LMT is a very good product. I never said the rep was not deserved. There IS better out there though, if you are willing to pay.
:confused: Broke my LMT - MRP Locking Bolt!!!
- Thread starter Adamg_55
- Start date
LMT is a very good product. I never said the rep was not deserved. There IS better out there though, if you are willing to pay.
True that suppliers must be carefully selected. I would even argue LMT would have some due diligence to take extra QA/QC steps when assembling the rifles with any outsourced fasteners - I all but guarantee they already do regardless where a batch of bolts comes from
I will tell you why LMT cares in my opinion.
Before I buy my first LMT from Mark, I decided to try something with different AR manufacturer.
May be it's stupid, but in my opinion, it tell you a lot about the manufacturer.
I know that catalog are on the net for me to browse, but that is easy.
I wrote to few AR manufacturer (7), asking for a hard copy of their catalog, and to be fair I waited 6 weeks in total, for a response.
I already had 2 brand in mind to choose from, well after 2.5 weeks, in my mail box , the LMT catalog showed up. I am still waiting 3.5 years later for the other 6.
It's not scientific, but.....
Before I buy my first LMT from Mark, I decided to try something with different AR manufacturer.
May be it's stupid, but in my opinion, it tell you a lot about the manufacturer.
I know that catalog are on the net for me to browse, but that is easy.
I wrote to few AR manufacturer (7), asking for a hard copy of their catalog, and to be fair I waited 6 weeks in total, for a response.
I already had 2 brand in mind to choose from, well after 2.5 weeks, in my mail box , the LMT catalog showed up. I am still waiting 3.5 years later for the other 6.
It's not scientific, but.....
Wow. Poor customer service (or stupid business decision) from the others. I wonder if they would have been more responsive to a USA address?
- Location
- 54°52'56"N 112°10'7"W Alpha Bravo
I think so, you know how it is. Some of these other manufacturers could give two ####s about us. It's more of hassle to deal with us I guess.
It makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside when a manufacturer such as LMT, wants our business.
LMT makes great products and there is no doubt about that BUT this design is not one of those great products.
Its really pretty sad that they design something that depends on a low strength bolt snapping so it wont damage their product.
Its really pretty sad that they design something that depends on a low strength bolt snapping so it wont damage their product.
I am not sure what you mean. Do you understand that almost every bolt (or screw) is capable of destroying the thing you are tightening it into? I would have felt a lot better a few times over if the bolt broke before doing damage. Like when I miss-read the torque specs for the head bolts I was torqueing down on a car engine. Stupid manual was confusing.
You are confusing bad engineering with stupid people. When an engineer designs a product which depends on stupid people not being stupid then its a bad design.
People are stupid and its not the manuals fault its your fault. Did you know that TQ on a fastner is just actual amount of stretch on the material and threads?
- Location
- 54°52'56"N 112°10'7"W Alpha Bravo
Are you high?
Do you even have experience with this rifle? The MRP system is an all in one AR.
-Quick change barrels
-Quick change calibers
-Quick change Piston to DI conversion
-Monolithic rail
-Straight gas tube
-One piece strength
-Weight savings
The MRP system takes the meaning of modularity to a whole new level. You can do anything, CQB to Long Range, 5.56 to 6.8, Piston to DI, all in minutes. I personally like the stream line look the monolithic upper gives you. For a guy on a budget you could invest in one of these rifles, buy some parts over time and end up with a rifle that can do anything.
Seriously, you better have a better argument then "fasteners" before you down the MRP system, otherwise you're just a hater...
Why cant you tighten a simple bolt without breaking it? Must be your freakish Batman strength. smiley face for you
Any system is only as good as the lamest lamer that is going to use it, obviously this system is to lame for some people.
smiley face for youAny system is only as good as the lamest lamer that is going to use it, obviously this system is to lame for some people.
You know even smart people do stupid things sometimes. If there is one thing I have realised, it is the fact that we are all human and all make mistakes. But, I guess me making a dumb mistake means I am a stupid person doing stupid things.
So, as for me breaking head bolts, the fact is I should have never been looking up the specs myself. I didn’t know how to use the software (manual) and I was told “go ahead, it is easy.” I thought this torque spec can’t be right so I asked to double check; they shrugged and said “really so high, well if that's what it said.” Why did they trust me, I imagine they thought I was one of the smart ones. I know how to use a torque wrench and I know what happens when you tighten a bolt. That's why one of the head bolts broke while tightening it, it stretches! I was already on the last round of tightening and had already managed to fully torque half of the bolts. Imagine if we put the whole engine together without breaking one, without realizing I put double the torque as required. Imagine if someone was driving the car when the head bolts broke. Imagine if it was a rifle and not a car; imagine if a life depended on the rifle. Was it my fault, yes, was it stupid, everyone seemed to think it was including myself, but I did my due diligence, I was ignorant.
As for LMT’s design, IMHO it is brilliant. An average idiot, even me, can change barrels quickly, easily, in the field, even without a torque wrench and with no worries. Hmmm… I wonder if LMT intended it to be this may. What a bad design it must be.
this thread is really funny....
12ft lbs is very easy to go past if your not careful and experienced in using a torque wrench.
I highly doubt these bolts are anything special for a 1/4 socket head. Are these special fitted matched bolts? I would say NO
Get a 8.8 grade cap screw and learn to use a torque wrench. Any decent grade cap screw will shear if over torqued. even 50 cent ones will shear just like those did ..really
If you feel better about buying these ubber expensive replacement cap screws then go to town with it. Just giving some from friendly forum advice.
12ft lbs is very easy to go past if your not careful and experienced in using a torque wrench.
I highly doubt these bolts are anything special for a 1/4 socket head. Are these special fitted matched bolts? I would say NO
Get a 8.8 grade cap screw and learn to use a torque wrench. Any decent grade cap screw will shear if over torqued. even 50 cent ones will shear just like those did ..really
If you feel better about buying these ubber expensive replacement cap screws then go to town with it.
Just giving some from friendly forum advice.
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Funny stuff, when I build a engine. I BUILD THE ENGINE and blame no one for muck ups except myself regardless.
If you work around engines you get to know TQ for bolts by their thickness, i:e a 5/16 bolt isnt going to have 100 ftlbs of TQ regardless of what the manual or someone else says.
Now back to LMT, this system is obviously not fool proof proven by this thread.
If you work around engines you get to know TQ for bolts by their thickness, i:e a 5/16 bolt isnt going to have 100 ftlbs of TQ regardless of what the manual or someone else says.
Now back to LMT, this system is obviously not fool proof proven by this thread.
- Location
- 54°52'56"N 112°10'7"W Alpha Bravo
Why cant you tighten a simple bolt without breaking it? Must be your freakish Batman strength.
Hahaha I try and use that picture once a week, makes me laugh every time... lol
For real though, theres two reasons why people break these bolts,
1. Torque Wrench newb's first time torquing them, and doesn't realize that 140 inch pounds is almost just hand tight. IT happens not everyone understands how torque wrench's work.
2. Cheap china made torque wrench's are supplied with the gun. Mine failed, it never clicked or broke, this, and I wasn't very familiar with inch pounds to know when enough was enough.
Point being if you do break them for whatever reason, your only going to do it once. After you get a feel for how tight they need to be it's easy peezy...
Just an initial learning curve for some as is with anything. She' is a good system my friend...
- Location
- 54°52'56"N 112°10'7"W Alpha Bravo
50calshooter, you are my only friend in this thread
Also, nice rig, I have admired it a few times in the AR-15 pictures thread.
Finally, yeah, some of my posts maybe just to keep this alive.
Haha no doubt, I'll bump this next week forsure...
