Calling all BSA experts...

techedtyler

techedtyler

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Hey does anybody have experience with BSA rifles? Today a friend gave me a BSA bolt action rifle chambered in 30-06 for doing some handy work. The mark BSA is faintly stamped on top of the receiver and the side is stamped NO. 41. Other than that all I see is an assortment of symbols stamped on the side of the rifle similar to a sporterized military rifle. I would like to learn the history and value of this rifle to help me determine if I should sell or keep this rifle as part of my arsenal : ) Any BSA experts out there?





 
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Its a P17 or M17 (proper name for it). Is yours marked eddystone,remington, winchester? They were made in world war 1 . They were originally called the P14 (pattern 14) and chambered in .303 brit but after the americans entered the war, they were made in 30.06 and issued to the americans.They are silky smooth actions(in my opinion), it is my favorite milsurp bolt gun.
Yours has been "bubbad", the rear sight "ears" have been ground off, a common alteration when sporterizing them.It is probably worth 100-150 dollars in that condition judging by the pics.
 
The rifle has no other brand stamps except BSA and also Made in England so it likely wasn't manufactured by an american company like those that were sugested.... The mystery deepens : )
 
I agree its a an m17 for sure, but how did an american calibre rifle end up in the hands of Birmingham Small arms? Was it left in England after the war and shipped to Canada? This is really cool stuff... very curious to know these things.
 
Take a look
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Obviously yours was based on the M17....
 
how did an american calibre rifle end up in the hands of Birmingham Small arms?
Click to expand...
Tens of thousands were sent as lend-lease rifles early in world war 2. If you ever see a picture of the british home guard units with a rifle with the red stripe painted on it, that was to distinguish it as a m17 chambered in 30.06 instead of P14 in .303. And the P14s were also all made in america specifically to be shipped to the british. After the war, thousands of these guns were sporterized by BSA, Parker-Hale, etc.
 
All very good info, thanks for that Punkrockboy and 1899. Do any of you know a good place to do research on the serial numbers for an M17? I just checked the bolt and it matches the reciever; I'm happy about that!
 
These rifles were sporterised professionally in England by BSA (Birmingham Small Arms) in the period from the end of the 1940s through to the early 1970s, wth the bulks of them bing done in the middle 1950s and early 1960s.

They were available in several grades, all the way from 'just barely' cut-downs to very very nice semi-custom and even custom-quality grades. Yes, they were 'just old army rifles', but they were rebuilt professionally in one of the best plants in the world. When the work on them was finished, they were tested and approved under British law as new rifles. Many of them were even given new serial numbers in the BSA range.

ORIGINAL serial numbers for the 1917 rifle had only the number, anywhere from 1 to 7 digits with only Eddystone rifles running to all 7. Winchester and Remington each made about half a million, Eddystone (which was another Remington plant) made almost 1.3 million.

Whatever you do, friend, don't let ANYONE tell you that this is just another Bubba job. The work was done properly and what you were given is a damned fine rifle. I have one a couple of grades higher than yours (mostly cosmetic) which still has the original 1917 barrel on it. It shoots half an inch with its original 1959 Weaver K-4 scope in place.

A very good friend, recently deceased, spent 5 years playing with these old things. He ran through half a dozen of the BSAs and a Whitworth of Leeds, and there was not a single one that he did not get to shoot regular 3/4-inch groups (2 rounds from a dead-cold barrel: hunter's zero) and a couple shot well under that every time we took them out. Any rifle that ALWAYS shoots dead to point-of-aim with a dead cold barrel is a KEEPER for sure!

With the BSA-numbered bolt, as you have, headspace will be perfect. Don't waste your money on that. Get a set of bases, some rings and a decent scope onto the old girl and she just might amaze you. If she doesn't, then glass-bed her and she WILL amaze you.

You have a very FINE toy.

If you want to know a lot more about these fine rifles, come on over to the Milsurp forum and check some of the many threads about them. As for myself, I know one thing: I have 3 of these in .303 and one in .30-'06 and NONE of them are for sale!

BTW,the best ammo for these is the cheap stuff or handloads with FLATBASE bullets. These have Enfield 5-groove LH rifling (lasts half of forever) and it really prefers flatbase bullets.
 
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Bsa 30-06

As mentioned by now, you have a M-17 action 30-06 Enfield that was factory converted by Birmingham Small Arms in England. The marks on the barrel are proof marks, as British guns had to pass a proof testing to ensure safety and quality.

Being a factory conversion, and not a basement bubba conversion, it is definitely a better quality rifle. Remington produced the same action as the Model 30 Sporting rifle, and also the higher quality Model (I think the 720 or 725....) that was introduced a couple of years before the 700 action. It is one of the better rifles for hunting, with the side safety, abeit a bit heavy. You will probably have to get it drilled and tapped if you want to mount a scope on it, as these conversions were done before scoped rifles became the normal rifle.

BSA also used the action for their Model 1923 Sporting Rifle, and made up Target rifles from these actions.

I would keep it if the barrel is good. Nice wood too.
 
The only way to serialize it is to find the Birmingham's proofhouse "private viewer's mark", usually on the underside of the barrel, beside the "tons proofing" mark, but there is a gap between 1941 and 1950.
You have to look for two "crossed swords" around wich you will find a letter (pre-41 have the letter at 12 o'clock and post-49 have two letters, at 3 and 9 o'clock).
Post what you find here, but a picture worth 1 billion writings to identify stampings.
 
The P-14 and P-17 make excellent actions to chamber to some very large calibers as the action is large and robust, so even if you don't care for that rifle in 30/06, I'd keep it for a future project.
 
I’m planning on keeping this rifle based on all the neat historical info that so many of you have been kind enough to share with me. I’m really happy that the rifle is chambered in a 30-06 just because of availability and the versatility of the cartridge. I’m fortunate enough to have the receiver already drilled and tapped for mounts. Now the hard part.... where on earth can I find mounts for an M17 Sporter?
 
Any gunsmith worth his salt should have a box of Weaver mounts that can be matched up to fit your receiver.

Regarding the model's timeline, first came the Pattern 13, in a very 280 ish cartridge, then the P14, in 303 (because they needed the rifle right now dammit, and in a caliber they had a lot of), then the Yanks needed the production so the M17 came along in 30-06. After the war Rem had a lot of parts left over, so they graced us with the Model 30 in various guises and calibers, followed by the last of the line, the 720. The 725 was actually a gussied up 721/722 (still a nice rifle though, dropped when the 700 made it's debut in the early 60's). Hope that helps a little. After the second war, a lot of British houses made a living converting surplus bolt guns (and a few semi autos) into sporting rifles, BSA being one of them. They are a well built rifle, generally (you can do some research on the hardening issues of various manufacturing plants), and with a little care will be supplying venison for your great grandson's table (assuming the libs haven't banned that by then). - dan
 
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