Can someone explain 40 S&W to me?

Avenida said:
the .40 was the result of the FBI needing a stronger caliber due to a shootout happening in Miami:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout
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That would be the 10mm auto. The .40 was the result of the average agent not being able to become proficient with the 10mm at its original specs. They are switching back to 9mm due to advancements in bullet design that make the 9mm a much better performer than it used to be. When you add in the cost savings it really does make sense.
 
According to Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.40_S&W

B said:
That would be the 10mm auto. The .40 was the result of the average agent not being able to become proficient with the 10mm at its original specs. They are switching back to 9mm due to advancements in bullet design that make the 9mm a much better performer than it used to be. When you add in the cost savings it really does make sense.
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One thing not stated yet, is that the .40, with its truncated cone bullet profile, was one of the first pistol cartridges designed from the outset to feature JHP projectiles, which was seen as an advantage over the 9mm and .45 back when JHP technology was still fairly primitive and needed all the help it could get.

This perception of better JHP performance was helped by the fact that by the time the caliber was introduced, JHP design was starting to improve more quickly than it had been thanks to the influence of the FBI in the wake of the Miami shootout.
 
thebaron said:
Also according to Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10mm_Auto

10mm came first, when no one could shoot it, they downsized.
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That is the short version but yes. I actually shoot it quickly and quite accurately but at the expense of many thousands of rounds of practice.10mm is overpowered for ccw by a lot, and LEO applications for the most part. Simply my opinion though. I'd say it is ideal for military where gross over penetration is usually not an issue.
 
As I saw it, the .45 ACP was just too large and the 9 mm was seen as inadequate for police work because the old hard nose bullets over penetrated (and thereby also put the whole neighbourhood in danger), so the .40 S&W was developed. But now improvements in antipersonnel 9 mil bullets have changed the picture and the round has become the law enforcement and military standard.
 
Big Bad said:
As I saw it, the .45 ACP was just too large and the 9 mm was seen as inadequate for police work because the old hard nose bullets over penetrated (and thereby also put the whole neighbourhood in danger), so the .40 S&W was developed. But now improvements in antipersonnel 9 mil bullets have changed the picture and the round has become the law enforcement and military standard.
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In this regard, I could be wrong, but it is the police standard, though I'd gladly carry .40 instead simply for the heavier bullet. If you are engaging Kevlar, my choice would be to throw a heavier round. I've shot Kevlar with both and there is a very noticeable increase in damage done with .40/180 grain over 9mm/147 grain. In that regard .45 didn't even seem to do the damage .40 did.

Military wise are they not shooting ball still? Lessons of the past say that when they get back to warring that 9mm will be considered and wider is better, and US G.I.'s will want dad to send them a .45 again. A buddy who did some fighting in southern Africa noted that when fighting hopped up "rebels" that the 9mm in ball wasn't doing it, so they got their sponsoring South African state to send .45.

Of course in the end, 9 is fine, but 10 is for men.
 
CreamySmooth said:
In this regard, I could be wrong, but it is the police standard, though I'd gladly carry .40 instead simply for the heavier bullet. If you are engaging Kevlar, my choice would be to throw a heavier round. I've shot Kevlar with both and there is a very noticeable increase in damage done with .40/180 grain over 9mm/147 grain. In that regard .45 didn't even seem to do the damage .40 did.

Military wise are they not shooting ball still? Lessons of the past say that when they get back to warring that 9mm will be considered and wider is better, and US G.I.'s will want dad to send them a .45 again. A buddy who did some fighting in southern Africa noted that when fighting hopped up "rebels" that the 9mm in ball wasn't doing it, so they got their sponsoring South African state to send .45.

Of course in the end, 9 is fine, but 10 is for men.
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I suppose they probably are, but at one point I fell in with a bad crowd of SOF types, I mean socially, and I believe they were using the expanding stuff. One thing about 9 mm is that you can load 18 rounds or so in one magazine, not an issue for us civilians in Canada of course.
 
Big Bad said:
I suppose they probably are, but at one point I fell in with a bad crowd of SOF types, I mean socially, and I believe they were using the expanding stuff. One thing about 9 mm is that you can load 18 rounds or so in one magazine, not an issue for us civilians in Canada of course.
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SOF is not the big army - whole different set of rules...
 
This is an interesting topic for me. I just picked up an M&P40. The reason I went with .40 cal in this case was because I'm turning 40 lol! I figured it was appropriate. Too bad I have to wait ten years till 50...
 
I've never been a fan of the 40s&w until lately. It's an awesome cartridge and I'm liking it more than 9mm. The truth is you need to handload to see the full potential of various cartridges. I can load the 40sw as light or lighter than a 9mm or as hot as I safely can. 40sw bullet weights can be a lot heavier than 9mm weights and can also be pushed at a higher velocity, also the diameter .401 is perfect compared to .355 The price to reload 9mm or 40sw is pretty much the same, depending on what load you use. Capacity is still very high and the dimensions of guns that fire the 40sw are usually the exact same as their 9mm counterparts.

The consensus of people who dont handload is that 40sw recoils too much and it costs more than 9mm, and they are right. The 40sw is a more powerful cartridge than a 9mm so of course it's only logical that it will recoil more, and the cost for ammunition is considerably higher than 9mm, also logical as the components weigh more and require more material to produce. A 9mm will do almost anything the 40sw will, but if you reload, the 40sw is more capable.

It's hard to find any negatives about the 40sw really. It's a great, almost perfect handgun caliber.
 
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I have heard it said that 40 SW is the equivalent of Homer's everyman's car... everything you think you want but nothing that you need.
homers-custom-car.jpg
 
Galt said:
I have heard it said that 40 SW is the equivalent of Homer's everyman's car... everything you think you want but nothing that you need.
homers-custom-car.jpg
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My trend continues then....I have a house full of things I thought I wanted but never needed...:)
 
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9mm is cheaper and the +p 9mm hollow point is a good defensive round. All about the money.
I think the +p 9mm rounds have made the 40sw absolute.
 
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