Bleeding Question

BigUglyMan said:
It doesn't make a difference, just higher chances of making a lethal hit when shooting into the heart/lung area than going for a headshot. "Bleeding" a game animal doesn't work. If you want to ensure that it is thoroughly drained, you'll want to hang it for a week or two, if possible.
Click to expand...

Dumbest thing I've ever heard.
 
Hi guys, looks like I'm a little late on the topic. But from my experience a lung shot animal that bleeds out while running will be better tasting than an animal that dies on the spot. A couple of years ago my wife and I were grinding up a couple of deer at home in the kitchen. When we started grinding the second deer my wife noticed a lot more blood in the grinder and asked why. The only difference was the first deer ran about 100 yards before packing it in, the second deer was hit in the neck and died on the spot.
The lung shot deer was better tasting and a year older than the neck shot deer. JMHO.
 
When I shoot a deer in the chest with gun or bow and I'm going to gut it instead of boning it out.
I cut/saw through the bottom of the rib cage from lower neck to the end of the rib cage, just before the diaphragm membrane that separates the chest cavity from the intestines. Shove a little stick in the saw cut to separate each side and flip the deer on its stomach to drain all the blood out of the chest cavity.

It isn't to bleed it out, which I do not think is necessary, but to get rid of all the blood that will flood in when gutting it.
Makes for a much cleaner workspace to hack on.
 
Over many years our variable hunting group took dozens of moose as well as deer, elk, bears, mountain goats. Caribou and a few sheep. A few of the meat animals by necessity were shot in the head but the preferred impact area was always the biggest fatal target, the heart/lung area. The goal was a quick humane death on the spot to try to avoid the problems associated with a runner. The heart/lung area provides fast, not always instant death and the greatest possibility of a fatal shot, which after all is the main goal. In my youth I tried cutting throats of dead animals, never got significant amounts of blood so gave it up.
If possible, the animal was first field dressed, splitting the breast bone and pelvis and opening the animal up from chin to anus, propping the cavity open and dumping or bailing the blood out of the cavity in the process, gallons in the case of a moose. Animals were then skinned on the ground, and quartered, especially if there was packing involved. These actions resulted in the fastest cooling of the meat which resulted in the best meat. Animals that were hung whole were sometimes skinned there but it’s easier when they’re warm. Whole or quartered animals continued to drip blood for a day or two depending on the weather but never yielded more than 1/2 cupful total, even from a moose.
Our meat, after 4-8 days of hanging protected from sun, wind and rain (or snow) was always tender and mild, excellent. Worked for us.
 
Ashcroft said:
Over many years our variable hunting group took dozens of moose as well as deer, elk, bears, mountain goats. Caribou and a few sheep. A few of the meat animals by necessity were shot in the head but the preferred impact area was always the biggest fatal target, the heart/lung area. The goal was a quick humane death on the spot to try to avoid the problems associated with a runner. The heart/lung area provides fast, not always instant death and the greatest possibility of a fatal shot, which after all is the main goal. In my youth I tried cutting throats of dead animals, never got significant amounts of blood so gave it up.
If possible, the animal was first field dressed, splitting the breast bone and pelvis and opening the animal up from chin to anus, propping the cavity open and dumping or bailing the blood out of the cavity in the process, gallons in the case of a moose. Animals were then skinned on the ground, and quartered, especially if there was packing involved. These actions resulted in the fastest cooling of the meat which resulted in the best meat. Animals that were hung whole were sometimes skinned there but it’s easier when they’re warm. Whole or quartered animals continued to drip blood for a day or two depending on the weather but never yielded more than 1/2 cupful total, even from a moose.
Our meat, after 4-8 days of hanging protected from sun, wind and rain (or snow) was always tender and mild, excellent. Worked for us.
Click to expand...

You Sir .... Know what you're doing!!

That's been my experience with game animals exactly. I once took a head shot on a moose up in the Peace River because that's the only shot I had at 60 yds. The rest of his body was effectively screened by red willow. I made the shot but I wouldn't do that again. No blood came out of the throat and I had cut it as quickly as I could. The blood was in the meat and it was a mess to butcher.

Once you turn off the brain with a head shot the heart stops pumping. That's just the reality of it.
 
PSE said:
Once you turn off the brain with a head shot the heart stops pumping. That's just the reality of it.
Click to expand...

No it doesn't. It stops pumping when it runs out of oxygen. You have to cut a major blood vessel (generally the carotid arteries) seconds after the shot, like they do in a slaughterhouse setting, for it to be effective in bleeding out an animal.
 
bearkilr said:
No it doesn't. It stops pumping when it runs out of oxygen. You have to cut a major blood vessel (generally the carotid arteries) seconds after the shot, like they do in a slaughterhouse setting, for it to be effective in bleeding out an animal.
Click to expand...

Even if you're right - which you're not, there's no way you're going to reach the animal in time after a brain shot in the bush to bleed it properly. At best I was maybe 3 minutes away from the moose I brained with 1 shot. By the time I got there with the knife the heart had well stopped and the blood coagulated in the meat. No heart pumping - no bleeding - none.

I will turn up a shot rather than go for the brain. You'll only do that once.
 
PSE said:
Even if you're right - which you're not, there's no way you're going to reach the animal in time after a brain shot in the bush to bleed it properly. At best I was maybe 3 minutes away from the moose I brained with 1 shot. By the time I got there with the knife the heart had well stopped and the blood coagulated in the meat. No heart pumping - no bleeding - none.

I will turn up a shot rather than go for the brain. You'll only do that once.
Click to expand...

I'm not wrong and my reply wasn't in regard to ethics, only that a heart continues to beat after a headshot. Google Intrinsic Cardiac Nervous System if you don't believe me.


The same applies to commercial operations. Just because an animal has a large hole in its brain doesn't mean it becomes a ragdoll. There are many parts of internal organs still functioning for a brief period of time. The one we’re primarily focused on is the heart.

Because the heart keeps beating after a shot to the head, blood is still flowing for a short time before death. With a quick cut to a major artery or organ within seconds of the incapacitation shot, the heart will work to pump out most of the blood in the animal. Blood is the vehicle that carries oxygen to the brain, so without blood, what's left of the brain ceases to function. This combination of incapacitation and bleeding out is what ensures a quick, humane death.

https://www.themeateater.com/cook/butchering-and-processing/do-you-need-to-bleed-deer
 
It’ll beat for a short time, felt many grouse and salmon hearts pumping for a minute or so right after dispatching them. I’m talkin shot or bonked to gutted in under a minute quick. the kids always get a kick out of it. I wouldn’t think it would do anything significant as it doesn’t last long at all
 
bearkilr said:
I'm not wrong and my reply wasn't in regard to ethics, only that a heart continues to beat after a headshot. Google Intrinsic Cardiac Nervous System if you don't believe me.


The same applies to commercial operations. Just because an animal has a large hole in its brain doesn't mean it becomes a ragdoll. There are many parts of internal organs still functioning for a brief period of time. The one we’re primarily focused on is the heart.

Because the heart keeps beating after a shot to the head, blood is still flowing for a short time before death. With a quick cut to a major artery or organ within seconds of the incapacitation shot, the heart will work to pump out most of the blood in the animal. Blood is the vehicle that carries oxygen to the brain, so without blood, what's left of the brain ceases to function. This combination of incapacitation and bleeding out is what ensures a quick, humane death.

https://www.themeateater.com/cook/butchering-and-processing/do-you-need-to-bleed-deer[/QUOTE

This isn’t the controlled environment of a commercial slaughterhouse here. The heart of a heart shot animal no longer is capable of pumping anything. The pump has a severe leak, even if it beats a few times it can’t drain the body’s muscles. A lung shot animal can fall, stand, walk or run. In all of these cases the heart is still pumping, effectively pushing all the body’s blood through the ruptured lung(s) and into the chest cavity. In the time spent observing the mortally wounded animal or possibly shooting again, then to alertly, slowly and cautiously walk perhaps 50-300 yards over rough, maybe broken ground while observing the downed animal to be sure it stays down, cautiously approaching and testing for immobility to prevent perhaps being injured by a thrashing animal, whoah! You’re now at the animal, it isn’t moving, appears dead. Only a fool tries to grab an animal before proving it to be completely dead and immobile, many hunters have been injured that way. Your heart is racing, mind alert, ready for instant action if required. All this has taken 5, 10, 15 minutes, maybe more, depending on distance, terrain, animal actions. So you think cutting the throat now will accomplish something? Not in the real world in the field. Yes, all this can be and is done in a slaughter house with a stunned and immobilized animal. We’re talking about real life hunting now, completely different as experienced hunters here will recognize.
Click to expand...
 
Ashcroft said:
bearkilr said:
I'm not wrong and my reply wasn't in regard to ethics, only that a heart continues to beat after a headshot. Google Intrinsic Cardiac Nervous System if you don't believe me.


The same applies to commercial operations. Just because an animal has a large hole in its brain doesn't mean it becomes a ragdoll. There are many parts of internal organs still functioning for a brief period of time. The one we’re primarily focused on is the heart.

Because the heart keeps beating after a shot to the head, blood is still flowing for a short time before death. With a quick cut to a major artery or organ within seconds of the incapacitation shot, the heart will work to pump out most of the blood in the animal. Blood is the vehicle that carries oxygen to the brain, so without blood, what's left of the brain ceases to function. This combination of incapacitation and bleeding out is what ensures a quick, humane death.

https://www.themeateater.com/cook/butchering-and-processing/do-you-need-to-bleed-deer[/QUOTE

This isn’t the controlled environment of a commercial slaughterhouse here. The heart of a heart shot animal no longer is capable of pumping anything. The pump has a severe leak, even if it beats a few times it can’t drain the body’s muscles. A lung shot animal can fall, stand, walk or run. In all of these cases the heart is still pumping, effectively pushing all the body’s blood through the ruptured lung(s) and into the chest cavity. In the time spent observing the mortally wounded animal or possibly shooting again, then to alertly, slowly and cautiously walk perhaps 50-300 yards over rough, maybe broken ground while observing the downed animal to be sure it stays down, cautiously approaching and testing for immobility to prevent perhaps being injured by a thrashing animal, whoah! You’re now at the animal, it isn’t moving, appears dead. Only a fool tries to grab an animal before proving it to be completely dead and immobile, many hunters have been injured that way. Your heart is racing, mind alert, ready for instant action if required. All this has taken 5, 10, 15 minutes, maybe more, depending on distance, terrain, animal actions. So you think cutting the throat now will accomplish something? Not in the real world in the field. Yes, all this can be and is done in a slaughter house with a stunned and immobilized animal. We’re talking about real life hunting now, completely different as experienced hunters here will recognize.
Click to expand...

I have no idea what you're trying to say. The only thing I've said is that the heart continues to function for a short time after a head shot, that is all. That's the reason slaughter houses cut throats, to bleed out animals.
Click to expand...
 
PSE said:
Even if you're right - which you're not, there's no way you're going to reach the animal in time after a brain shot in the bush to bleed it properly. At best I was maybe 3 minutes away from the moose I brained with 1 shot. By the time I got there with the knife the heart had well stopped and the blood coagulated in the meat. No heart pumping - no bleeding - none.

I will turn up a shot rather than go for the brain. You'll only do that once.
Click to expand...

You’re making yourself look pretty silly here by sticking to your guns that a heart stops beating as soon as a critter has something jammed in its brain. I’ve held plenty of fish, bird and small game hearts in my hand while they’re still trying to pump. You can even cut the heart out and have it keep beating in your hand.

Same deal with intestines. It’s creepy as heck holding a handful of slowly squirming intestines in your hands.

Tis the reason you can shoot livestock in the head and watch the blood pumping out with the rhythm of the heart. Or sometimes a head can be completely severed and the body will keep trying to work. When I was a chicken catcher I watched a guy kick the head off a chicken and its body ran around for a solid 10-15 seconds before dropping and twitching. Blood squirting out the whole time from its beating heart.
 
canadian hunter312 said:
You’re making yourself look pretty silly here by sticking to your guns that a heart stops beating as soon as a critter has something jammed in its brain. I’ve held plenty of fish, bird and small game hearts in my hand while they’re still trying to pump. You can even cut the heart out and have it keep beating in your hand.

Same deal with intestines. It’s creepy as heck holding a handful of slowly squirming intestines in your hands.

Tis the reason you can shoot livestock in the head and watch the blood pumping out with the rhythm of the heart. Or sometimes a head can be completely severed and the body will keep trying to work. When I was a chicken catcher I watched a guy kick the head off a chicken and its body ran around for a solid 10-15 seconds before dropping and twitching. Blood squirting out the whole time from its beating heart.
Click to expand...

Apparently hes never heard the term "chicken with its head cut off"....
 
canadian hunter312 said:
You’re making yourself look pretty silly here by sticking to your guns that a heart stops beating as soon as a critter has something jammed in its brain. I’ve held plenty of fish, bird and small game hearts in my hand while they’re still trying to pump. You can even cut the heart out and have it keep beating in your hand.

Same deal with intestines. It’s creepy as heck holding a handful of slowly squirming intestines in your hands.

Tis the reason you can shoot livestock in the head and watch the blood pumping out with the rhythm of the heart. Or sometimes a head can be completely severed and the body will keep trying to work. When I was a chicken catcher I watched a guy kick the head off a chicken and its body ran around for a solid 10-15 seconds before dropping and twitching. Blood squirting out the whole time from its beating heart.
Click to expand...

You"re the one looking silly and obviously have little experience with wildlife that's been shot in the field. By the time you get to the location of your animal that's been shot it's all over. No more blood will come from a cut throat. As previously stated - A slaughter house is not the same as hunting in field conditions.

Can You tell me why when I got to the location of my moose that had been shot in the head and then thoroughly cut its throat, no blood came out?? Also when I opened up the animal no blood in the cavity???? When I butchered the animal after going home I had a hell of a mess on the table - Why was that??

You show your lack of practical experience with comments like that. Some people have actually gone out and done that.
 
PSE said:
Can You tell me why when I got to the location of my moose that had been shot in the head and then thoroughly cut its throat, no blood came out?? Also when I opened up the animal no blood in the cavity???? When I butchered the animal after going home I had a hell of a mess on the table - Why was that??
Click to expand...

Because you didn't get to it fast enough. I've shot many farm animals in the head at the distance you shot your moose at and they bled out just fine after cutting the throat. It doesn't take 3 minutes to cover 60 yds.
 
bearkilr said:
Because you didn't get to it fast enough. I've shot many farm animals in the head at the distance you shot your moose at and they bled out just fine after cutting the throat. It doesn't take 3 minutes to cover 60 yds.
Click to expand...

'Lack of practical experience'?
Prolly seem more humans perish than animals, old Bearkilr has.
Mind you, he weren't gutting them, I hope
 
bearkilr said:
Because you didn't get to it fast enough. I've shot many farm animals in the head at the distance you shot your moose at and they bled out just fine after cutting the throat. It doesn't take 3 minutes to cover 60 yds.
Click to expand...

It does if you have to climb over deadfall. I guess you just hunt on the road so you just drive up to it in no time.

As I said "Lack of practical experience". Keep hunting you'll get there.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom