Changing type of primers

Z

Zaitsev

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Hey guys,

I've been reloading 9mm with the same load for a while now but it seems that I just can't find Winchester Small Pistol primers anywhere anymore. However, I found a place where I could get plenty of Federal primers for a good price. I was wondering if changing primers would make a big difference and if so, how will it make a diference?

My actual load in my CZ Shadow is:
-5.3 grains of Long Shot powder;
-124gr Cam-Pro round nose bullet;
-Winchester Small Pistol primers;
-OAL 1.130

Average speed is 1080 ft/seconds for a 133-135 power factor.

And for the IPSC guys(or those who know what power factor is), will that change my power factor in any way or will it still be the same?

Thanks for your help,
JP.
 
I don't think you would see a dramatic change, but the only way to know for sure would be to test the load out with a chronograph.
 
I would expect the velocity to drop a tiny amount. The big difference in the two primers is that Federal has a softer (maybe thinner) cup. It will show more pressure signs and has easier ignition. This is handy in a revolver shot double action with reduced spring tension.

When you load to a power factor, make sure you have some margin over the limit. Velocity will change from lot to lot, as well as brand to brand.

If there are Federals available at a good price, by a case or two. They store well.
 
Ganderite said:
I would expect the velocity to drop a tiny amount. The big difference in the two primers is that Federal has a softer (maybe thinner) cup. It will show more pressure signs and has easier ignition. This is handy in a revolver shot double action with reduced spring tension.

When you load to a power factor, make sure you have some margin over the limit. Velocity will change from lot to lot, as well as brand to brand.

If there are Federals available at a good price, by a case or two. They store well.
Click to expand...

I agree, and while the vast majority of the primers I use are CCI, one exception is I use Federal for some of the lighter loads in my Colt Python. I had the action 'diddled' for double action shooting and Federal primers, for that reason, set off more dependably in 'the Snake'.
 
"...will that change my power factor..." It might. Like CanAm says, if you change any one component, you should work up the load again.
 
Just to hijack the thread for a second....Zaitsev, what type of groups do you get with that load? Dont see many guys using Longshot for 9mm, however Im considering trying longshot with 147s
 
RT said:
Just to hijack the thread for a second....Zaitsev, what type of groups do you get with that load? Dont see many guys using Longshot for 9mm, however Im considering trying longshot with 147s
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know, I'm one of the rare people who use Long Shot for 9mm but it works very well in my CZ Shadow. Very nice feeling, soft recoil but quick to get back on target for the second shot(I use it for IPSC). Accuracy is pretty good, at least for what I use it for. I probably could get better accuracy with a different load but hey, Long Shot is easy to get, it is a 100% reliable in my gun, recoil feels great, it shoots flat and it's not to dirty so why would I change. For me personnaly, this is my load and I don't really see any reason to change it. If you are talking about groups size, I would say somewhere arround 3 1/2 to 4 inches group at 25 yards. And I'm being honnest here. I'm not one of those my Norinco can shoot 1 inch group at 50 yards weak hand only with cheap ammo that I bought 15 years ago, if you know what I mean. I hear so much s**t here about pistol group size so I don't listen to anyone anymore. I'm a Master class shooter in Production division in IPSC(I'm not saying that I'm the most accurate shooter but I know what you can and what you can't do with a production pistol) and I if I can get 3 to 4 inches groups at 25 yards without a rest, that's well enough for me. The difference is really behind the gun. You should give that load a try and see if it works for you. I did try a load with 147 gr Cam-Pro bullets. I used 4.2 gr of long shot with WSP primers and OAL of 1.130. It was more accurate(May be somewhere arround 3 to 3 1/2 inches at 25 yards) than my 124 gr bullets load but recoil didn't feel as good. Hope that helps.

Now back to the original thread please.
 
Zaitsev said:
My actual load in my CZ Shadow is:
-5.3 grains of Long Shot powder;
-124gr Cam-Pro round nose bullet;
-Winchester Small Pistol primers;
-OAL 1.130

Average speed is 1080 ft/seconds for a 133-135 power factor.
Click to expand...
Hard to say how much of a difference it will make as I haven't done enough primer comparisons.

Looking at the Hodgdon site you are far from the maximum load especially with your increased OAL. The max listed is 5.7 gr. of Longshot with a 125 gr. FMJ at 1.090". I'm assuming (don't hurt me!) that the Cam-Pro bullet is a similar bullet.

But you don't have a big power factor margin for IPSC so I would be doing some testing.

I would likely start with:

10 @ 5.1 gr.
20 @ 5.2 gr.
20 @ 5.3 gr.
20 @ 5.4 gr.
20 @ 5.5 gr.
10 @ 5.6 gr.

A nice 100 round box full. I can't see it being more than 0.2 gr. difference. And with all that data from your chronograph you should be confident in your load. Well, at least if you give yourself a big enough power factor margin. :D

Maybe move 10 rounds down from the 5.5 gr. and do 10 at 5.0 gr. and only 10 at 5.5 gr. Still a 100 round box full.

That's my opinion... I hope you like it! :p


PS - where do I find Cam-Pro bullets? I guess you like 'em compared to others?


Fudd
 
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