C8A1 and C8A2 in CAF Inventory?

[Yeandle31]

Hey all,

I was doing some research on the Canadian Department of National Defence (DND) small arms Mid-Life Upgrade Program (MLUP) during the War in Afghanistan. Up until now my research on the evolution of the Diemaco C8 Carbine has been as follows:

1. C8 Carbine: 14.5" Pencil barrel. Introduced in 1985;
2. C8 Flat-Top (FT): 14.5" Pencil barrel with weaver upper, like the C7A1. A total of 150 made. Introduced in 2003;
3. C8 Flat-Top Heavy Barrel (FTHB): C8 FT with a heavy 15.7" barrel with Simon Sleeve. Introduced in 2005;
4. C8 Flat-Top Heavy Barrel A3 (FTHBA3): C8 FTHB after the MLUP (ambi controls, green furniture, TRIAD, etc). A total of 400 made. Introduced in 2006;
5. C8A3: C8FTHBA3 simply renamed. Introduced in 2007.

However, in doing my research I have come across the following document regarding the disposal of C8 Carbines in 2015. Within the document they state that the CAF had C8A1 and C8A2. However, all my other research and experiences support the above C8 evolution.

Can anyone help me make sense of this? Did the CAF actually have C8A1s and C8A2s or were those simply synonyms for the other stated names (ie. C8A1 are C8FT and C8A2 are C8FTHB). Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Kevin

 

[enefgee]

I know they surplussed a bunch of C8 uppers about 5 years ago, they were on sale as parts kits and uppers from some vendors.

 

[Boltgun]

I know they surplussed a bunch of C8 uppers about 5 years ago, they were on sale as parts kits and uppers from some vendors.

they surplused them to law enforcement agencies, those agencies traded toward new uppers and other items. The only thing not traded was the controlled part (at the time) - lower receivers. that's why dealers had "surplused" parts.

 

[enefgee]

they surplused them to law enforcement agencies, those agencies traded toward new uppers and other items. The only thing not traded was the controlled part (at the time) - lower receivers. that's why dealers had "surplused" parts.

Good for the LE's - Canadian government surplus is rarely in mint condition.

 

[OkayShooter]

they surplused them to law enforcement agencies, those agencies traded toward new uppers and other items. The only thing not traded was the controlled part (at the time) - lower receivers. that's why dealers had "surplused" parts.

I know some that got the whole gun, that had to get them converted back to semi.

 

[Boltgun]

I know some that got the whole gun, that had to get them converted back to semi.

then they were doing it on behalf of the agency which is permitted. Police Agencies are not allowed to trade in lowers/full firearms legally, except under very unique circumstances - ie if the gun was defective or if the agency doesn't legally own the firearm.

 

[armybuck041]

Hey all,

I was doing some research on the Canadian Department of National Defence (DND) small arms Mid-Life Upgrade Program (MLUP) during the War in Afghanistan. Up until now my research on the evolution of the Diemaco C8 Carbine has been as follows:

1. C8 Carbine: 14.5" Pencil barrel. Introduced in 1985;
2. C8 Flat-Top (FT): 14.5" Pencil barrel with weaver upper, like the C7A1. A total of 150 made. Introduced in 2003;
3. C8 Flat-Top Heavy Barrel (FTHB): C8 FT with a heavy 15.7" barrel with Simon Sleeve. Introduced in 2005;
4. C8 Flat-Top Heavy Barrel A3 (FTHBA3): C8 FTHB after the MLUP (ambi controls, green furniture, TRIAD, etc). A total of 400 made. Introduced in 2006;
5. C8A3: C8FTHBA3 simply renamed. Introduced in 2007.

However, in doing my research I have come across the following document regarding the disposal of C8 Carbines in 2015. Within the document they state that the CAF had C8A1 and C8A2. However, all my other research and experiences support the above C8 evolution.

Can anyone help me make sense of this? Did the CAF actually have C8A1s and C8A2s or were those simply synonyms for the other stated names (ie. C8A1 are C8FT and C8A2 are C8FTHB). Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Kevin

I’m really surprised that there were only 150 of the flat top pencil barrel version of the C8. We carried that version with an EO Tech in Afghanistan in 2005. When I went back in 2006, we had a mix of those and the heavy barrel C8.

 

[Leg]

I can’t say definitively but I’d assume they’re referring to the flattop C8 with 14.5” pencil and the C8 FTHB. It’s certainly not nomenclature that I’ve seen used anywhere.

I’ve never seen a C8 FTHBA3. We received the C8 FTHB with black furniture, non-ambi controls and EoTech 552 and they were replaced with the C8A3 with CAG furniture, ambi-controls and C79 scopes a couple of years later.

 

[Bile]

Whoops, wrong thread. deleted

 

[Leg]

Actually, now that I think about it, I believe the C8A3 also came with EoTech 552s. Some chose to run C79s on them but scale of issue was the 552 until the US pulled their EoTechs from service for not meeting specs in extreme heat/cold. Canada quickly followed suit.

 

[Leg]

I’m really surprised that there were only 150 of the flat top pencil barrel version of the C8. We carried that version with an EO Tech in Afghanistan in 2005. When I went back in 2006, we had a mix of those and the heavy barrel C8.

Well they were made specifically for and issued to the BG in Afghanistan and not issued to units in Canada. They showed up part way through Roto 0 of Op Athena in 2003.

I’d prefer one of those over the C8A3.

 

[DVX]

They'll sell them to law enforcement, where an assault rifle designed for the battlefield, to kill as many people in the shortest amount of time possible, will transform into a patrol carbine.

 

[Boltgun]

They'll sell them to law enforcement, where an assault rifle designed for the battlefield, to kill as many people in the shortest amount of time possible, will transform into a patrol carbine.

funny how a giggle switch turns it from an assault rifle to a patrol carbine

 

[Undergiver]

I remember back in 2003 or 2004 inspecting C8FTHB uppers that were going to Afghanistan. Just upper receivers.