Black powder percussion for beginners..start to finish

Good job ice.

When discussing cleaning please dispell the myth that BP is harder to clean.
I find it is easier.
Quicker and less patches.

I have used both goex FF and smokeless in 45 70.
And goex FFF and 777 in a revolver.
In these 4 powders above smokeless is the only one that does not have to be cleand right after.
I have heard that 777 and pryodex are more corrosive that black.
 
On cleaning...I used the hot soapy water/mop method in the past and started to get rust :eek: The water must not have been hot enough and didn't evaporate and the oil not enough to stop rusting, I don't know. Luckily for me I fondle my firearms frequently and noticed this within a day or so.

I thought that maybe I was over thinking the cleaning thing and now do the following with no rust or issues: Immediately after a range session I mop the bore with Hoppes 9. Once home I quite literally hose the thing down with WD40 and run rags (outside) and patches. I find that this method is not only faster with less mess but it does a better job. All that cap residue wipes right off with WD40, fouling in the barrel is the same.

How do you guys clean those smoke poles???
 
With my flintlock blunderbuss or percussion muzzleloading pistol I use liquid dish soap with some hot water. No problems here so far. Barrel scrub and an old toothbrush for cleaning up the lock. Leave it to air dry and it's still almost too hot to touch as it sits. Cools off the the point of comfortable handling, next is a visual inspection and sometimes especially with a long shooting session with the antique pistol, the barrels get an oil bath for a few days.
This last step is probably a bit overboard. But I coddle my antiques because no-one else will! :D

ymmv
 
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plinker 777 said:
On cleaning...I used the hot soapy water/mop method in the past and started to get rust :eek: The water must not have been hot enough and didn't evaporate and the oil not enough to stop rusting, I don't know. Luckily for me I fondle my firearms frequently and noticed this within a day or so.

I thought that maybe I was over thinking the cleaning thing and now do the following with no rust or issues: Immediately after a range session I mop the bore with Hoppes 9. Once home I quite literally hose the thing down with WD40 and run rags (outside) and patches. I find that this method is not only faster with less mess but it does a better job. All that cap residue wipes right off with WD40, fouling in the barrel is the same.

How do you guys clean those smoke poles???
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Hot soapy water works for me. I have cap and ball revolvers that have been shot with B.P. for over 30 years No rust issues yet.
Black powder ( and pyrodex) leave corrosive salts. Hot water dissolves salt, adding soap ( like murphy's oil) acts as a emulsifier for the lube that covers the salts.
A hot soapy water wash, and a hot water rinse, air dry, and a good gun oil (G96 because it smells nice) - and after 30 years of that - no rust.

Just for information, pyrodex is far more corrosive than Black powder because it has a perchlorate component. That produces less fouling but the fouling produced is more active as a corrosive agent.
On another note the old Goex plant used water from a reservoir for part of the year and much harder ground water when the reservoir depleted. According to one ex Goex employee powder produced from the ground water carried a calcium component that left fouling that was miserable to clean.
 
maple leaf said:
Great work. Thanks for the post and lots of pictures!
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Cleaning is coming up real quick. I just picked up a new to me 50 cal hawken on the weekend and had her out shooting..She is a keeper and so with that give me a day or two and I will post how to clean one...also if any one wants to chime in please feel free to do so. Remember I am new to this,but might have a trick or 2 up my sleeve to make it easier..I will try and cover all the basics. I will run thru dissasembly,basic tools and such...also if it works for me I will show how to clean with WW fluid...Stay tuned as I get to rip a rifle apart and have fun while keeping it real simple!!!
 
icehunter121 said:
Cleaning is coming up real quick. I just picked up a new to me 50 cal hawken on the weekend and had her out shooting..She is a keeper and so with that give me a day or two and I will post how to clean one...also if any one wants to chime in please feel free to do so. Remember I am new to this,but might have a trick or 2 up my sleeve to make it easier..I will try and cover all the basics. I will run thru dissasembly,basic tools and such...also if it works for me I will show how to clean with WW fluid...Stay tuned as I get to rip a rifle apart and have fun while keeping it real simple!!!
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I too am a recent purchaser of a 'Hawken type' rifle. Beware of my recent mistake and use hot water/soap, and Not Boiling water for cleaning.
I also found a referance on traditional muzzleloading forum to avoid boiling water for BP residue cleaning.
 
The only variation I have to the hot water and soap thing is that before I oil her up, I put the barrel in the oven on low heat for a while, keeping it almost, repeat almost, too hot to hold for a few minutes. Evaporate all that water inside and out. Oil her up, and Bob's your uncle.
 
Easyrider said:
The only variation I have to the hot water and soap thing is that before I oil her up, I put the barrel in the oven on low heat for a while, keeping it almost, repeat almost, too hot to hold for a few minutes. Evaporate all that water inside and out. Oil her up, and Bob's your uncle.
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Easyrider, your wife must be very understanding, :) my wife after 40 some years has finally said she won,t let me clean BP guns in the kitchen. Whats with that. :yingyang: :) So it's the shop for me. :( You are right on about the heat and drying being the important thing :cool:. I used to do just what you say, with some of my old smoke poles. Since this could be more or less a general black powder cleaning thread , the oven method won't work for some guns. I have been fooling with different bullets and BP in my old Hi Wall Winchester the past month or so for example and have cleaned it a number of times, You can't put a Hi Wall in the oven especially not with an original Winchester scope on it. :confused: A kettle of boiling water, brass brush and repeat, more boiling water and swab with patch, and pretty soon you can jus barely hang on to that big old barrel for heat, the HEAT from the boiling water will dry her up. dry swabs till no black shows , swab with your choice of gun oils, I like G96 or Birchwood Casey, it's called Barricade. swab till patch is clean. A final quite oily swab and the old girl can be put away rust free. I also use a dry source of air and my blow gun to blow out action to get any moisture out then a little oil and blow again. If this is not too far off the subject, I would like to hear an innovative way to clean say a 73, 76 or 86 win. I used to have a lot of trouble with an old 45-90-- 86, you can,t be pouring water down the barrel, can't run a brush from breech end. By the way Where is Ice--back to his subject cleaning percussion muzzle loader , I like his enthusiasm, waiting for his cleaning lesson. Cheers
 
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I think it is a mistake to use boiling water because over a long time it may lead to pitting. I know of one individual who cleaned with boiling or nearly so water and over a period of 10 or 20 years ended up with a pitted barrel. His shooting partner who built both his own gun and the one with the pitted bore, used warm water and did not have problems with pitting. Personally I use water hot from the tap because it seems to dissolve the fouling faster than cool or cold water. I also use a bronze brush rather than clean with a patch on a jag. I protect the barrel with Fluid Film which is a light spray on grease that does not evaporate and have not had any problem with pitting. I also would avoid putting an oil in the barrel to protect it after shooting and before cleaning. I think the oil makes the fouling a lot harder to dissolve in water. I would use the oiled bore method if for some reason I could not clean the gun for several days after shooting

cheers mooncoon
 
BSA Jack, all you had to do was ask...lol. Here is my home made lever action cleaning tool. It is not pretty, but it works, if you want to use soap and water. All it is is a cut down 45/70 brass (the rifle in the pic is a 1886 .45/90) with a piece of bendable copper tube soldered into the drilled out primer pocket, and an appropriate sized O-ring. You open the breech, slide the contraption into the chamber till the O-ring is firmly against the head, close the breech part way to hold things in place. Then you set the butt on the floor beside a pail of water, with the end of the copper tube submerged in the water. Brass ramrod with a .45 cal cleaning jag, a patch, and start pumping. The O-ring keeps water from squirting all over the place, if things go right. A handier idea is to put the butt in one side of the kitchen sink, and the copper tube in the other, but your wife may protest. I personally have a fabulous wife who adores me, and is happy to let me do as I please.:)
 
Crap! Forgot pics...
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Nice work easyrider, that will work. :cool: being the old snowmobile mechanic I tried to use rubber plug fittings and plastic line etc, and ended up with more water in the guts of the old 86 than in the pail and all over the floor. May have been the reason wife said no more. :) She really is pretty understanding and a shooter for 40 years. I like your 86, sure wish I still had mine sometimes. From another post hear your heading south for the winter. Have a good one. Cheers
 
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