Blast from the past, Bring the LeeEnfield back?

I guess there is no chance to source the ammo that the Rangers use is there? it's IVI right? which means no civy sales?
 
As a guy who works in the arctic, when it's -45C with a 25 km/hr wind and the main threat is from white bears, I'd rather have a de-greased LE No.4 or No. 5 than a .223 semi auto with plastic furniture. This is only directed to the the subject of the Rangers and the suitability of their current rifles.
 
Slavex said:
I guess there is no chance to source the ammo that the Rangers use is there? it's IVI right? which means no civy sales?
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Nope IVI is still not selling to civies. And while i know rangers sometimes "dispose" of some of their ammo, it is considered to be Govt Property and can get one in trouble. (at $7 a box of 20, when you can find it might be worth the risk?)
 
100,000 rds of .303 in Canada would probably sell well. The catch would be finding someone who will pay up front and doesn't mind sitting on that ammo for 2-3 years while it slowly gets sold off.
Then again at 500 rds per case, that'd only be 200 cases.
 
HeadDamage said:
That is one idea I was thinking of but the main idea was to try and get some of the good shooters (top 10% sort of guys) to start taking Enfields to the big shoots once in awhile to give other shooters a chance at the top and to show that it can be done with Enfields.

For example: The Top five shooters at a provincal championship shoot from one year all show up with Enfields the next year. This would give other black rifle shooters a chance to place higher and it should show what can be done iwth an old cheaper rifle, assuming that the Enfields don't finish last but from my experence they will likely place middle of the pack or higher when shot by good shooters.
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This is a hell of a great idea...though you will get plenty of complaints from that top ten percent since they would have to invest in a LE to shoot.
The concept you are proposing is sound though there is another way to acheive the same.
In the first year the top shooters will place as normal...the next year these same top shooters will be handicapped...the higher the handicap the more difficult to score high. For example, the first place shooter in one would have their target scores reduced by a percentage in the second year, second place shooters would have their targets reduced by a lower percentage then the first place shooter etc, etc. If they are sneaky and only there to win they could try to sandbag the first year to lower their handicap. But they would run the risk of not winning then. Now the pride factor copmes into play...imagine the horror of any old LE beating an AR, or even and M-1 Garand do the same...MY GAWD the world would come to an end. :D
This is just a suggestion early in the morning before my regular three cups of Tim's.
Cheers
 
The top ten not suggested as a rule or a requirement, I was just trying to get the idea of some of the top shooters shooting enfields once in awhile to show what they could do and to encourage new people into the sport.
 
Exactly!I want to improve my shooting not get stale.You can only have so many gongs before its boring and someone elses turn.To bad some of the oldschool shooters don't think that way.
For me,shooting is the challenge to achieve something that I already know I can never achieve..but still continue to try anyways.
 
I'm still trying to shoot a day with no misses. I have come damn close a few times....I think my best day's shooting was on matches 1-8, with a 375/400....pretty pleased, but had a miss in the Naden that hurt.

A shoot with zero misses is my goal. 100% hits....14 years and still trying.

NS
 
First things first, I don't shoot service rifle matches, so feel free to treat this as what it is-unqualified comment. I'm quite surprised that speed would be an impediment with an Enfield, however - (those I do shoot) The 'mad minute' rapid fire contest record was 35 or so rounds on to a 12 inch steel plate at 300 yards, from prone (reloading included). While this isn't a record I'll break, it does suggest that speed is possible using the Enfield. How much speed is required and how much accuracy to be competitve - I've seen several posts that suggest a 2 minute rifle is theoretically capable of winning.
 
Bulls are all over three minutes for sevice rifle.It's the positional shooting that messes most people up.Anyone can shoot prone,but when you throw in sitting,kneeling and standing, people start to lose it.
 
Longshot said:
Bulls are all over three minutes for sevice rifle.It's the positional shooting that messes most people up.Anyone can shoot prone,but when you throw in sitting,kneeling and standing, people start to lose it.
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So assuming a good all position shooter, and a reasonable Enfield, it should be possible to place well despite the "equipment drawback". Many Milsurp shooters would love to see that.
 
Ok,

Let me draw on several years of scores and results, and let you guys decide if using a "historic" rifle such as the Enfield would be a detriment to scores...

This first string of results is as fired with AR-15 type rifles:

2007:

Webber-Rudland Cup (matches 1-4):
1. KF - 176 / 185
2. EF - 173
3. RD - 173

2006:

Webber-Rudland Cup (matches 1-4):
1. AW - 175 / 185
2. KF - 172
3. DF - 172

2005:

Webber-Rudland Cup (matches 1-4):
1. KF - 182 / 185
2. RD - 177
3. AF - 176

2004:

Webber-Rudland Cup (matches 1-4):
1. AW - 173 / 185
2. BB - 169
3. DW - 169

2003:

Webber-Rudland Cup (matches 1-4):
1. KF - 176 / 185
2. AW - 175
3. RD - 171

2002:

Rudland Cup (matches 1-4):
1. AW - 178 / 185
2. KF - 176
3. PM - 167


Now, we step over into the "Ishapore Cup" match, which is the annual historic arms shoot that we have:

2007 (not fired yet)

2006:

.303 / Ishapore Open (matches 1-4):
1. KF- 153 / 185
2. AW - 140
3. AF - 131

2005:

.303 / Ishapore Open (matches 1-4):
1. AW - 154 / 185
2. RD - 125
3. RM - 116


2004:

.303 / Ishapore Open (matches 1-4):
1. KF - 174 / 185
2. AW - 158
3. AF - 139

2003:

.303 / Ishapore Open (matches 1-4):
1. AW - 155 / 185
2. KF - 152
3. BB - 140

2002:

.303 / Ishapore Open (matches 1-4):
Not shot due to range restrictions.

2001:

.303 / Ishapore Open (matches 1-4):
1. AW - 154 / 185
2. DW - 136
3. RD - 128

So, let me see, the average score winning matches 1-4 with a Lee Enfield type rifle has been (on a 5 year average) 158 points (out of 185)

The 6 year average for winning with an AR-15 type rifle is 176 /185.

When you see initials repeated above, those in the "know" about service rifle in Nova Scotia will probably recognize a couple of them....and know the calibre of shooters you're seeing in these results. Put it this way, the QM7 shoots here....kicks my butt on a regular basis.

So, my point....

If experienced shooters, firing the same matches with an Enfield get a 18 point handicap to their regular scores, how many points will you be losing if you're not as experienced as they are?

Genuinely, if you want to come out with what you have and shoot, (be it an Enfield, a KAR-98, a Garand, etc) be welcome, but realize that your score will be at least 10% below what you could shoot with an AR type rifle.

If you're shooting for fun and camraderie, no big deal. If you think you'll be truly competitive, take a hard look at the guy beside you on the line and see if he'll lend you his scoped AR...

NavyShooter
 
I don't think that myself or Longshot expect to win with the Enfield, nor do we expect to as that is not the point, but we might be able to suprise some of the regular black rifle crowd. Also shooting the Enfield might sharpen our skills with the C7 style rifles not that they are too dull at this time ;)
 
HD is correct.I don't care about winning.I've shot a 578/600 and a 523/550 with an AR.HD is right in there too.I just want to try something different and maybe improve my shooting some.Going old school really appeals to me for some reason.
 
Hope to see you shooting a Hi-power or Webley for service pistol next year to Longshot ;)

PS... I just took delivery of a nice #4mk2 today, well used but still lots of life left in the old girl I hope :)
 
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