Citadel / Legacy 9mm M1 Carbines?

H Wally

H Wally

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Anyone heard much about the citadel/Legacy Arms 9mm M1 Carbines? They look like neat repro's - a good cheap plinking caliber, nice small lightweight carbine, fills the M1 Carbine gap in the collection :p

Any knowledge of them? I'd imagine they're just meeting demand in the US right now, but would be interesting to see up here!
 
You mean this guy?

M1-9mm.jpg


It seems everyone and their dog wants to produce an M1 carbine. The CMP is basically out of them after a large Italian import, and after years of being an ugly cousin to the M1 garand, many American shooters are now "discovering" the carbine. Now you have Auto-Oardnance, Chiappa and Legacy Sports all producing decent-looking copies. It's like the 1960's are back. In those days, before black rifles, the carbine was rightly regarded as the "black rifle" of its day and a slew of companies made cast-receiver copies. Heck, in vietnam, many soldiers preferred the M2 carbine variant to the M14. The south-vietnamese army used it extensively through to the end of the vietnam conflict.

Personally, I'm a fan. I can't imagine a better all-purpose bush rifle for carrying around he provinces that let you do so outside hunting season (Ontario thankfully being one of the provinces that allow this). Big enough to dust a 'yote or porcupine, small enough to shoot small game, and enough power to kill a deer out to about 75 yards or so with proper shot placement.

Now back to the Citadel 9mm. Citadel is another Legacy Sports offering. The new 9mm version appears to have very little to do with the M1 carbine in actual operation, though it is outwardly similar-looking. For one thing, it's a blowback and takes Beretta 92FS mags. To save money, the base models have plastic stocks, and they also use a lot of cheaply cast parts. The bayonet lug itself is non-functional and made of plastic. Bright side is 10 round mags.

In other words, this will look, feel, and work more like a Chiappa .22LR clone than a real M1 carbine. I doubt the barrel will have a piston housing and the slide, if there is one, will likely only be there to give the recoil spring something to push against.

I think I would reserve judgement until some of these are in people's hands and have been shot a bunch. We know they will be more cheaply made than a real M1 carbine or clone, but they might still be OK - hard to say.

As of November, no US dealers had any guns yet - not sure if any are out in the wild yet. I also doubt the barrels are 18.5" - probably only 18".

If I was going to buy a NR M1 carbine copy, I would get the Auto Ordnance in .30 carbine. Or do like I did, and get a nerd Criterion put on a GI gun. It's a known quantity and is bomb-proof.

 
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The M1 carbine is my personal favorite hunting & plinkin' rifle, but because of the constant threat of
reactionary retards to prohibit or confiscate these from rightful owners, I no longer own one.

If I were to do a build-up one of these, the best cartridge to chamber it for is the 7.62x25 Tokarev/.30 Mauser.
The 9mm. Para is not in my radar as it is too short for reliable feeding and not as accurate at 100yds. as the Tok.

If Winchester had their act together back when they were working with "Carbine Williams" to get this rifle into
service, then we would have 'em in a great all-round chambering....the .351 Winchester SL.
There definately would not have been many complaints about stopping power using this chambering on enemies using a 160 gr., truncated cone FMJ boolit. A minor lengthening of the action & magazine would have done
this perfectly, with only an extra couple of ounces in weight gain.

Why those goofs went with a cartridge based on the .32 SL is beyond me. Politics strike again I guess.f:P:
Typical of U.S. policy.
 
Thanks claven - I'd been hoping it was a good clone, but I guess not. I like the carbines but don't really feel like adding another caliber to my list of reloading only guns :p.... and I'm too cheap to buy commercial - would rather spend it on the guns themselves :D

If one had to rebarrel an M1 (because of Rest. barrel length for example) the tokarev round sounds like fun - nice zippy little bullet. Plus being available in surplus it might actually be worth getting another cal :p It would be a pity to take an original out of its original caliber though.
 
I've got to disagree with Claven for once,;-) get yourself an early Plainfield CIVILIAN carbine for about $450 on the EE and
shoot it with cheap Tulammo 30 carbine 'til the cows come home. There is nought wrong with them, just some
snobbish attitudes because they aren't considered milsurps. Check out http://mmm.m1carbinesinc.com/index.html
or search "Civilian M1 carbines"to find the good 'uns & put a Wolff spring kit in it. No worries. Sub the mmm for www.
 
SHELL SHUCKER said:
The M1 carbine is my personal favorite hunting & plinkin' rifle, but because of the constant threat of
reactionary retards to prohibit or confiscate these from rightful owners, I no longer own one.

If I were to do a build-up one of these, the best cartridge to chamber it for is the 7.62x25 Tokarev/.30 Mauser.
The 9mm. Para is not in my radar as it is too short for reliable feeding and not as accurate at 100yds. as the Tok.

If Winchester had their act together back when they were working with "Carbine Williams" to get this rifle into
service, then we would have 'em in a great all-round chambering....the .351 Winchester SL.
There definately would not have been many complaints about stopping power using this chambering on enemies using a 160 gr., truncated cone FMJ boolit. A minor lengthening of the action & magazine would have done
this perfectly, with only an extra couple of ounces in weight gain.

Why those goofs went with a cartridge based on the .32 SL is beyond me. Politics strike again I guess.f:P:
Typical of U.S. policy.
Click to expand...

FWIW, the M1 carbine is NOT restricted by name, only barrel length. If you have a NR barrel, the only thing that will restrict it is if the goofs restrict or prohibit all semis - which admittedly is something I would not put past the Drama Teacher.
 
H Wally said:
Thanks claven - I'd been hoping it was a good clone, but I guess not. I like the carbines but don't really feel like adding another caliber to my list of reloading only guns :p.... and I'm too cheap to buy commercial - would rather spend it on the guns themselves :D

If one had to rebarrel an M1 (because of Rest. barrel length for example) the tokarev round sounds like fun - nice zippy little bullet. Plus being available in surplus it might actually be worth getting another cal :p It would be a pity to take an original out of its original caliber though.
Click to expand...

Really? I can buy Tulaammo steel-cased plinking rounds for cheaper than I can reload with jacketed bullets.
 
machman said:
I've got to disagree with Claven for once,;-) get yourself an early Plainfield CIVILIAN carbine for about $450 on the EE and
shoot it with cheap Tulammo 30 carbine 'til the cows come home. There is nought wrong with them, just some
snobbish attitudes because they aren't considered milsurps. Check out http://mmm.m1carbinesinc.com/index.html
or search "Civilian M1 carbines"to find the good 'uns & put a Wolff spring kit in it. No worries. Sub the mmm for www.
Click to expand...

I have nothing against the early Plainfields. I prefer GI as they are forged and machined vs. cast, but I'e had them and they work fine, IF you have the right barrel (i.e. not s sleeved or welded-on gas cylinder). If you re-barrel these with a new Criterion, they are great.
 
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