Blackpowder only Winchester 94's in 30-30?

H Wally

H Wally

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Just wondering, were any wincherst 1894's produced in 30-30 that were blackpowder only guns? I thought I saw one on the EE a while back.

I see the "Special Smokeless Steel" on the 1900's guns and suspect that's just a marketing ploy, but if there were blackpowder only 30-30's, how would they be marked? I would suspect either a plain unmarked barrel or "Blackpowder only" on it.

I've googled every way I can think of but so far no answers.
 
Nope, the Model 1894s were never produced in blackpowder only guns - the reason being that the 30 WCF (as the 30-30 was known at the time) produced pressures that the steel in the 1894s at the time could not safely handle.

That's why when the 1894 was first introduced in 1894, it came out in 32-40 and 38-55, cartridges that didn't raise pressures to an unsafe level.

Soon enough, Winchester was able to develop the necessary metallurgy to produce nickel steel or the "Special Smokeless Steel" that would allow the 30 WCF to be introduced the following year along with the 25-35 WCF.

Definitely no marketing ploy there.
 
That's why black powder isn't often shot in them.

Even though the Model 1894 in 32 Winchester Special (that came out in 1902) could be used for BP, it still had the Special Smokeless Steel barrels on them as there was the real possiblity of shooters then using either BP or smokeless rounds. The ugly threat of law suits was present even then.
 
Prior to Winchester using Nickel Steel barrels most were marked either "Not for Smokeless Powder", or for "Black Powder only". I recall an 1894 in 38-55 we had in the collection that was so marked, somewhere in the 33,000 serial number range. It had more to do with the erosion of the barrel caused by the higher and longer burning temperatures of smokeless powder at the time. The U.S. military had an issue with this as well in their Krag rifles, though is was rectified possibly due to the experiences of Winchester. The black powder rounds in the 1894 were not very popular due to their lack of accuracy in comparison to the singles shot rifles of the era. Soon 32-40 and 38-55 ammunition was commercially available in smokeless loads as well as black powder loads. Interesting that black powder was still being loaded commercially when it had already been considered obsolete.
As a side note...I tried to work with an 1894 in 38-55 using black powder, it had a mirror like bore that miked in at 0.377. It was not very accurate at all, and I gave up on it after trying a custom built single shot in same caliber.
Cheers
 
I would have to see a 94 marked "black powder only" to believe it. I've owned and examined several .38-55's and a few .32-40's, built between 1895 and 1906. They were all unmarked, except for the proofmark, calibre stamp, etc. I have heard of Marlin 1893's, the "Grade B" I think they're called, stamped "BLACK POWDER ONLY". Never a Winchester.
 
Smokepole said:
I don't think so... The 30-30 round was designed as a smokeless round, IIRC.
It still carried the old style BP designation of .30 cal with smokeless equivelant - 30 gr BP.
Click to expand...

Another theory to this is that the "old timers" could not get a handle on the "new" caliber designations, and the manufacturers changed the names to appeal to this market...how true this is would be a matter of conjecture only to be solved under with Alexander Keith.
Years ago I got into a heated argument with a black powder "expert" who adamantly swore that the 30-30 was a BP round...he was full of himself (among other things)and had no clue whatsoever.
Similar to the military 30 U.S., aka 30-40.
Actually, Frankford Arsenal experimented with black powder loading for teh 30 U.S.. It was not successful.
 
I think the .30/30 was if not the first then one of the first smokeless sporting rounds.
It was a .30 calibre loaded with 30 grains of smokeless powder as a nod to all the old black powder rounds. I've never seen a 1894 marked for black powder only, not saying they never were, just haven't seen one.
 
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