Bullet seating stem mashing bullet tips

CZ_Brno

CZ_Brno

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Looking for any tips guys. Thanks. :)

I just did up some reloads for my .338 win. mag. For some reason when I use the bullet seating/crimper die on my Lyman die set it mashes the bullet tips all the way from partly seated to fully seated. The plug must be contacting the end of the bullets rather then the sides. I've never had any issues like this with any other die sets I have. RCBS, Bonanza, Redding, and Lee. The bullets used are 225 grain Hornady Interlocks. Shown is a reload beside a factory Federal 225 grain cartridge.

338225grain.jpg
 
If the dies are new you could send them back as this should not happen or if you have access you could chuck the stem in a lathe and drill the stem a little deeper so it won't touch the tip and just touch the ogive.
 
Looking at the photo, I'm struck by the amount of force it must have taken to deform the tips like that. To be sure, lead is pretty soft, but that's still odd. Do you lubricate the inside of your case necks?
 
I was thinking lubricant might help but I don't think I have anything on hand right now that won't contaminate the powder. And seeing as I'm using Winchester brass and IMR 4350 at the moment it fills the cases right up to the base of the necks.
 
Somebody here made a suggestion that I have found works really well. Fill a 35mm film cannister or something like it three-quarters full of fine lead shot. Give it a good squirt of graphite, put the lid on and shake it. Push the neck of the case into the shot up to the shoulder. Voila! - lubed case neck. No contamination of propellent, no brushes to clean and it works a charm. Give it a shake once in a while to keep the graphite evenly distributed.

Not sure that this is your problem. But it's easy to try and might be the trick.
 
Dunno, frankly. I had a squeeze bottle of fine powdered graphite and used that. I might give the flaked stuff a try - what's the worst thing that could happen?
 
Are you seating and crimping in one operation? It looks like maybe it crimps before the bullet is seated and then the bullet tip gets mashed as the seating is completed against the crimp. If you are doing this, seat and crimp in two separate operations and see if your problem goes away. I don't crimp my .338 WM loads and have had no issues, so maybe consider eliminating the crimp altogether.

FWIW, I have found that not all bullet seating dies will work with all bullet profiles. I had a Lee die that would hang up on Nosler Accubond bullets and pull them back out of the case. Using a different seating die that had a different profile on the seater eliminated the problem.


Mark
 
I just tried some different things. I run a brush inside the neck case. I used graphite inside the neck. I set up the seater die to not crimp this time. The bullet still mashes at the tip. It looks like during resizing the expander ball maybe isn't opening up the neck quite enough. The bullet sits on top of the neck without going in at all but when started it's not crushing the brass either. It seem to take an unusual amount of force to seat the bullet. The cup of the seater plug is concave but still must be letting the bullet tip bottom out inside it.
 
I wonder if I could drill a tiny bit into the seater plug like they describe on the Lee support site?

The Bullet Seater plug that comes with the die set is as close to generic as we can make it. If you find that the bullet seater plug deforms the nose of the bullet you are trying to seat, we can make a custom bullet seater plug to fit your bullet. For this we would need a sample bullet, payment of $8 plus shipping. Current lead time is 4 to 6 weeks.

Many times, you can fix this yourself through the use of a drill press. Secure the seater plug under a 3/32" bit and drill further into it. The distance should never be increased by more than 1/4". If this does not solve the issue, we recommend sending it to us.

A custom bullet seating plug can be ordered online.

Send the sample bullet to our address:
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mmattockx said:
Are you seating and crimping in one operation? It looks like maybe it crimps before the bullet is seated and then the bullet tip gets mashed as the seating is completed against the crimp. If you are doing this, seat and crimp in two separate operations and see if your problem goes away. I don't crimp my .338 WM loads and have had no issues, so maybe consider eliminating the crimp altogether.

FWIW, I have found that not all bullet seating dies will work with all bullet profiles. I had a Lee die that would hang up on Nosler Accubond bullets and pull them back out of the case. Using a different seating die that had a different profile on the seater eliminated the problem.


Mark
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^^crimping too soon was my first thought. Had it happen on some 30-06s. I just backed the die off a hair.
 
have your tried seating a bullet in a case with no powder in it? sounds like your case is to full of powder and you are seating the bullet deep enough to compress the poweder ( powder will only compress so much) when the powder is compressed as much as it can the bullet tip starts to deform. Try seating with an empty case then with a case with a couple of grains less powder and see if there is a differance
 
The bullet tip is bottoming out in the seater stem. You will have to drill out the hole so the bullets are contacting on the ogive and not the tip. Thats assumeing that it even has a hole, some seaters were made with roundnose bullets in mind.Looking at your pictures I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case with yours.In that case a replacement seater is an easier fix. Most manufacturers will give you one if you ask.

Its easy to check. Take the seater stem out of the die and fit a bullet into it by hand. If it wiggles the point is touching first.

On a related point, excessive bullet run-out can often be traced to the same issue. Many of my dies have been modified because VLD and plastic tipped bullets will sometimes bottom out in a stem that is fine with most hunting bullets. This happens more often with older dies.
 
r204 said:
have your tried seating a bullet in a case with no powder in it? sounds like your case is to full of powder and you are seating the bullet deep enough to compress the poweder ( powder will only compress so much) when the powder is compressed as much as it can the bullet tip starts to deform. Try seating with an empty case then with a case with a couple of grains less powder and see if there is a differance
Click to expand...

Just tried it. Another great idea, thanks r204. The bullet still mashes but I made up a sequence of different powder charges from 67-71 grains of IMR 4350 for testing and it seems to mash just a little more with the powder up to the neck.

Dogleg said:
The bullet tip is bottoming out in the seater stem. You will have to drill out the hole so the bullets are contacting on the ogive and not the tip. Thats assumeing that it even has a hole, some seaters were made with roundnose bullets in mind.Looking at your pictures I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case with yours.In that case a replacement seater is an easier fix. Most manufacturers will give you one if you ask.

Its easy to check. Take the seater stem out of the die and fit a bullet into it by hand. If it wiggles the point is touching first.

On a related point, excessive bullet run-out can often be traced to the same issue. Many of my dies have been modified because VLD and plastic tipped bullets will sometimes bottom out in a stem that is fine with most hunting bullets. This happens more often with older dies.
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I think that's it. Thanks very much Dogleg. I'll take the seater die out and try that. I also filled out a ticket with Lyman to see what they say.
 
I had a similar problem when the A-Max bullet came out.

I just took a drill bit and drilled down into the seater cavity, so that the shoulder did all the work and nothing touched the tip pf the bullet.
 
It's definitely the seater stem. I took it out and the bullet flops around loosely inside of it and the tip touches the bottom. It looks like it should be a lot deeper to grab the ogive of the bullet. Hopefully Lyman will send me another stem. Thanks guys.
 
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