Carbine Bark

Ganderite

Ganderite

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Farm south of North Bay
I find that some of the full power carbines (Mauser and MN M44) are so loud they hurt the unprotected ear.

I am planning to build myself a little carbine on a LE #4 action, about Jungle carbine in size. I have the choice of just a crowned muzzle, installing a brake or installing a #5 flash hider. I find myself wondering if maybe that funnel shaped flash hider also has the effect of protecting the shooter from the bark of a short barrel?

Any comments?
 
Take it from me (the guy who's getting a hearing aid) don't shoot anything bigger than a pellet gun without ear-pro. Why am I getting a hearing aid you may ask? "Prolonged exposure to rifle fire" according to my audiologist. My hearing profile is a classic example of this type of exposure.
 
My first Shorty was a Model 38 Carcano Cavalry Carbine in 6,5mm. It was/is a nice little rifle but the tremendous CRACK! every time it fired soon put me off.

For many years, it languished behind doors, in closets, until it very nearly was forgotten.

THEN I started actually THINKING (for me, an unusual innovation).

I loaded up a batch of ammo with a very FAST powder (IMR-4198), reasoning that the ear-splitting CRACK! was mostly powder burning at high pressure, out in th open.

The Shorty immediately QUIETENED DOWN a great deal... and started shooting accurately, which was a very real change. With the very fast powder, it is actually comfortable to shoot with ordinary ear protection; previously, it would literally shake your teeth and you had partial deafness for several hours afterwards.

Worth a try, anyway.
 
John Sukey said:
Years ago I had a swede mouser carbine. After two rounds I had a problem hearing for over an hour!
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Morning John, old floon! Nice to meet up with some old friends here. You are now reading the post of a man fitted with two hearing aids last week, and boy, am I in trouble. Now that I can actually HEAR what mrs tac is saying to me, I'm finding that there is hardly any time to sit down, let alone go shooting.

As the poster a few posts up notes, the frequencies picked on by prolonged shooting are clearly evident in an audiogram - mine looks like a cross-section of Nebraska with the Grand Canyon two-thirds the way along the line. Frightening stuff, not helped by as few 'combat zone' landings in Hercs in the '90's.

And adreesing your comment about ears taking an hour or more to recover - Sir, the news is not good. That there is permanent damage, not transitory. Hearing loss is cumulative, like piling up grains of sand over the years until, all of a sudden, you realise that you are missing out on stuff that others are laffin' at. They prolly collect goldfish - nice and quiet - instead of having REAL fun like we do with our shooting.

Best

tac
 
Workers Comp in Alberta tried to blame rifle fire on my hearing loss till they got told different by the audio lady. She told them I was deafer in the wrong ear to be from gunshots so they then paid for my hearing aids. I have to wear hearing protection using the blitz gun now even or I get ringing in the ears.
 
Ganderite said:
I find that some of the full power carbines (Mauser and MN M44) are so loud they hurt the unprotected ear.

I am planning to build myself a little carbine on a LE #4 action, about Jungle carbine in size. I have the choice of just a crowned muzzle, installing a brake or installing a #5 flash hider. I find myself wondering if maybe that funnel shaped flash hider also has the effect of protecting the shooter from the bark of a short barrel?

Any comments?
Click to expand...
If you think a carbine has a loud report, you will really be deaf if you attach a muzzle brake! Also, I (stupidly)fired one round from my #5 jungle carbine without ear protection once, and I can assure you that flash hider does NOTHING to reduce sound!
 
Thanks guys. The last few posts are useful.

I am 70. have been shooting regularly since age 6. I know about hearing protection. I have only a little bit of hearing loss, mostly at the frequency of She Who Must Be Obeyed.

I have a Spanish Mauser carbine in 308. It is one of those painful guns mentioned above and that is what I am trying to avoid with my new build, even though it will be a short barrel.

I am wondering if a #5 flash hider would help. I also have a regular brake I could install, which would make the noise even worse - if that is possible.
 
I'm with Smellie in that tweaking your loads helps a lot. My truck gun is a Martini-Henry in 303 br with a 19" bbl. I didn't even shoot it with factory 303 br loads; you just know the muzzle blast is going to blow your cap off, why submit yourself to that?
My father is the reloading guru so I don't recall the recipe, but there are a few.
And I've got high end, WCB funded, hearing aids. They rock!
If I'm shooting old school calibers with reduced loads, the hearing aids will catch the sound and muffle it before it reaches my ears. 30-30, 303 br, 8X 57 etc.
Don't try this with fast, magnum loads! You will be hearing ringing sounds for a while if you try it.
I get a smile out of folks thinking hearing aids are for old folks. I've needed mine since I was 27; and probably before that as well.
Ever heard a ' Bank of 6-71 GM'ies' through blasted out mufflers? Off the scale noise wise. For the 1st 10 years of rig working that's pretty much the only engines that where out there.
Listen to the landing craft on ' Saving Private Ryan' That sound is two-stroke GM'ies.
But I digress.
Use the hearing protection, always... take from a moderately hearing impaired guy.
 
Ganderite said:
are so loud they hurt the unprotected ear... I have the choice of just a crowned muzzle, installing a brake or installing a #5 flash hider.
Click to expand...

I never shoot centrefire without ear protection, except when hunting. When shooting at game the report doesn't seem as loud, though damage is still being done. I wear plugs and muffs when rifle shooting, just plugs for rimfire and shotgun.

If you install a break, your noise problem is going to get worse, not better.
 
The nastiest gun I've fired is my little Italian carbine in 7.35. In my inestimable (is that even a word?) brilliance, the first time I fired it, I stood right beside my house. BOOM! No wonder the Italians gave up early! Next noisiest is my "go to" Hakim. At least on the Hakim the muzzle brake is only finger tight, so I can take it out.

After too many years of firing rifles, noisy tractors, driving noisy old trucks, etc., I notice now that my ears ring now and again. Well, such is life. I am really happy to be alive, having taunted death a time or two over the years. If ringing ears is the only problem I'll have, I'll be satisfied. :)
 
collector67 said:
If you think a carbine has a loud report, you will really be deaf if you attach a muzzle brake! Also, I (stupidly)fired one round from my #5 jungle carbine without ear protection once, and I can assure you that flash hider does NOTHING to reduce sound!
Click to expand...

This.
Keep yer ears on!
 
collector67 said:
If you think a carbine has a loud report, you will really be deaf if you attach a muzzle brake! Also, I (stupidly)fired one round from my #5 jungle carbine without ear protection once, and I can assure you that flash hider does NOTHING to reduce sound!
Click to expand...

Thanks. That is exactly what I wanted to know. I wish I had a Db meter. I could measure some guns right now.

I shot my son's carbine today (with muffs) and the recoil was not bad, so I think I will go with either with a #5 flash hider (also solves the front sight issue) or just a crown.
 
Keep your ears ON, your plugs IN and go for the quickest powder you can get accuracy with. You want the charge to burn IN the Barrel.

It really DOES make a difference.

With the Carcano Cavalry Carbine, it took the little gun all the way from "painful" to "fun".

Serious.

I have hearing damage of my own (range accident with a Firefly) which very nearly ruined me as a shooter. Developed a terrible flinch problem because my mind KNEW that every shot was going to HURT. Finally spent a bunch of money (75 cents) on a decent set of ear plugs..... and started shooting fairly well again. It was several years after that that I did some thinking.... and tamed the Ferocious Carcano Cavalry Carbine.
 
I heard your advice about a fast powder the first time. I have a drum of 4196 that I will try. (It is 4198 made with moly instead of graphite coating). It has worked well in 7.62x39 but have not found much other application for it.

Those of us who have fired a carbine that barked so load our ears immediately hurt understand why I raised the question.

Other than hunting, I always use ear protection. Mostly just a pair of muffs, but for rifle competition I also wear plugs under the muffs, to help filter out the chatter around me.
 
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