clean burning powders

[enefgee]

I started loading with a 8 LB jug of 231

Only 1/2 LB to go

9mm now universal
revolvers now trail boss

I hate breathing in the extra smoke and fumes for no reason.

Someone once asked Bill Jordan how to become a good shooter, he told the guy "get an 8lb keg of 231, when you're done, get another - you'll be pretty good when it's gone" Just one more Keg dude!!!

 

[BCRider]

shoulda got the hornady, but +/- .2 seems a bit extreme even for a dillon (ducks). What powder? 231 or bullseye? If the charge is too small for the bar? it's going to be hard to be repeatable. I change to a handgun specific insert for my powder drop when i do short stuff on the progressive.

Powders need a certain amount of pressure to burn cleanly. As you load cartridges to reduced charges and therefore reduced pressures, you will get increased fouling. As a general rule, most powders will burn fairly clean at the upper end of the charge range and burn dirty at reduced loads.......

These are small loads. 2.7gn behind .38Spl LHBWC's. The powder bar is working at the extreme end. I'm thinking of making up a new bar with a narrower channel and more rounded ends that will allow the powder to fill the cavity easier. No football like points to create hollows. I'll make it up so it operates from something like 2 gns up to around 4 to 5 grains. At that point the stock bar would be fine. From the sound of your reply I'm not the first to see such issues for small load consistency.

And a good point about operating with minimal pressures at the lower end of the load scale.

 

[tictactician]

have been loading 40 to IPSC minor using titegroup. spent cases are sooty. Soot wipes off pretty easy though. Bore is easy to clean. My load is below the min. load in the manual .

 

[hatman1793]

All Powdes are dirty.

All powder is dirty. There is no such thing as clean burning powder. Powder formulations in general, regulate whether the powder burns slow or fast. Maufacturers include in their powder formulations burn retardant properties to create the necessary pressure to deliver the desired velocity.
Some powders may appear dirty or have fouling properties that exceed other powders, but all powders are dirty....

 

[BCRider]

Hatman, you haven't seen how clean the cases are from Winclean ammo then. My cases aren't that clean even directly from the cleaner. The only time I've seen cases that clean is fresh out of a bag of new cases.

 

[enefgee]

These are small loads. 2.7gn behind .38Spl LHBWC's. The powder bar is working at the extreme end. I'm thinking of making up a new bar with a narrower channel and more rounded ends that will allow the powder to fill the cavity easier. No football like points to create hollows. I'll make it up so it operates from something like 2 gns up to around 4 to 5 grains. At that point the stock bar would be fine. From the sound of your reply I'm not the first to see such issues for small load consistency.

And a good point about operating with minimal pressures at the lower end of the load scale.

This will sound like heresy but if you get a cheap Lee Autodisk with the Micro charge bar (total cost around $40) it'll drop tiny loads reliably. The largest chamber on the Micro drops right around 2.8 grains.

 

[IM_Lugger]

Vv n350 seems to be pretty clean. so is HS6 but I haven't used it in a while. Power Pistol is ok but a little dirtier.

 

[BCRider]

Not a bad idea if I could get it adapted to my Dillon press.

But you're too late. Yesterday afternoon I made a new powder bar. Took this picture part way through the process and forgot to take another once finished in my rush to get it into action last night. So far the results look to be excellent with my digital scale adding up more consistently while accumulating 5 loads before dividing to find the average. Drop weight is from 2.0 minimum to just over 6 grains. Perfect.

 

[kharlingca]

I have to say i started with w231 and found it dirty, Since then i have been using titegroup for pistol and h335 for 223 and 308.

 

[Dan-O-Mite]

I concur with Win 231 being dirty. I can get Titegroup for the same price, and it's much cleaner. I found Clays Universal to be about the same as Titegroup but a little more expensive.

 

[tjhaile]

If you're throwing charges of less than about 3 grains from a Dillon measure, you will likely need the extra small charge bar:

http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/23601/catid/3/Dillon_X_Small_Powder_Bar

 

[mbuist]

Been using W 231 for qite a while and though it has performed well for me with 38 spl and 9 m it does leave a very dirty residue espec in my 9 m semi. I've heard that Hodgdon Titegroup is even better and very clean. Just bought a pound of it but haven't had a chance to try it yet. The specs look a tad better than W231 ... any comments

= MAtt

 

[twig_40]

Is Winclean what Winchester uses in their pistol rounds? I have been using Winchester 9mm ammo and the cases come out looking brand new. From the way you guys are talking I take it that it is only available in the States?

 

[JOHNNY K.]

Vihtouvori N340 gets my vote. Clean burning and has been referred to as "premium powder" by some knowledgeable poeple.

 

[SandRoad]

Powders need a certain amount of pressure to burn cleanly. As you load cartridges to reduced charges and therefore reduced pressures, you will get increased fouling. As a general rule, most powders will burn fairly clean at the upper end of the charge range and burn dirty at reduced loads. And within that general rule, some burn more cleanly than others, of course.

Hodgdon Clays (not Universal or Universal Clays, just plain Clays).

A word of caution, however: it (Clays) is able to do this because it builds pressure more quickly than other powders. This means that loads near the top of the scale can develop dangerous pressures very quickly, too.

Many people have been complaining about "dirty" W231. I have no problem with it but limit its use to MAX PRESSURE LOADS. This is where it is designed to burn and it does so quite cleanly.

We use Clays for some light loads and it is very clean burning, but is a DANGEROUS powder (as noted above) because it generates high pressures for even light loads. Most of the time we use Titegroup. It is slower than Clays, a bit dirtier in reduced loads, but it is SAFER because it doesn't require the same high pressures to make minor, never mind major. Titegroup is also faster than W231, hence higher pressures and cleaner burning.

OK, I have fired 40 S&W loaded to major using 200gr plated. But they were loaded long which reduces pressure. (long enough that they won't fit into a Glock or most other mags). However I was uncomfortable with the high pressures, and switched to Titegroup which is a bit slower and hence lower pressure for the same velocity. My 40 has a fluted chamber and the brass was flowing into the flutes a little to well when using Clays for major, in addition to really flattened primers.

 

[hatman1793]

WinClean et al..

BCRider is correct in claiming that WinClean is somewhat cleaner, but the flaw in his argument is that Winchester does not sell the propellant that is in the WinClean case.
Besides, if you fire a couple hundred rounds of WinClean, you will see dirt.
Hence, my respite: All powder is dirty. As a side note, Winchester does not sell the WinClean primer either. You must use their standard small or large pistol primers...

 

[twig_40]

Figures, I like that winchester stuff. works good and yes if you fire a lot of rounds, you still have to clean your pistol. Oh well thats the fun of reloading you get to try all sorts of combos to find what fits YOU best.

 

[firemachine69]

Isn't cleaning half the fun?

 

[colt45cz75]

Isn't cleaning half the fun?

Isn't Hoppes No.9 the gunnutz Chanel No.5?