Chest Rigs and Mags for your Black Rifle
- Thread starter TV-PressPass
- Start date
Role dictates the loadout. For example, when I'm overthere playing advisor, three mags, 2 on me, 1 in the gun. But I'm not out looking for trouble. But the cadre that I omlt, their loadout is significantly more substantial. My mag pouches carry cell phones, terras, and a sat comms. And lots of power bars, because convoys get stuck in traffic regardless of how we mitigate it.lol
I am a huge fan of the MAV for work within the CF, when I was overseas I carried 8 mags on my rig and 3 in my pack. That may seem low but I also had 14 HE M203 bombs, 2 Illum rounds, a massive TCCC bag strapped to my leg, a big radio on my back, frags, water, armor Etc. The amount of stuff that the average Infanteer has to carry on patrol can be pretty limiting. While deployed I weighed around 180-190 with no gear on, all suited up for daily patrolling I weighed in at around 300. that's around 120 pounds of gear that needs to be lugged around in 25-55 degree heat through some pretty rough terrain. Not exactly conducive to being super manoeuvrable. I still have my MAV for work and if I want to do some training out in the bush. 16 mags on a rig/vest is pretty excessive, even the riflemen in my platoon carried no more than 10 on them with the spares in their packs. Swimming with that amount of gear is totally out of the question, better to just sink to the bottom and try to walk across to the other side. As for going prone there is many arguments about going prone or not that I won't get into here, I generally never go prone so it is not an issue for me.
That's almost my body weight in gear....
the_klenzer
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver, BC
Unless it's zombies - if you can't solve your problem with 180rds, you're pooched anyway.
6 mags for CZ. 2 in 1 double taco on the left for fast Reloads, 1 in a taco on my right in the drop holster for right hand only reload, 1 in the girl and two on the back side of the battle belt. Advantages are you can go prone and urban prone very easily. Kneeling, easy. Moving, No problem. Disadvantage is that you only have 30/180 rnds. If you have more mags and need them on the move then I say pop them in a gear slinger or stack out in the back of the belt. All those mags hanging off the front really interferes with snappy reloads in my experience.
-chris
-chris
Good luck with 180 rounds in a fire fight. Unless you have some sort of limitless resupply or a nice shady spot to relax and refill your mags when you run out while the bad guys take a break too, best you carry a few more.
Remember, a firefight goes both ways and usually with lots of distance and cover in between you and the bad guy so things like spec fire, covering buddies movement and general superior firepower suck up ammo. It's not all v bull targets and low fire rate.
In Afghanistan. For a run and gun or other sporting purpose 6 mags is about all you really need. esp if you can get 10 rounders running. Although if SHTF that changes. In a SHTF scenario the afghanistan MO is more necessary.
-chris
16 mags stacked on the front of you would act as their own body armour in some cases lol. I'm not CF, but if I were overseas, my worst fear would be running out of ammo before the fight was over, so I can understand his point of view.
For 3 gun, I'm still working on a rig, which is why I'm tagging this thread. right now I'm leaning twds three mags on a drop leg holster, but mounted high on my left thigh just barely below my pistol mags. My three mags are all doubled up LAR ten rounders, and another double ten rounder in the gun.....possibly with a coupler to have four LAR mags attached to the gun. I don't like having bullets in the dirt when going prone, so if a stage has a prone section, I'll likely keep some lone ten rounders that I can grab out of my bag and add to my setup.
Overseas, I'd be the moron humping at least 20 mags through the desert I think.
For 3 gun, I'm still working on a rig, which is why I'm tagging this thread. right now I'm leaning twds three mags on a drop leg holster, but mounted high on my left thigh just barely below my pistol mags. My three mags are all doubled up LAR ten rounders, and another double ten rounder in the gun.....possibly with a coupler to have four LAR mags attached to the gun. I don't like having bullets in the dirt when going prone, so if a stage has a prone section, I'll likely keep some lone ten rounders that I can grab out of my bag and add to my setup.
Overseas, I'd be the moron humping at least 20 mags through the desert I think.
omegaboost
CGN Regular
I guess it all comes down to what you're getting yourself into. In magpul volume 2, Travis mentioned why less is more and does have a good point. All that weight + being in a high stress environment will kill you and as soon as you actually do get 'in action', you'll definitely not be as dynamic as you should.
I posted this article a few times but reposting it doesnt hurt in case some ppl havent read it:
http://www.magpul.com/assets/files/BLOG/ArmyTimes_AllGearedUp.pdf
I posted this article a few times but reposting it doesnt hurt in case some ppl havent read it:
http://www.magpul.com/assets/files/BLOG/ArmyTimes_AllGearedUp.pdf
Way back in the day, when we still had olive drab combats, I would use my pants cargo pockets as a primitive "mag drop pouch" for empty or near empty mags. Even as light as an empty Thermold mag is, put three in one cargo pouch, and three in the other side, and do pepperpotting (up run down shoot cover up run down shoot...repeat as necessary!) for ten minutes and you'll hate it as much as I did. But it was better for me than go back looking for mags afterward! But I can't imagine how much it'd suck for something weighing more than a pound...
A few thoughts:
Most US soldiers in the Vietnam war could expect resupply quite easily, and so had a tendency to reduce the amount of ammo actually carried at any one time.
However, LRRP's and other SOG units, operating "illegally" either in the north or in neighboring countries, could not expect easy resupply, nor could expect timely air/arty support...and were basically totally "on their own". They would carry anywhere from 22 to 30 magazines of 20 rounds each (the early mags for M-16's and XM-177's). The extra mags would be used almost like instant claymores, as "area denial". Basically, upon contact everyone would do mag dumps and peel back away from the contact, then set up counter ambush, again doing mag dumps, until they could extend and disengage the contact. Basically most of the ammo was dumped into bushes, blind, to make noise confusion and deter the Commies from thinking of following them. This was not your standard carefully aimed marksmanship one round at a time, more “burrrrrrrp, mag change, burrrp”
Brits in the Falklands mostly had the FN SLR and specops usually used M-16's or CAR-15's. The guys with SLR's found from direct attacks that they were expending so much ammo so quickly, that the "battlefield pickup" became common in one particular night raid (sounded like one hell of a fight to me, Rolland AT missiles used on Argie machinegun posn's). Many of them would be seen the next day with two FN's: the one they were issued, and the Argentinian one they captured the night before!
But their limit really was the weight of the 7.62Nato ammo itself...you can't really carry much of it before you get seriously overloaded. In those days a typical combat load was 100 rounds, meaning one mag on the rifle, four mags in pouches.
Then Grenada happened: with little time to prep, the airborne troops were to jump onto the sole airfield, and expected the mother of all firefights just to get off the open field. So they jumped with a massive ammo load...and upon securing the airfield, rounded up the “extra” ammo so they could actually walk about the island!
Just thought the history might be worth considering.
Most US soldiers in the Vietnam war could expect resupply quite easily, and so had a tendency to reduce the amount of ammo actually carried at any one time.
However, LRRP's and other SOG units, operating "illegally" either in the north or in neighboring countries, could not expect easy resupply, nor could expect timely air/arty support...and were basically totally "on their own". They would carry anywhere from 22 to 30 magazines of 20 rounds each (the early mags for M-16's and XM-177's). The extra mags would be used almost like instant claymores, as "area denial". Basically, upon contact everyone would do mag dumps and peel back away from the contact, then set up counter ambush, again doing mag dumps, until they could extend and disengage the contact. Basically most of the ammo was dumped into bushes, blind, to make noise confusion and deter the Commies from thinking of following them. This was not your standard carefully aimed marksmanship one round at a time, more “burrrrrrrp, mag change, burrrp”
Brits in the Falklands mostly had the FN SLR and specops usually used M-16's or CAR-15's. The guys with SLR's found from direct attacks that they were expending so much ammo so quickly, that the "battlefield pickup" became common in one particular night raid (sounded like one hell of a fight to me, Rolland AT missiles used on Argie machinegun posn's). Many of them would be seen the next day with two FN's: the one they were issued, and the Argentinian one they captured the night before!
But their limit really was the weight of the 7.62Nato ammo itself...you can't really carry much of it before you get seriously overloaded. In those days a typical combat load was 100 rounds, meaning one mag on the rifle, four mags in pouches.
Then Grenada happened: with little time to prep, the airborne troops were to jump onto the sole airfield, and expected the mother of all firefights just to get off the open field. So they jumped with a massive ammo load...and upon securing the airfield, rounded up the “extra” ammo so they could actually walk about the island!
Just thought the history might be worth considering.
the_klenzer
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver, BC
How mags do you usually go through in the firefights you've been in recently?
mudgunner49
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
While I have usually held to the adage that the only time it's impossible to have too much ammo is if you are over your head in water or on fire, I believe that this discussion is a classic example of the concept of "train for war, not necessarily THIS war" - everything isn't Afghanistan, and our next fight may very well not look like the current conflict, in location, scope or TTP's. I've always thought that the mission dictates the gear...
Everyone doesn't need 12-20 mags as everyone isn't suppressing fire from 300 or executing fire and movement for 400 meters - well, unless all those mags are 5 rounders I guess.
Perhaps aim more, miss less, hit more, carry less?? Are you better off carrying 20 mags and having to wait for someone to blow the gate or perhaps carrying 5 or six mags and being able to climb over the wall and open the gate from the inside???
YMMV
blake
Everyone doesn't need 12-20 mags as everyone isn't suppressing fire from 300 or executing fire and movement for 400 meters - well, unless all those mags are 5 rounders I guess.
Perhaps aim more, miss less, hit more, carry less?? Are you better off carrying 20 mags and having to wait for someone to blow the gate or perhaps carrying 5 or six mags and being able to climb over the wall and open the gate from the inside???
YMMV
blake
Mags on the rig should be for breaking contact and suppressing until cover can be found if you look at American loadouts the trend is 3-6 on the rig with just as many in the pack/truck.
Here's a picture off lightfighter of a mayflower rig that clips onto a plate/armour carrier.
Here's a picture off lightfighter of a mayflower rig that clips onto a plate/armour carrier.
I am a fan of aiming more and carrying less. Right now I run 4 mags, blowout, 1 TQ, MBITR or Motorola, 1 x frag on my rig, sometimes 1 mag on the belt, and 1 in the gun. Sometimes the radio goes in the bag to reduce weight on the rig. More of everything in my bag and vehicle if there is one. With this loadout I can actually run and move at high altitude.
As always, you need to tailor your mission for your mission set and location. The guys running their TF-106 style rigs in 2012 Kabul are over the top. When there are NGO chicks walking around unarmed in the city, it's a clue that you probably don't need 11 mags.
As always, you need to tailor your mission for your mission set and location. The guys running their TF-106 style rigs in 2012 Kabul are over the top. When there are NGO chicks walking around unarmed in the city, it's a clue that you probably don't need 11 mags.
