Because most of the bad head shot scenarios I have encountered were at 20 yards on baited bears where there is usually a relatively experienced hunter with a tested rifle (because we check them ALL before taking them out), and there is plenty of time to watch the animal and calm your nerves, and it still goes badly. Bears heads are constantly swinging around as they scent check, also the fact that their fur is dark and blends with shadows and many shots are taken during low light, making definition more difficult, and the angle of the head hard to determine. Note that in everyone of these bad cases, the hunter had been cautioned AGAINST taking a head shot, had been coached on proper body posture of the quarry and anatomy and proper shot placement, but still (usually due to over confidence in their shooting ability), chose to disregard advice an attempt the head shot. Most of these bad scenarios resulted in a wounded and lost animal, some were recovered after tracking and follow-up shots... in EVERY case the hunter was apologetic, and kicking themselves in the azz for not following the advice to take the high percentage shot. Having said that, I have also seen bears and deer and moose dropped straight down with head shots... many of those were purely accidental, but when gauging Risk/Reward... it just isn't there. No matter how confident you are in your shooting skills, do not take headshots in hunting scenarios, stuff can and does go wrong, and it goes wrong with headshots more than any other shot placement.
Black bear shot placement
- Thread starter Waterfowler
- Start date
Because most of the bad head shot scenarios I have encountered were at 20 yards on baited bears where there is usually a relatively experienced hunter with a tested rifle (because we check them ALL before taking them out), and there is plenty of time to watch the animal and calm your nerves, and it still goes badly. Bears heads are constantly swinging around as they scent check, also the fact that their fur is dark and blends with shadows and many shots are taken during low light, making definition more difficult, and the angle of the head hard to determine. Note that in everyone of these bad cases, the hunter had been cautioned AGAINST taking a head shot, had been coached on proper body posture of the quarry and anatomy and proper shot placement, but still (usually due to over confidence in their shooting ability), chose to disregard advice an attempt the head shot. Most of these bad scenarios resulted in a wounded and lost animal, some were recovered after tracking and follow-up shots... in EVERY case the hunter was apologetic, and kicking themselves in the azz for not following the advice to take the high percentage shot. Having said that, I have also seen bears and deer and moose dropped straight down with head shots... many of those were purely accidental, but when gauging Risk/Reward... it just isn't there. No matter how confident you are in your shooting skills, do not take headshots in hunting scenarios, stuff can and does go wrong, and it goes wrong with headshots more than any other shot placement.
We can sit here and debate back and forth till the end of time but I highlighted what is left to interpretation.
Most... not all. Not enough to convince me not to make a head shot at 30 yards or less.
Relatively experienced... we'll leave that to interpretation.
Tested rifle... more that just testing for zero. I'm guessing the rifle was test AND zeroed for the target distance and the results are based on the first cold bore shot not zeroed after the rifle barrel is warmed up and a POI shift. Was the POA and POI dead centre on a half inch dot and not say half to one inch off and left "good enough". Now I will extend the equipment to include scope reticle and adjustable parallax or fixed at 100 - 150yards. Fine hair, duplex, illuminated or not. If illuminated was it a dot or christmas tree and the intensity of the illumination because I will agree that hunting black bear in low light conditions is going to be challenging which is why all my hunting scopes are illuminated with a dot and adjustable parallax down to 15 - 25 yards.
At the end of this topic of head shots at 30 yards or less, it is up to the individual hunter and their hunting and shooting capabilities. Telling someone a head shots is a bad idea under 30 yards is one thing. Educating someone how to make a successful head shot at 30 yards or less is more welcoming.
Only arrogant rookies take and recommend headshots on big game species here in Canada... there are places where it is acceptable, such as "culling" scenarios of invasive species, or where wounding loss is not a concern. I do not casually accept wounding loss on Canadian big game species. I do not take head shots myself, even though I shoot thousands of rounds a year and I do NOT recommend it for clients... REGARDLESS of their skill level; rookie to expert, it is stupid and unnecessary. You continue to do you.
Highlighted portion... never.
Interesting Hoyt that you use strong words and description over the internet but based on your previous post it doesn't seem you use the same word to your clients. I bet you don't even scold them or call them arrogant rookies after they make a bad head shot. If it was your rule then why are your clients making head shots. Just a caution against???
Tough words over the internet but soft to your clients face to face. Must be money money money.
You continue to do you as well.
Tough words over the internet but soft to your clients face to face. Must be money money money.
You continue to do you as well.
Lol... this from the guy posting pictures of his watches on CGN. The "money, money, money" comments always come from the guys that are all about money.
You go ahead and take whatever shots you want... but I will always advise against "attempting" head shots.
Dorian Gray
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I've only ever killed 2 black bears. And both were in my back yard. But both were shot in the head from within 30 yards and both killed with a 30-06. Call it what you will. I wasn't hunting and neither of them were trophies. I had young children in my care at the time and no bears were allowed to get used to hanging out in my yard. If they showed up, they died. As quickly as possible. If I was hunting, I probably would have taken a boiler room shot. It has the highest margin for error. Not condoning what i did for the average hunter. But for what I was doing, head shots worked fine.
- Location
- Blaster land, Okanagan BC
I only head shoot grouse and hares, I don’t think head shooting large game is a good idea so I don’t do it. Heart/lung shots kill them quick enough for me and I know there’s less room for error, no risk of blowing off some deers jaw.
the shoulders are not that rearward or maybe my lack of english skills but between shoulders and halfway up the body do not match my experiences with bears. and maybe the bullet was too strong for the bear,
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speaking of head shot i do not encourage it either but sometimes with the right shooter and under specific condition it might work. this spring my wife took a huge black bear that did not care about her when she was walking behind him. she shoot him in the neck but the bullet certainly tumbled or the bear moved and the exit was in the head needless to say it was a dead bear. certainly luck but that is not the promotion we re doing on hunting but sometimes for many reasons it might happen.
i do remember in france we had a lot of wounded red and roe deers with lower jaws destroyed because of head shot attempts.
i do remember in france we had a lot of wounded red and roe deers with lower jaws destroyed because of head shot attempts.
Just everything that keeps a bear alive and over half of what holds it up is in and between the front quarters. If you arrange for your bullet to travel through that space you’re going to be skinning a bear pretty quick. How you go about that depends a lot on how it was standing at the time. Could be broadside through both, through the near shoulder if its quartering toward, on the wish one is its a frontal with his head up, through the beefy part of its neck and on into the chest cavity if its facing with its head down. At close range from above a shot between the shoulder blades them though the spine and into the chest flattens them pretty good too.
I’d resist the urge to pick an exterrior feature like a single hair and shoot at that. Exceptions could be made if you have a convincing reason to believe thT thats tbe hair that is holding the bear together.
I’d resist the urge to pick an exterrior feature like a single hair and shoot at that. Exceptions could be made if you have a convincing reason to believe thT thats tbe hair that is holding the bear together.
