Brno or CZ

ebruder

ebruder

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Hi,

I know this is probably splitting hairs... but which rifle would provide the best accuracy... a new CZ 452 (American or Varmint) or a used Brno #4?

I'm in the market and could use your input.

Thanks

EB
 
which rifle would provide the best accuracy... a new CZ 452 (American or Varmint) or a used Brno #4?
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I have owned a #3. I got better scores in benchrest competition than any of the 452's I competed against, even the modified ones.
The #4 is an improved #3.
The 452 is very similar to the #2, and those with #2s claim they are more accurate than 452s. I think the #2 and the 452 are probably pretty close in accuracy but the #2 is likely to be more nicely finished and have a smoother working bolt.

I believe it is a slam-dunk that the #4 would be more accurate than the 452, or at the very least easier to shoot accurately.
The #4 is a lot bigger and heavier, with a much, much better trigger and much better sights and a longer sight radius. The bolt is slicker and seems to be machined to closer tolerances.The stock on the #4 is huge and rides the bags much better than the American and arguably better than the Varmint.
Basically the #4 is made to be more accurate than the 452 in every respect. The #4 is more similar to an anschutz 54 than it is to a CZ 452. Even if all other things were equal, the much heavier #4 would shoot more accurately than the 452 on weight alone.
The downside:
1. Some of the #4s saw heavy use as military trainers, and a lot were literally beat to death. The only target rimfire I have ever seen with the rifling burned out was a #4.
2. Most people would find he #4 too large and heavy to hunt with or carry in the field.
 
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Varmint, nicer wood(not shore bought), may get better accuracy
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Lots of shooters feel the american has more accuracy potential than the varmint because it has an extra mounting lug so it can be more securely bedded to the stock and there are more options for tuning the screws.
 
reg said:
Lots of shooters feel the american has more accuracy potential than the varmint because it has an extra mounting lug.
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The one I got , you could shift the metal in the wood , and hear it knocking around(screw bolts were snugged up), a bedding job fixed that. Never had a problem with the lux models at all, maybe thats the beast to go with, never bedded the lux models. The heavy recoil from that cal, maybe you should get the American
 
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ebruder:

Without knowing your intented use it is kinda splitting hairs. The CZ452 american with a trigger kit from Eric Brooks( cz452.com) and the trigger adjusted will shoot very well. For a gopher shooter like me its the answer.

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A brno #3 or #4 for target shooting at paper would be the choice. Same trigger but only likely needs adjusting to your preference. With sights as pictured and the way it sits a bag you won't go wrong.
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Cowboy
 
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I've never fired a CZ but i had a brno#3 and have a brno#4 and both of them are very accurate,like the guys in the previous post mentioned it all depends what your using it for.The brno's are very heavy and more suited for target practice,not something you want to lug around all day.
onthos
 
First off, I concur with Reg & Cowboy completely.

Ardent said:
They both came out of the same plant,
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Sorry but this isn't and wasn't ever true when it came to true as far as the Brno Models #1-5. It is true that there may have been a few #2's in the 70's or so that were made by Brno and later assembled by CZ and distributed. However what is also true is that they were more forced step sister companies during communist rule than anything and were were competitors before and after it.

I'd say it's an either or proposition, it would boild down to the individual rifle.
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Sorry, not to be a pain, nor is this meant to be any kind of pissing match as they are both very fine rifles and some of the best for the money spent. But...as good as the CZ are and as much as I like them. (I have several)..they are no Brno (Have coupla e of dozen). For the average shooter, they may never notice it on the targets as far as Sporters are concerned (Brno #1,2 & 5 vs any 452) nor on plinking/hunting. However, when it comes to handling you will know it the moment you pick it up and cycle it...even if blind folded in comparison to a Brno. Now, when it comes to targeting, with the Model #3's or #4's with their 28" heavy barrels, OEM barrel tuners, bench rest type stocks, tighter match type chambers and barrels among other things...the Brno Model #3's & #4's were born and bread for targeting. Those that have them have done extremely well through the years in this regard. Actually it is a rare thing for one of their owners to give them up if the have spent much time with them at all. Now a Model #3 or #4 vs a CZ varmint or any 452 for that matter...I'm betting on the Brno every time in competent hands. I also believe that more times than not the Brno Model #1's #2's & #5's will come out ahead as well. JMHO

will but as far For reference, both are generally tack drivers.
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Very true and all will serve you. One thing with the Brno...you are buying history. With the CZ you are still buying heritage...but they are still copies of an original design under lisense...given under duress during the communist years. Don't get me wrong, I like the CZ's...I have several. I also pretty much don't buy any current rifles besides CZ's as I feel like they are the biggest bang for the buck. But...given a choice between a Brno in good shape and a NIB CZ, there is no hesitation in me...I take the Brno every time..And I have a few dozen times.

Just a couple of pennies worth and that's about it.
 
Split hairs....depends on the gun, ammo, humidity, wind, sun, scope...etc etc. There is no more finicky shooting than with 22's. Matching the proper ammo with any gun can be a fulltime job alone, and really most guns WILL outshoot the shooter. As long as the gun isn't hurt due to improper cleaning or the use of copper plated ammo etc, then you should be alright. I had a CZ 452 Varmint and it competed with 54 Annie's. I also witnessed an old 16" barrelled Brno beat the pants off $3000++ Annies's yesterday at a fun match...Bottom line it depends on the gun and of course how comfortable you are with the gun. The Brno's were made with more care than the CZ's but so were alot of things back in the day, if a gun is proven and your happy with it's performance then make her yours....Happy shooting!
 
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trouter-chris said:
I also witnessed an old 16" barrelled Brno beat the pants off $3000++ Annies's yesterday at a fun match..... QUOTE]

The point spread between first and third was 10pts. Brno was first followed by almost all Annies, light sporting to BR type. It was a fun shoot. The first part had some luck in drawing of the targets you shoot, and there were times when the wind was erratic, and times when it was almost calm. The shoot ran less than two hours. So all was not really equal; as I said, it was a fun shoot. Now next month now will be a more serious BR shoot w. BR type targets....and we just won't let any Brnos shoot!:evil: ......................just kidding. Bet you can't tell I'm an Annie shooter; like forever. My first rifle for shooting targets was a Cooey! Had fun; still do. That's the whole point, well almost.:)

Bottom line; the game is mostly mental discipline, then the shooter, and finally equipment. There are a lot of good capable guns out there. A lot depends on what you want to do, where you are headed and the funds to get you there. The fun part is in the trip. ;)

Didn't mean to steal the thread. Point being that Brnos shoot. Listen to what the other Brno and Cz owners have to say. If you can get one to try out even better. Good luck w. your decision.
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Brno's are much more abundant in Canada then in the States. Like the others have said I would look for a #3 or #4. I have the 4 and it is a solid rifle. I found that it is a good hunting rifle as well. Hunted (walked) alot with it this past fall without any grumblings of it being too heavy. (mine was scoped)
 
The sporter weight Brno #1, #2 and #5 make awesome hunting rifles too. You can easily hit chickens consistently in the head at 80 yards with no alteration to the gun except maybe adding a scope. Nothing wrong with using a CZ like an American, Lux etc. because they're plenty accurate too! I agree with 581 on the old gun/old world workmanship of the Brno's though. Personally I love those gun's!!! I must have more!!!
 
My Brno Mod 4 is the most accurate rifle I have ever shot, and the quality of the machining and metal finishing is excellent. It even makes me look like a good shot. Best group (benched) .3 at 50 yds for 5 rounds with irons (peep). I haven't had it out since I mounted the 6-24 Elite, but given it's accuracy I didn't think the scope was excessive.
 
Well a Brno #4 won!

Thanks for all your input and help... it made my decision very easy

It's in the mail... I can't wait...

While I'm thinking of it... does anyone know where to buy extra mags? I know I'll be looking for surplus, but does anyone have any leads?

Thanks

EB
 
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You're in luck with the magazines. The bolt action Brno Rimfires (#1, #2, #3, #4, and #5) magazines are all interchangeable with each other, and also with the newer bolt action CZ rimfires. Sould be easy to find one.
 
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