Browning High-Power question

Morgayne said:
I'm wondering how people feel about the Browning High-power 9mm?

I'm looking at it for my first HG
oh, and I have small hands (well, I have girl hands...)

Thoughts? Reviews? Opinions?
First, my opinion on "first handgun" is that anything other than a .22 for a first handgun is a lousy choice, just as it is for rifle. There is simply no substitute for being able to do a LOT of practice with inexpensive ammunition that also happens to have very mild recoil. If you don't practice a lot, you'll never move beyond "plinking fun" level. Even buying surplus and/or remanufactured ammunition, reloading, etc, you will never be able to shoot for anywhere near the cost of .22 ammunition. And even though there's about a dozen handguns in the safe, when accuracy starts going out the window, I go to one of the .22's to start figuring out what the problem is.

As to the Browning High Power for your first centerfire handgun, absolutely. I've owned more than a few, and my current BHP is a .40 S&W, for both CCW (have a home in Montana, spend a lot of time there, and have a CCW permit) and fun n' games. This is the first one that has been a poor performer: abysmal accuracy, keyholing bullets, oversize bore, etc. However, Browning guarantees 4" at 50 yards with the BHP, so I'm sure when it comes back it will be as accurate as all the previous ones have been. I tried to buy the last 9mm I sold back, but the current owner wants more than I'm prepared to pay.

I have small hands, my wife has hands about the same size, and neither of us have any problem with pistol dimensions, even with the double stack design. The design, in fact, has a reputation of fitting even those with smaller hands. If you want to go smaller than stock, a pair of Craig Speigel, Navidrex, etc grips will make the grip smaller yet. Nothing to worry about; many people do the same thing with revolvers to get a smaller grip, even S&W K frames.

The magazine disconnect does not need to be removed either to improve the trigger pull (although it will, but brings other unwelcome results) or to keep a range officer happy at a competition. Even with small hands I simply put a finger in the magazine well, press on the magazine disconnect, and pull the trigger. No problem. If you don't like the trigger or the trigger reset... pay for a trigger job by somebody who actually knows what they are doing. Again, no problem. If you want a Bullseye grade trigger right out of the box, this is not your pistol.

Recoil is pretty ho-humm... this is not a lightweight pistol, and as a result even with defense ammunition like Cor-Bons (which you DON'T want to be buying for recreational shooting unless you have deep pockets), neither the 9mm or the .40 S&W should cause anyone any grief.

I really like them, even with the annoyance of the warranty problems with my latest High Power, and if I had to choose just one handgun to keep out of everything in the gun safe, the BHP would be my choice.
 
Miraclejoe said:
The major problem we typicaly run into are the non serviceble mags that keep staying in the system. They cause multyple stoppages/jams.
I am not in the CF anymore, but I have yet to meet a gun plumber who refused to deal with unserviceable magazines/firearms. Either fix the problem, or condemn the thing. Assuming that is correct, taking all unserviceable magazines to the gun plumbers until you do get a collection of reliable magazines should address the issue.

Let me also comment on the sights that come with the standard issue. Not the greatest. Pet peeve of mine.
That is fair to say. British influence... almost like the Webley sights...
 
Have a high power practical, love it and it has very nice sights straight out of the box. None of the issue garp. Very reliable, a little more dirt sensitive than a glock say, but keep it clean and it runs fine. If you get a new one, the safety may be sticky going on for a while, (you have to pull the hammer back about .02 with your thumb and then it will go on till it breaks in. Doesn't do it all the time, just enough to be annoying, but I'm told it goes away with break in) I have small hands (IE, can't reach 1911 mag release or slide release with my strong hand thumb, oh the shame) and the hi power fits quite well. As to recoil, well, to me its the lightest recoiling 9 I shoot, it's all steel after all and damps the movement quite nicely IMHO. The XD in 9 is a real pussy cat as well (must be something to do with the polymer frame) and fits small hands really really well. Hope this helps.
 
Bhp

As has been said before buy a .22 first and learn to shoot. But then;

I've had two BHP pistols. The first was a practical model about ten years ago and I just couldn't like the factory trigger and that ring hammer would bloody the web of my hand in no time so I quickly sold it off. Just this spring I decided to try again and bought a lightly used Mark III. I took out the mag safety which was really quite easy, shortened the hammer spurr a bit and have shot it a lot. The trigger certainly is not as nice as a tuned 1911 but the grip size and shape are excellent. I really like this pistol. It currently has Hogue grips which interfere with manipulating the safety for me and so yesterday I ordered a set of Spegal grips from Novak's. The sights on the Mark III are fine for my use and easy to see. The accuracy is pretty good and it has run flawlessly. I have shot quite a few Sig P226 and S&W 9mm pistols and both are good but I believe that this Browning will be staying with me for quite awhile.

Regards,

Outdoors
 
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Great non-plastic toy that I'd never sell
cowb.gif
, it's classic like 1911 for 9mm...
 
outdoors said:
The first was a practical model about ten years ago and I just couldn't like the factory trigger and that ring hammer would bloody the web of my hand in no time so I quickly sold it off
That's interesting... I get a lot more hand clearance with the ring hammer as opposed to the spur hammer. The spur hammer touches my hand once in a while - just enough to make me nervous. When this BHP goes back to sort out it's accuracy/barrel problems, I am going to ask them to change the hammer out to the ring hammer and bill me for it.
 
Bhp

Rick said:
That's interesting... I get a lot more hand clearance with the ring hammer as opposed to the spur hammer. The spur hammer touches my hand once in a while - just enough to make me nervous. When this BHP goes back to sort out it's accuracy/barrel problems, I am going to ask them to change the hammer out to the ring hammer and bill me for it.

Rick,

I guess everyone is different but the practical's ring hammer really pinched the web of my hand. Others say that it is actually the shank/leg of the hammer that bites (catching skin between the hammer and tang) instead of the ring itself. Cylinder & Slide sell a nice looking ring hammer that you can view on thier site to eliminate this. Supposed to be made of excellent steel and looks nice. Shortening the spur only took a little time and has worked great for me. I got the idea from the hipowers and handguns site by Mr. Camp which has been a great resource for the BHP.

Regards,

Wesley
 
I love the Browing HP as I also have small hands, but if I could only have 1 gun (and I do right now) it would be the CZ75. If I could have 2 well... I would definitely have a HP (But first I have to get a revolver)
 
So I'm definitely sold on getting a BHP at some point, but I'm wondering for everyone suggesting that I start with a .22 if they have a specific HG in mind?
 
Morgayne said:
So I'm definitely sold on getting a BHP at some point, but I'm wondering for everyone suggesting that I start with a .22 if they have a specific HG in mind?


Find a used high standard or a ruger mk 1, 2 or 3. You won't go wrong with any of them, and on a good day you'll find a mk 1 for 200, 300 for the mk 2, and a high standard between 250 and 4.
 
John Moses Browning designed the 1911 (is given credit for it), he then "improved" his design, this became the Browning HP.
 
first handgun

The Ruger Mk II is always a good choice for a first .22. I know many target shooters that get one and never get anything different. If you do want to upgrade later, they are never hard to sell. In my experience, they tend to always work and don't tend to be fussy about ammo. Spare magazines are easy to get. While High Standards were good guns, they haven't been made for quite some time and many of the used ones you may come across could be badly worn. I had a Mitchell Arms copy of a High Standard and I wasn't impressed with how quickly it started to show wear, so I sold it. One trick I learned when shooting the Ruger is to put a piece of hockey tape down the back of the grip to stop the gun from sliding around in my hand when I shoot (O.K., I have sweaty hands and I'm too cheap to buy replacement grips:redface: ).
 
I'm glad to hear you're sold on the Hi Power. It's a good idea to start with a .22, but I've never been real big on good ideas. I started out with a gorgeous 9mm Belgian Commercial production HP that I bought here on the EE. When it all comes down to it, I'd sell my car and walk to work before I sold this gun. Thanks to Alberta Tactical Rifle, I've got a Cylinder & Slide extended slide release and an extended safety put on, and they're great. My hands aren't too small anyways, but the positive grip you get just blows away the stock pieces. I also got the mag safety removed, and the trigger is just ###y now.

I shoot mine in IPSC/IDPA (Just started this year), and no matter what some of the guys at the club said, my gun has never held me back. I love it, and I can't imagine ever getting rid of it.
 
Morgayne, if you've got an extra $300.00 or so to spend you could get a hi power and get a .22lr conversion kit as well.

Problem is then you will only have one handgun:eek:

Any of you Hi Power owners use .22lr conversion kits?
 
Morgayne said:
So I'm definitely sold on getting a BHP at some point, but I'm wondering for everyone suggesting that I start with a .22 if they have a specific HG in mind?

Purchasing a Ciener .22 conversion kit for the BHP is certainly an intriguing possibility:

http://www.22lrconversions.com/hpk-pg.htm
hppkongns.gif


Having just one pistol that you shoot both .22 and .40 S&W with is a sound concept - the ergonomics, trigger pull, etc remain the same, although the balance of the pistol is probably changed somewhat due to the different weight of the slide. In fact, I do believe I have just talked myself into buying one! More is better for many folks, but having one handgun that you configure for each need has some real marksmanship advantages. There are not a few serious trap and skeet shooters out there who have one basic shotgun with various sets of barrels, according to intended use.

If the High Power with a conversion kit right from the word go isn't for you, I would highly recommend one of these:

HiStandardSet.jpg

HiStandardOlympic.jpg


I've shot S&W and Ruger .22 pistols a fair amount, but I think the High Standards are about as good as it gets. The one above is mine; you can purchase a new one for about $845 new, minus the adjustable barrel weights, muzzle brake, etc.

Ignore the Tom Swift muzzle brake and weights on the barrel in the picture above - they're competition accessories. The original High Standard pistols went under sometime in the 80's. However, the assets, design rights, etc were purchased and High Standard pistols are being manufactured again:

http://www.highstandard.com/

In addition, they were probably the most popular .22 competition pistol for decades (Ruger has now probably held that honour for a decade or so), so it is not like used ones in fine shape are hard to find.

You should put the LCF out of your mind when choosing a handgun to buy. It is the feel and fit of the handgun which should govern your decision - assuming the candidates being considered are all reliable, accurate, and within your price range.
 
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The BHP was my first hangun (1971), still have it, and will always have it. It is one of the classics. I have small hands, the BHP feels like it was designed for my hands.........no better feeling grip is to be found in the world of firearms for me (others echo this also). It is a very reliable running unit as well.

Buy a .22 RF as well; a Ruger, Hi Standard, or a Smith & Wesson M41 or M46 will serve anyone well.
 
Can-down said:
Morgayne, if you've got an extra $300.00 or so to spend you could get a hi power and get a .22lr conversion kit as well.

Problem is then you will only have one handgun:eek:

Any of you Hi Power owners use .22lr conversion kits?

If you have an extra $300 then go buy a Ruger Mark II bull barrel.

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When we have new shooters at the gun club ( http://www.mts.net/~wrpa/ ) and they are interested, I bring out three .22s for them to try. A Ruger mark II, a High Standard Citation, and a Smith & Wesson 41. I also bring out a S&W revolver for them to shoot but that's a side issue.

These three guns are good choices. The Ruger is the least expensive. The S&W is the most. The Ruger does not have as good a trigger as the other two. You probably will not notice this. Most people only are able to feel the difference after a lot of careful shooting. If you can get any of these in good condition (the ones I bought were all used but shot little) they would be good choices. As far as High Standards as pictured above in #38 above (I also have one as pictured) I much prefer the models with a 'military' grip. Less of an angle to the grip, more like a model 1911 or the highpower. While the Ruger has more of a sloping grip I will just say that's all right.

I don't think much about the Browning Buckmark (I'm sure there are some howls about that). I would consider than more a plinker gun. They seem less durable. If you have one you should stick to low velocity ammo. The Beretta Neos U-22 is also a plinker gun and I would not recommend it.

As I've said before, try them before you buy them. All these guns look good. The little differences may or may not be important to you in the long run. While my S&W 41 is a little bit more accurate (on a machine rest) than my HighStandard Citation, I prefer shooting the Citation because I like the way it feels in my hand (including the balance).

Going on again about the Ruger (I have three, one on long term loan to a new shooter) I don't typically shoot it. It is a very durable gun. It eats up high velocity ammo (I buy the bulk cheap stuff) with no problem. Guns like the Buckmark should stick to low velocity ammo which is more expensive (not that much more though). If you decided to sell the Ruger you would most likely get your money back (assuming you buy a good used one).

One final note. Don't over clean your guns. Some shooters clean their guns when it is not required. Some may be doing more damage by incorrectly cleaning their guns. I'll leave it at that. It may make a good new thread though.
 
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