C77 ball ammo

cybershooters

cybershooters

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We're always moaning about stupid laws on here and what can be done to change them, but how about convincing SNC to sell C77 to Canadians in Canada? Whatever stupid regulation it is that stops them from doing it, tell me, I'll see my MP about it.

Totally bizarre to me we are dependent on this unreliable supply of ammo from overseas when C77 is about the best 5.56 ball out there.

Is a politician going to oppose selling Canadian ammo to Canadians when we can buy similar overseas-made ammo from any gunshop (that has some stock)?
 
SNC was sold to General Dynamics in 2007 if I recall, also they are a American company so do not be surprised if ITAR is involved.

gadget
 
SNC has nothing to do with it. Your MP doesn't either. The CF hasn't released anything for sale to civilians for eons. Mid-60's, I think. Aside from that, SNC no longer owns IVI. "Sold" to General Dynamics, with the full approval of the Chretein Gang, in 2006.
The Socialist F**ks are politicians. They'd rather destroy surplus(of which there is none) CF kit than sell it.
 
What is the reason, is it because the govt. are being dicks or is it because GD are being dicks? Or some combination. Clearly ammo can be exported to Canada from the US so ITAR isn't that big of an issue.

Just seems we put all this effort into moaning about things, this would be small potatoes by comparison.
 
sunray said:
The CF hasn't released anything for sale to civilians for eons.
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But we're not talking about CF ammo, I'm talking about new ammo. Why can't GD sell it to us? I remember it was some "policy" because Diemaco had the same thing going on but if it's a policy based on being scared of the govt. let's get it clarified.
 
cybershooters said:
Why can't GD sell it to us?
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1) The military contract may be taking up all of their capacity.
2) Their contract may stipulate no civilian sales. The UN has brow beaten most western governments into destroying all their surplus ammo stocks instead of selling it to civilians, so I wouldn't be surprised if they simply aren't allowed to sell new stuff to civilians.


Mark
 
sunray said:
SNC has nothing to do with it. Your MP doesn't either. The CF hasn't released anything for sale to civilians for eons. Mid-60's, I think. Aside from that, SNC no longer owns IVI. "Sold" to General Dynamics, with the full approval of the Chretein Gang, in 2006.
The Socialist F**ks are politicians. They'd rather destroy surplus(of which there is none) CF kit than sell it.
Click to expand...

That's the worst part, there are literally millions of rounds of 5.56 sitting in cans in depots just rotting away as stock awaiting disposal. The government could swing back gads of money if they just pulled their heads out of their as*es and sold it to dealers as "surplus with purchaser and consumer assuming all risks and liability".

They just won't and I'm assuming it's a UN based reason.........

Trust me there is tons of perfectly good ammunition sitting loose in cans all across this country in depots. 5.56mm C77, 7.62 linked, 9mm ball etc etc etc Most of it is still perfectly fine for use. They want to dispose of it, but they don't know how since we no longer incinerate it because of environmental horse sh*t the CF signed on for years ago and we can't dispose of it by detonation like all the other unserviceable ammo etc because of regulations.

So it just keeps piling up and getting back loaded to depots. They simply don't have the manpower or money to have it sorted and put back in service as "training use only".

It's enough to make you cry Sir.
 
Phone them up and place a decent order. 50K might be a good start, or it might be peanuts.

I know a number of civilian companies that use IVI as training ammo but their consumption is in the millions per year, every year.
 
Gunnerlove said:
Phone them up and place a decent order. 50K might be a good start, or it might be peanuts.

I know a number of civilian companies that use IVI as training ammo but their consumption is in the millions per year, every year.
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I'm in , how about a group buy? The ammo scene stinks in Canada.
 
Gunnerlove said:
Phone them up and place a decent order. 50K might be a good start, or it might be peanuts.

I know a number of civilian companies that use IVI as training ammo but their consumption is in the millions per year, every year.
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50K rounds is less than one pallet. I was checking out GD-OTS' website, and found a technical data sheet for the small calibre ammunition they produce. One pallet using standard carton packaging consists of 65,520 rounds.

I wish we could buy this stuff. High quality, made in Canada, what's not to like?

Has anyone ever contacted them directly for a straight answer on why they won't/can't sell to civilians?
 
sunray said:
SNC has nothing to do with it. Your MP doesn't either. The CF hasn't released anything for sale to civilians for eons. Mid-60's, I think. Aside from that, SNC no longer owns IVI. "Sold" to General Dynamics, with the full approval of the Chretein Gang, in 2006.
The Socialist F**ks are politicians. They'd rather destroy surplus(of which there is none) CF kit than sell it.
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x2. Agreed 100%.
 
97% of the people on CGN would rather buy Chinese crap ammo and rifles than buy north american & european made quality goods, and brag about it with pictures (lookie at all the norinco ammo I bought!). Therein lies the problem.

And then people like me who don't buy Chinese crap are called fanboys and elitists by everyone here.
 
mikethebike said:
97% of the people on CGN would rather buy Chinese crap ammo and rifles than buy north american & european made quality goods, and brag about it with pictures (lookie at all the norinco ammo I bought!). Therein lies the problem.

And then people like me who don't buy Chinese crap are called fanboys and elitists by everyone here.
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who cares how other people spend their money? and calling them a "problem" really doesn't help your case much.:p
 
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mikethebike said:
97% of the people on CGN would rather buy Chinese crap ammo and rifles than buy north american & european made quality goods, and brag about it with pictures (lookie at all the norinco ammo I bought!). Therein lies the problem.

And then people like me who don't buy Chinese crap are called fanboys and elitists by everyone here.
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Could have not said it better myself.
 
mikethebike said:
97% of the people on CGN would rather buy Chinese crap ammo and rifles than buy north american & european made quality goods, and brag about it with pictures (lookie at all the norinco ammo I bought!). Therein lies the problem.

And then people like me who don't buy Chinese crap are called fanboys and elitists by everyone here.
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well all my guns are tier one.....I love to shoot....and 5000rds( 223/9mm/12ga/22lr combined ) a month aint cheap so I run the cheapest ammo I can find for close up range drills and speed shooting, Hornady Steel match for comps
 
mikethebike said:
97% of the people on CGN would rather buy Chinese crap ammo and rifles than buy north american & european made quality goods, and brag about it with pictures (lookie at all the norinco ammo I bought!). Therein lies the problem.

And then people like me who don't buy Chinese crap are called fanboys and elitists by everyone here.
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im in the other 3%
 
So I got a reply from them, the relevant bit being:

Many years ago, before General Dynamics acquired SNC Tec (now General Dynamics-OTS Canada), the company had a small arms division (called IVI at the time) that did sell commercial ammunition to the civilian market. However in the early ‘90’s, General Dynamics decided to concentrate solely on military and police markets. Our operations are no longer setup to support commercial retail sales and there are no plans to do so in the foreseeable future.
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I don't recall them ever selling ammo to the civilian market, but anyway the reason they don't do it now is because they're just not interested in it. Probably too small of a market and GD does tend to avoid civilian sales.

Bugger. I suppose we could nag them.
 
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