mostly because we use it in "Shotguns"

In the abrasive industry, while the broad term "shot" is often used for all manner of metal abrasive media - when it gets right down to application, there is a significant difference between "shot" and "cutwire".

......all things considered, my cheap reclaim shot is clearly of no use here!

Oh well, worth a try!

Thanks for the info guys.
 
3macs1 said:
Per specs
... the shot has an average max hardness of R15T69 with no individual reading over R15T79. Metallurgy is left open to manufacturer and not detailed in SAAM![/url]
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For everyone's information and reference, I looked up the hardness conversion tables in ASTM A370 for Rockwell Superficial Hardness, T Scale with a 15kgf load.

R15T 70.4 (the lowest the table goes) is equivalent to HRB 30 or 87 Knoop.
R15T 79.2 is equivalent to HRB 57 or 115 Knoop.

For comparison, HRC 40 is equivalent to 402 Knoop (way off the scale for HRB).

A-Smith said:
This is interesting stuff!!!

......all things considered, my cheap reclaim shot is clearly of no use here!

Oh well, worth a try!

Thanks for the info guys.
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Absolutely worth the try, I'm glad you brought it up. If it had worked out, we would all be better for it. Even so, the discussion was valuable.
 
Hmmmm, I'd think that even hard shot in very small sizes would slide through a choke. After all, the stuff he's offering is #12 size, basically sand. If I lived someplace that had a starling problem, I'd certainly give it a try.
 
- I bought a 40 pound bag of 'shot' from Manus Abrasives here in Edmonton about five years ago. I was shooting on a trap range that was not allowed lead shot and the Ballistic Products ten pound bags of #7 were only found at gun shows. I used proper steel shot wads (SAM 1, STS/MG-42, CLBC, etc.) and followed the listed loads to the letter.

- My old shotgun owed me nothing, so I did it knowing that eventually a very hard piece of 'soft iron' shot would work it's way through a wad slit and blemish my barrel. Big deal.
 
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