Can you recommend a 12Ga. slug mould and/or reloading data for smooth bore barrels?

T

theshootist

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I have had good luck and am satisfied with the accuracy obtained with the Lyman 525 Sabot slug (hour glass/air pellet shape) in my fully rifled barrel with cantillever. (This load is from Lyman's #5 shotshell reloading book.)

However, when I use this load / slug combo in my smooth bore barrel, I get keyholes in under 10 yards. (understandable)

I was wondering if anyone here on CGN might offer some suggestions on what has worked for them in smooth bore bbls? I am trying to decide between 3 different slug options:

A). The Lyman 475 gr. Foster/Forester Slug

B). The Lee 1 oz. Drive Key Slug

or C). Round Ball

I like the round ball as I've read its easy to cast, and simple. However I can't find any reloading data available from published sources. I've spent a fair number of hours researching online about all three of these options. I like the Lyman as I have published Lyman reloading data for it, but I have found only less than stellar reviews of their accuracy, and the mould is a bit pricy. I like the Lee slug as the mold is cheaper and the published data is rather simple, again however their performance has been posted on other forums as not too great either. Both foster type slugs report to have issues with their respective wads being cut/pushed into their bases, degrading accuracy.

I use the sabot slugs/rifled long bbl combo for hunting. The smoothbore bbl is for my "tactical" shotgun. (Sorry I can't think of a better word than tactical.) Shooting smooth bore slugs will be for more fast pace/plinking/ruining large appliances type shooting.

My primary goal is slug accuracy and reloading simplicity in smooth bore 12ga shotguns.

Thanks for reading, I appreciate all of your constructive observations and advice.
 
I've been playing with the 1 oz lee slug recently. Haven't done a whole lot of reloading with it yet and find I can get about 5" group at 50 yds fairly consistently.
Should be able to improve on that with further experimentation I'm hoping. I only plan on using these at 15 and 25 yds, so I think they will be good to go at those ranges.
Easy to cast, easy to reload for, accurate enough, and more importantly...........cheap!!! lol
 
I've never used any of the Lyman slug moulds before but I have heard excellent results from smooth bores and the 525gr hour glass ones.
Have you tried different loads?
What is your current load?

If you head over to the cast boolit forums, casting for shotguns section you can probably get a lot of help. For me simply adding a 20ga .125" nitro card under a Lee slug improved my accuracy as it stopped the wad from flowing into the base. I had to use a different wad to get the height right for the crimp though. To get round balls to shoot accurately most people put a 28 or 20ga nitro card under it and fill the area under it with buffer (same as you would use for buckshot.) Some people have also gotten good results with filling the hollow in the bottom of a slug with buffer.

The Lyman 525 sabot slugs usually shoot about 1" per 10 yards in terms of accuracy. That is about what I can do with Lee slugs. Round balls are often a little larger with proper loads; closer to maybe 1.25" to 1.5" per 10 yards.
 
Lee 1oz mold, Win AA hulls, 32 to 34 gn of HS-6, FED red or Win pink wad.

I have only had good success with Win AA hulls.

GC
 
No I haven't tried any different loads for the Lyman 525gr Sabot slugs. I was happy with the first results in the rifled bbl so I bought a couple extra bags of wads and left it at that. The Lyman #5 manual mentions that the Sabot slugs get their best accuracy with rifled bbls so I honestly never really considered trying that slug with different load combos to search for success in a smooth bore. I really don't have a lot of experience reloading slugs to begin with. I'm not sure how to make a judgement call on whether one published sabot load would be more likely to give better results over another published load.

That same reloading manual mentions that the foster type slugs are meant more for smooth bore so I have really only been looking at my options for a foster or RB mould - hence my starting this thread. CGN is great for discussing such topics with those whom have much more experience than myself!

The current load I'm using now is the Lyman 525gr Sabot slug/Federal Gold Match hull/39gr of SR4756/Win209/WAA12R wad/ and a fold crimp. Published fps is 1500. I love the power those slugs can hit with.

If I go with the Lee Mould, has anyone seen published data for roll crimping that particular slug? Sorry to digress...

I have spend a couple or three hours or so on Castboolits, there has been some good info, but still hoping to hit a real valuable thread. I do like Castboolits. Wish I could come across a reloading manual specific to loading shotgun slugs. I am a little hesitant to experiment with different components as I would with metallic rifle/pistol cartridges as the books specifically say not to. Makes me want to buy a Mossberg 590A1 - those bbls have a pretty heavy wall to them

Anyhow, thanks again for your help!
 
From some quick searches on the cast boolit forums it seems most people have the best accuracy with Alliant Bluedot powder. Maybe give some loads that use that a go. People are reporting usually 5" groups at 50yds out of 18" smoothbores. Bluedot is my go-to powder for slugs and buckshot as you can get velocities up pretty high while remaining in pressure limits compared to most other powders.

To figure out which slug load may be better or worse than another I don't rely on personal experience as much as lessons from others. I just do a lot of google searching and checking different forums and look for what other people are getting good accuracy out of. I then look for common patterns among those loads such as a common powder or wad. I'd say 60-70% of the reports I've read about optimum slug accuracy use Bluedot powder. I guess something about it's specific burn rate just works well with 12ga slugs.

Tumbling slugs out of a smoothbore would most likely be caused by improper slug-wad separation when leaving the barrel. The pressure could be spiking for whatever reason and damaging the wads during acceleration. The wads could be flowing into the base of the slug and not detaching properly (perhaps the spin from a rifled barrel overcomes this but a smoothbore suffers from it fully?) One thing some recommend is to put a little Crisco, lithium grease, or liquid alox lube on the base of the slug and/or inside the wad shot cup. It doesn't add any appreciable weight but can ease the separation. Filling the base of the slug with buffer (I use cream of wheat from Bulk Barn) could also help and wouldn't change the pressure any more than normal shot to shot variance (the effect buffer has with buckshot is far more complex and can effect pressure a lot more).

I'm into testing as many variables as possible to eliminate or judge the impact each has on it's own. I would take the load you currently use and make 5 shot groups of the following to test:
some lube on the base of the slug inside the shotcup
buffer inside the base of the slug
buffer and lube

Then pick a Bluedot recipe to test on it's own, then:
Bluedot with lube
Bluedot with buffer
Bluedot with lube and buffer

If after all of that the slugs are still tumbling I would consider testing slugs from other moulds. I would put an add on the EE asking for slugs cast from other moulds before buying one.
 
What choke do you have in with those slugs? I use ic and works well to strip the wad from the slug and seperate just out of the barrel, also i found not to shove them all the way down the wad cup, just enough to close it up
 
I've had very acceptable accuracy from the Lyman 525 in a smooth bore.

AA hull
Bluedot - the load is in the Lyman manual. I seem to recall 44 grains but CHECK first, I'm going on memory.
Win primer
WAA12R wad
Fold crimp.

I've experimented with filling the hollow base of the slug with hot glue. It seemed to reduce flyers. I presume it prevents the wad from flowing into the base and sticking to the slug for a time.

I seem to recall the opposite of what you state. I remember the Lyman manual saying the 525 slug in a shot cup was not recommended in a rifled barrel.

Gotta go check now...
 
Nope, I was wrong. Lyman #5 says the sabot slug is designed to make use of the rifling in a rifled barrel.

That being said, as mentioned above, I've had good results in a smoothbore.

....and it was with 44.0gn Blue Dot in the 2 3/4 inch AA hull.

The accuracy made me happy enough that I didn't feel any need to try a different slug type.

Good luck.
 
I load with the Lyman 525 "wasp waist" slug for my rifled 12. I did fire some from 25 yards with my 14" smoothbore and they hit the 12 inch target. I won't say I was MOA, more MOF, but it would do the job in an emergency situation. With a longer barrel you may get better results.
 
I've used a lee slug mold with 17.5gr of 700x , AA hull and a normal 1 1/8oz wad for cheap plinking slugs. Not too sure of exact accuracy as I wasn't shooting at a target or anything, but under 50 yards where i was shooting I couldn't miss, shooting at pop cans, water bottles, and similar stuff. This is with a 18.5" smoothbore, cylinder choke Mossberg 500. I loaded up some with the same components but with 38gr of blue dot, and they shot well at the same range, and were surprisingly tame.

For what it's worth, my dad shot some of the lighter 700x loads at 300 yards with a Stevens tactical pump, and was hitting a 12" steel plate consistently.
 
TwoTone said:
I've experimented with filling the hollow base of the slug with hot glue. It seemed to reduce flyers. I presume it prevents the wad from flowing into the base and sticking to the slug for a time.
Click to expand...
Hmmm, never thought of that. Going to have to give it a try sometime. I need to order the 20ga nitro cards that I use under the slugs from the US and prefer to have supplies more local. Hot glue, if it works as well, would be a much preferable solution.
 
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