Black rifle prices
- Thread starter MauroUlisse
- Start date
andrew3081
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver, BC
Easy answer...$1 usd is not the same as $1 cad.
If you want to see prices drop, you need to cultivate more shooters.
In the short term prices will go up as demand increases and Canadian businesses are slow to react to the changing market. But in the long term, the higher turnover and high volume sales, and other business savy folk exploiting a growing market, will steadily bring prices down.
In the short term prices will go up as demand increases and Canadian businesses are slow to react to the changing market. But in the long term, the higher turnover and high volume sales, and other business savy folk exploiting a growing market, will steadily bring prices down.
Restated for truth. I Run Guns may be a game-changer for us Canucks.
Take your pick. Any business who is a dealer for brand X is paying dealer pricing, just like our friends south of the line. Same dealer prices, marginally more coin to import but not enough to warrant doubling or tripling prices. Some stuff is hard to get because Canada is a pathetic market size and the demand for high end gear is low thanks to a gluttony of retailers offering cheap Chinese crap from NcStar and the like. Airsoft vendors don't help either. I just got back from the US and found Pmags and Glock pistol mags for $17 and $26 respectively. This was at the first place I could find that sold firearms and accessories a "Big R" store. Ruger scout rifle for $899 and that was the 16" version with comp. S&W Ar's for under and over a grand depending on how much Magpul or other stuff was included.
TDC
Silent8Strike
CGN Regular
- Location
- Ottawa, Ontario
I think I Run Guns has pretty much put the "Its expensive to import" theory to rest. Like many have said, business are in it to make money, and if import fees were really cutting into their profit margins I Run Guns wouldn't be doing it for free with their in stock items.
andrew3081
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver, BC
That's one of the main reasons why.
It is not just about firearms.
If you compare the prices in USA to the price in Canada... Canadian price will always be more expensive for the same item.
And then you add the importing fee/shipping fee and other fees.. Of course the price will be more expensive.
Everything comes down to economics.
We believe our business model will change the Canadian firearms market for the better. We believe IRUNGUNS has had a lot to do with the drop in prices in the Canadian AR market. Cheaper prices allow more shooters into the sport. Wait until our distributors are restocked in the USA (A huge amount of product is either out of stock or backordered due to the huge buying spree that went on at the start of 2013. We get product before other retailers in Canada and we import our own product thus cutting out one of the many middle men in the firearms industry. Once we get our computer and staffing issues fully rectified things should be much more streamlined. You can purchase any of the Canadian legal firearms or accessories from our US site, pay no import fee, pay US retail pricing, and save PST if you are in a PST province. Its only $25 to ship the item to Canada from the US (for accessories its $25 for the first item and $10 for each item after that). The catch is you have to wait approx 4 weeks depending on when in the month your order was placed, or needs additional permits to be imported (IE certain optics). We also do third party importation for people buying items from gunbroker, guns america or any US FFL dealer. At $200 for the first gun, 150 for the second and 100 for each gun after that imported at the same time our importation fee structure is the cheapest in Canada and our turnaround time is also the fastest, and will get better. Heres an example of retail pricing on a product we are bringing to Canada VS the retail in the USA:
MTAC 1-4x24 Riflescope, FastFire III Reflex Sight, PEPR Mount: IRG PRICE $549.99 USD +5% GST + Shipping from AB to your residence
This same scope is retailing for $499-599 in the USA
MTAC 1-4x24 Riflescope, FastFire III Reflex Sight, PEPR Mount: IRG PRICE $549.99 USD +5% GST + Shipping from AB to your residence
This same scope is retailing for $499-599 in the USA
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Pray tell, how does one buy a firearm across the border, transport it to the border, cross the border, then transport it to his house without getting into a whole lot of really bad trouble.
I'm not understanding this madness...
You don't. It does not work that way.
It is called filling out paperwork. Waiting. Maybe some more paper work....then wait some more
granted this is the restricted barrel length, but the markup should be about the same.
so you are saying that irunguns is paying call it 2 grand for the gun, and can afford to import it and turn a profit for $2099+gts+shipping within canada (shipping is about 20 bucks)
http://www.irunguns.ca/store/rifles-for-sale-canada/Tavor TAR-21 FDE Flattop
with optics for $2599
http://www.irunguns.ca/store/rifles-for-sale-canada/Tavor TAR-21 Black With Optic
personally if i wanted a tavor i would buy a non-r and wouldnt want to convert to to non r...but the same price comparison should apply here
maybe canadian companies need to work with irunguns rather than compete against them.
just one example but:
i just picked up a s&w m&p40 from them and it cost me $545 with tax and shipping imported and to my door, same pistol here is $650+taxes ($734)and plus shipping if you dont buy local..but we will call it local for sake of arguments .. granted, thats just over $189 savings ..not huge if we are looking at $2000 rifles but thats big on a $650 item.
irunguns isnt doing it for free, they are turning a profit. so they are looking at(roughly) 30% markup for canadian prices at canadian retailers OVER the RETAIL price of it in the states. wholesale doesnt change canada vs usa (if it does, then our stores need to go direct to the mfrg and get tat sorted out...canadian shops do not buy wholesale at USA RETAIL prices.)
i run guns probably made call it $100 off that sale, so in canada the retailers need to make the $189 extra i saved plus the profit irunguns made which would total out to $289 profit on a $650 gun in canada...you are approaching the 50% profit margin here....
as for the staffing ad insurance arguments, well irun guns looks like it is 2 companies.. one in USA and 1 in canada. they have travil expenses, rent on both sides of the border and they have to have all the same insurance that canadian shops have and comply with all the same canadian laws otherwise tey would be in jail. where they do save is they keep everything in USD fo we only pay 5% GST and they save on banking for not converting money back and forth.
and yes, they have to pay their staff still just like the canadian retailers.
Ar180shooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Ottawa, ON
In all honesty, I'm not really interested in what you have to say because you started out by demonstrating you don't know what you're talking about. The Tavors that IRUN guns imports are U.S. made. The Tavors we get here as NR are Israeli made. To start off, they're made on the other side of the world. They're also made with special 18.5" barrels, just for the Canadian market (the standard Tavor made for the Israeli military has 460mm, or 18.1" barrels). This means they're doing a special run of barrels just for us. This is not free.
It is also valid to point out that IRUN guns is operating an import business, not a wholesale or retail business (both levels need to make profits). Their main office is in the states. This really cuts down on costs. They don't have to run the whole operation from Canada, which, as has been discussed in length, is more expensive than running a business in Canada. They are also bypassing the established distribution networks and are bypassing the Canadian importer (middleman). This cuts down on costs, but don't expect warranty service on the Canadian side if it's required.
You are also assuming that retailers are buying the guns for the same price that IRUN guns is. This is not correct. Very few Canadian firearm retailers import the products themselves. Most buy them from distributors that import the firearms themselves. These distributers need to make a profit themselves, and cover the costs of operation and importation. They are also unable to acquire the same sort of volume discounts that U.S. companies can. They also do not get priority from the manufacturers, who often are more concerned with fulfilling U.S. orders before export, because of the smaller order volume.
So you have the cost of importation, profit for the importer, and profit for the retailer. This means that an item that's only $500 in the U.S. is going for well over $650 up here, but the retailer still only makes 20%.
Just a point.
I Run Guns submits one Export Permit once a month which has all the clients orders from the last month.
Charges $200 for the first gun, $150 for the second and $100 for the third if they are on the same Export Permit.
The Export Permit is $250 to file and has all the firearms and accessories from the last month on it.
So if you have say 30 clients, each buying even just one rifle................
I'll let that sink in for a minute.
i bought off their Canadian website, all fees included. $545 to my door, no import fees to me. their import fees seem to be based on if you buy from lets say the cabelas USA store and have them import it for you.
i honestly dont care what they pay, i care what comes out of my bank account...im not in the market of padding other peoples pocket because it makes me feel good knowing it went to a canadian company with high margins.
as for warranty and service arguments others have made, well i was missing parts from a small ($100 or so) item i ordered from one of this site sponsors who is well known and generally highly praised and the reply i got was "i sold you the 2012 model 3 days ago, the 2013 model on the website includes them"...well hell give me the 2013 model i thought i bought...thanks......either way my friend had gotten the same part a couple months earlier with the part i was missing. im still unable to find a place to sell this part which i dont overly need (but want). The shop that sold me it woulnt reply when i said fine then sell me that missing part. i suspect the part fell out of the box in the store and got lost....i was the lucky one to get that product box...that was in march and i just said forget it over what probably would cost $5 to replace. so i fail to see value in some cases for the added cost of customer service.
Again my price comparison is a pistol not a black rifle but import process should be the same seeing that both are restricted, and your %markup leaves higher profit amounts on higher priced items. you dont make (lets call it) 30% on a glock and 10% on a $3000 rifle.
at 30% margin that would be $900 profit on the rifle and $210 on a $700 glock
at 10% thats $300 on the rifle and 70 on the glock.
im not asking you to disclose your finances, because in business, you dont do stuff for free so i expect you to make a profit... but im not blind, i see large margins in the canadian market on lots of items.... even automotive parts cost much more here than in the states, and dealers have the same wholesale prices BEFORE shipping on them.
correct... no fees, just canadian shipping and GST plus pay in USD not CND... so a small exchange fee and wit out $ soo close its really not a deal at all.
