C-96 Broomhandle bolt stop

del3840

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Broomhandle Guru's...I have a older model cone hammer and there is two bolt stops..one in the usual place when out of ammo and held open, and then the other is when i rack it far enough the bolt stops with the hammer at the start of the ramp at bottom of bolt..is this right or is the recoil spring compressing too much?
By pulling down on the hammer a bit the bolt then stops at the usual place with empty magazine..has the drop safety...thanks for any info..del
 
pics please

the true bolt stop is the 'switch' on the upper rear right of the barrel extension (upper receiver)

the mag follower holds the bolt open

some mauser broomies have a hold open function built into the hammer.....mostly the full auto variants

and pics pleeze
 
neat!

the hold open on the hammer allows you to load the mag with individual rounds....or....if it was a 20rnder you could load using two clips (removing the loading clip normally lets the bolt close)

is it for sale?
 
Sidelining this a bit but who is familiar enough with Astra 902s to say whether they have a bolt hold open mechanism other than the mag follower? It seems the 903 had a notch in the bolt for that purpose, but the 902 does not, making loading the second stripper clip a bit of an exercise in futility.
 
Is this a true antique with papers? Since only the first two years are, they all seem prototypes to a certain extent - there seems to be a lot of variation.

The hammer on yours also seems different from mine and other cone hammers I've seen - almost like it was filed down on the sides. The forward edge also seems curved...

Mine does not have the second bolt hold like yours... but if I pull the bolt further back and then pull the trigger and let the hammer drop a bit, it comes up and catches the bolt in the same fashion... Then I have to pull the hammer back to take it off this hold.

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Is this what you have to do or does the hammer catch just by itself?

Either way, I learned something new today - this will make it easier to load single bullets or empty the magazine if necessary.
 
yes i agree theres something weird about the hammer and the safty levers end is bigger in dia than my gun to, the hammer looks diffrent than any antique conehammer ive had.
mine looks exactly like the one in the two pictures above in the post above mine ^
id like to see pics of the entire gun of the OP.
 
Hey Del,

Fine piece of history you have there. May I suggest that you remove the pic that shows the serial? That's information that only you should know, unless you don't care about who knows.

Honestly it just looks like the hammer has the sides ground down on the first ring of the cone. Everything else looks correct for the gun. Fine looking pistol you have there.
 
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Thanks...does need some cleaning up as its got some pitting..as for serial # every one says is it a antique? are you sure? they can now find out for themselves...

The reason I suggest removal of the pic with the serial is that (without going into detail) it can be used against you, it can be used against others, and it can be used to connect you to the C-96. Again if you don't mind any of that then that's your decision.

As for me I'm looking at other clues other than the serial, yes this is antique. Once you learn up on C-96 you'll find that serial # is but one of the methods of identifying an antique, and not always the most accurate as they were made in multiple production runs that started at # 0 each time. There's a C-96 on the EE right now with serial #8###, but it's other identifying clues put it's production around 1915 - 1920. As for yours the identifying clues combined with the serial is what matters and proves antiquity, not serial alone.
 
You did not answer my question, but I think I figured it out with more reading and looking at the pictures. Please correct me if I'm wrong:

If you pull the bolt far enough back, the hammer catches on the protrusion on the bottom of the bolt and holds it _on its own_.

This is not something that happens on mine (I have to pull the trigger and drop the hammer for it to catch) and I do not believe it is supposed to happen. The hammer locks back in a position that is too low (I assume it locks)? I don't know if this is an indication of a mechanical problem... but once again this is certainly a different behaviour than what I'm seeing.

Also, your second set of pictures that shows the front part of the bolt seems to show a gap between the bolt face and the chamber edge. Can c96s have headspacing issues? That gap would worry me if that was my c96...

But if loki (he's the resident expert) doesn't think that's a problem, I'll chalk it up to another peculiarity of the prototyping runs...
 
You did not answer my question, but I think I figured it out with more reading and looking at the pictures. Please correct me if I'm wrong:

If you pull the bolt far enough back, the hammer catches on the protrusion on the bottom of the bolt and holds it _on its own_.

This is not something that happens on mine (I have to pull the trigger and drop the hammer for it to catch) and I do not believe it is supposed to happen. The hammer locks back in a position that is too low (I assume it locks)? I don't know if this is an indication of a mechanical problem... but once again this is certainly a different behaviour than what I'm seeing.

This could be a difference in bolt length, of course without them both on hand to mic the bolts this is speculation at the moment. Another of the many variations during the initial development of the C-96 was known as 'long extractor' and 'short extractor' which did lead to some variation of the bolt, barrel assembly, and ejection port sizing.

Keep in mind that these were hand machined and parts were individually fitted to the pistol, which is why a fully matching C-96 and one that isn't matching can behave a little differently. Especially during takedown and re-assembly, matching pistols are buttery smooth to takedown and re-assemble, where as non matched pistols can be problematic and require some tricks that would make Macguyver proud ;). A non matched bolt can cause slightly different mechanical behavior if not fitted properly.

Also, your second set of pictures that shows the front part of the bolt seems to show a gap between the bolt face and the chamber edge. Can c96s have headspacing issues? That gap would worry me if that was my c96...

On closer inspection you're correct, that gap can likely be closed with a firm tap on the rear of the bolt, much like a forward assist on a rifle. If that clears the issue this is a sure sign of dire need for a spring replacement, something that should be done prior to shooting for the sake of safety. While replacing the springs I would do the bolt spring, firing pin spring (this requires fitting), lockwork mainspring, and since you've now upgraded everything the mag spring as well just to make sure it keeps up with the rest of the new springs. Of course Del already has new springs on order, so we'll see if that clears this gap up.

Otherwise if a spring replacement doesn't clear the issue then it'd be interesting to note if the bolt matches the pistol. If not it could require further fitting, another issue that should be cleared up prior to pulling the trigger on a live round.
 
The Hammer is diffrent than most you see it has a curved forward edge if you look close you will see that its diffrenrt also the safty levers end piece is bigger and diffrent.
Maby its just the lower serial number ones are abit diffrent mines in the 5000s. Check the numbers on the hammer and safty lever see if they match all the parts are numbered eh.
Strip it down and clean it really good before you go buying all new springs theres a few good utube vids on how to strip them.
Sometimes old dry grit and old hard oil can be the reason you think you need new springs.
Check the bolt stop for cracks to while its apart to.
 
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