Canadian IVI C77 5.56mm ball ammo - Can you buy this in Canada?

1feral1

1feral1

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Greetings from the US.

I was wondering if IVI C77 can be bulk purchased in Canada.

Canadian IVI 16 C77 ball is being sold here in huge quantities for around 32 cents/bang. Coming in in IVI .50 ammo tins with Fiocchi labels on the tins, calling it M855 C77 'made in Canada'. Lead seal on the tins is 'IVI' marked.

I just bought a .50 ammo tin with 920 rds, packed in the standard IVI boxes of 30rds clipped. each tin comes with a charger. The dealer had a pallet of this ammo.

It's the cheapest North American manufactured SS109 stuff that I have seen in a while.

The last lot of C77 I bought here was IVI 95, and I paid 40 cents/bang for that.

I normally buy US M193 for about 30 cents/bang, so I could not pass this C77 stuff up.
 
Hey Wes,

No C77 for civvie sales in Canada, not even "appropriated" stuff like we used to occasionally see at the gun shows of yore. Strictly verboten for some reason. Reminds me of when all that rejected IVI SS109 hit the US market 20 years ago only to discover that the bullets were sheďding jacket material in barrels. Not cool of IVI to have sold off that CAF-rejected ammo to unsuspecting distributors and civvie consumers. As I recall there were several barrel Kabooms attributed to that ammo at the time, so be careful with our milspec rejects! I'd be checking the brass for signs of over-pressure loads and inspecting my barrels for jacket debris. Just saying.... there's no such thing as a free lunch!

Cheers,

Mark
 
Thanks for the info Mark. This 2016 lot has the standard plain brown cardboard boxes, but the NATO 'plus' sign is absent, and it printed as:

30 CARTRIDGES
5.56 M855 WITH
STEEL PENETRATOR (C77)
10 RD CLIPS
IVI16L02-04

The base of the case has the + on them as per normal.

1995 ammo is boxed as fol:

0086 (NATO PLUS SIGN)
30 CARTRIDGES
5.56MM BALL C77
10RD CLIPS IVI95D37-30

I bought about 900rds a few yrs back, so far no issues.
 
Without the NATO plus sign suggests this was run-of-the-mill ammo made to be sold, not QC failure rejects. Sneaky how a Canadian taxpayer supported plant, a strategic asset with favoured contract access, gets to wear out its machinery selling goods Canadians cannot buy.

https://www gd-otscanada.com/product/5-56mm-x-45-ammunition/
 
The NATO + is on the base of the cartridge case, just not on the box.

Perhaps the different nomenclature on the 30rd cardboard boxes with the M855 designation is the new standard from 2016 and beyond?
 
1feral1 said:
The NATO + is on the base of the cartridge case, just not on the box.

Perhaps the different nomenclature on the 30rd cardboard boxes with the M855 designation is the new standard from 2016 and beyond?
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IVI NATO ammo is the same nomenclature as the box you have from 95. M855 is US nomenclature, not Canadian.
I guess IVI is selling some lot of their ammo to US civilians under Fiocchi brand name. That would explain why I saw triwalls full of brass with Fiocchi labels on them at the factory.
Assuming the Fiocchi lot goes under the same QC, It's good ammo. The accuracy standard is 8 inches at 600 yard.
 
The military was dealing with at least one lot of IVI 5.56 that was loaded very hot.

I am wondering if it got pulled and sold, or if IVI had another lot that was hot that the military rejected.
 
Ganderite said:
The military was dealing with at least one lot of IVI 5.56 that was loaded very hot.

I am wondering if it got pulled and sold, or if IVI had another lot that was hot that the military rejected.
Click to expand...

Must be another lot. The lots that were loaded hot are sitting in the depots. There is a plan to deal with it, but it won't be sold.
 
Dake21 said:
IVI NATO ammo is the same nomenclature as the box you have from 95. M855 is US nomenclature, not Canadian.
I guess IVI is selling some lot of their ammo to US civilians under Fiocchi brand name. That would explain why I saw triwalls full of brass with Fiocchi labels on them at the factory.
Assuming the Fiocchi lot goes under the same QC, It's good ammo. The accuracy standard is 8 inches at 600 yard.
Click to expand...

Hmm....does that mean we could get c77 ammo via Focchi via USA? I'll have to find the Canadian fiochi distributor and ask
 
FWIW, Fiocchi 175gr SMK HPBTM .308 ammo gives me outstanding results from my Cadex Guardian Lite. I was amazed that it performed just as well as the usual factory standard, Federal GMM. YMMV
 
I noticed our local RCMP was using 77gr HPBT IVI ammo (I dug in the garbage can after they left the range). It is apparently Nosler Custom Competition bullets. Can anyone confirm this? What is the muzzle velocity? I'd like to duplicate this ammo as best I can with handloads, seeing as we can't buy it.
 
rifleman762 said:
I noticed our local RCMP was using 77gr HPBT IVI ammo (I dug in the garbage can after they left the range). It is apparently Nosler Custom Competition bullets. Can anyone confirm this? What is the muzzle velocity? I'd like to duplicate this ammo as best I can with handloads, seeing as we can't buy it.
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I wouldn't be surprised by this. When I visited GD OTS, they told us that they can load anything at their factory. The RCMP have a contract with Colt Canada for their C8 carbines so I wouldn't be surprised if they have GD OTS produce their ammo for them on another contract. I wouldn't know their velocities but given that they crimp their primers and use military brass they probably could get higher velocities safely then what you could load so I would just worry about accuracy.
 
Yes, they spec’ed the 77 grain Nosler OTM bullet after fairly extensive testing a number of years ago. It gave the best combination of penetration and fragmentation within the specified operational range, of the various bullets and loads tested. The velocity required is why the 15.7” barrel was chosen as well. In barrier penetration they often separate their jackets but have still proven effective. Policing requirements are quite different than military ones. These rounds have proven to be accurate at extended ranges when fired from a suitable rifle.
 
I had thought the 15.7" barrel was chosen as a consequence of the SAS contract, because it was found to be an accuracy node. They were very exacting about the accuracy they wanted, and what was allowed to be done to achieve it.
 
rifleman762 said:
I noticed our local RCMP was using 77gr HPBT IVI ammo (I dug in the garbage can after they left the range). It is apparently Nosler Custom Competition bullets. Can anyone confirm this? What is the muzzle velocity? I'd like to duplicate this ammo as best I can with handloads, seeing as we can't buy it.
Click to expand...

I found some of this at retail, haven't had a chance to shoot it yet tho.
 
rifleman762 said:
I noticed our local RCMP was using 77gr HPBT IVI ammo (I dug in the garbage can after they left the range). It is apparently Nosler Custom Competition bullets. Can anyone confirm this? What is the muzzle velocity? I'd like to duplicate this ammo as best I can with handloads, seeing as we can't buy it.
Click to expand...

I pulled and weighed powder charges/bullets and took measurements of IVI 556 left behind at my range. Will post the info when I'm home from vacation. Only thing I can confirm off the top of my head is that it is indeed a 77gr open tip Match bullet and powder appears to be very similar to blc- (2)

Fwiw, bullet is a 77 grain open tip Match type bullet
Average powder charge is around 23 grains which is what my Lyman manual lists as a suggested starting load for a 77 gr otm bullet using blc-(2).
Average overall length was 2.2506 if you care to that extent.
Source some IVI cases and you should be able to produce c77 clone ammo.
 
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