Conversion to antique status

I assume that this thread is about full length sleeves, as opposed to short chamber inserts.
If this is the case, the sleeves could be turned to fit the bores and chambers. I have reamed out single shot ml barrels to .750" to install 3/4" seamless 4130 sleeves, but would be nervous about reaming the bores in a double, ml or breechloading.
 
Track of the Wolf should have barrels and ship to Canada.Will Bilozir 403-938-6066 in southern AB has 24 ga hulls and almost all hard to get shotgun stuff! 32ga 8ga etc...........Harold
 
Track of the Wolf lists 24 guage barrels but not sleeves and at $200 plus per barrel thats a little rich for me. I've got a lathe so turning most of this stuff is relatively easy for me but I'm interested in tying up a ton of cash. This is just a playtoy that in the end won't be worth a hell of a lot...
 
tiriaq said:
I assume that this thread is about full length sleeves, as opposed to short chamber inserts.
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I tossed in the comment of short inserts in 14 g greener police shells because one of the criteria was modifiying a 12 gauge on the cheap. It would also seem to me that lining a 12 guage to 24 guage, would add a lot of weight. One semi cheap alternative I suppose would be to experiment on one barrel with inserts about 10 - 12" long, probably with a choke built in, in order to keep the weight down.
I don't think that buying prechambered sleeves is an option, I think he would be better to make his own chambering reamer and chamber the sleeve after installation. Also to make his own tapered bore reamer so that he could ream the sleeve to 24 guage and leave a choke at the mouth of the sleeve.

cheers mooncoon
 
Weight will be a little on the heavy side but the gun will be short barreled so it is less of an issue. I do however like the idea of shorter sleeves. 12" inserts would do what I need. What is the advantage of reaming after installation?
 
The extractors can be cut to fit at the same time as the chambers are finished.
Shorter inserts would make the job easier, keep the weight in check, and woudn't affect performance. As the tubes were reamed, choke could be incorporated.
 
tactical870 said:
What is the advantage of reaming after installation?
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One advantage is that the outer barrel supports the liner or sleeve during the reaming process. Probably not as much a concern with 12 guage outer and 24 guage inner but with the greener police for example, there is very little metal left in a chamber liner.
I think on something as large as a shotgun shell, I would make a multifluted reamer rather than a the spade bits (D bits) that I use on rifle chambers.

cheers mooncoon
 
How exactly does one make a reamer? I've seen pictures of some custom reamers here but not sure exactly what I need to do. My plan was to attempt to bore the sleeve in the lathe or buy a chambered blank if possible.
 
subtle but important question.

hey guys...i've been poring over this antique handgun stuff on the forum for awhile now, and here's the part i don't understand, relating to calibre conversions. here's a quote from trevj earlier in this thread:


trevj says:
"As a case in point, there are a couple colt SAA's that have come and gone on the EE, that have their original caliber parts included, but that were equipped with an RCMP letter declaring them to be Prescribed Antiques. Off the top of my head, I can recall a SAA that started out as a 38-40, converted to 41LC, and another that was a conversion to 44 Special, using later generation Colt parts."



so...re this comment, say you take a pre 98 SAA in 45LC or 38-40 and convert it to 44 special or 41LC. i understand this has been done, and the SAA can be legally considered antique and get an RCMP letter, etc. the thing i don't get is that in the regs it says:

"... other than a handgun 'DESIGNED OR ADAPTED TO DISCHARGE' 32 Short Colt, 32 Long Colt, 32 Smith and Wesson, 32 Smith and Wesson Long, 32-20 Winchester, 38 Smith and Wesson, 38 Short Colt, 38 Long Colt, 38-40 Winchester, 44-40 Winchester, or 45 Colt cartridges."

can someone explain to me how the aforementioned SAA is not 'designed to discharge' 45LC and therefore not ineligible for antique status? wouldnt the fact that it was orignally chambered in a non-antique-eligible calibre make it 'designed to discharge' that calibre and therefore ineligible to be considered an antique? i hope i'm wrong; i have a knowledgeable friend who agrees with the posters here that it can indeed be an antique and i tend to believe him due to his knowledge on these matters. i hope to hear a good answer to allay my questions from one of you gurus, because this is something i'd be interested in looking into. but ya, how is a pre 98 SAA in 45LC not 'designed to discharge' that non-antique caliber?? i hope my question is clear and that i'm making myself understood...lol.

thanks guys.
cheers.
 
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Once the original gun has been modified so that it can no longer chamber any cartridge on the no-go list, then it can no longer be said to be designed to discharge them. The no-go cartridges simply will not fit or chamber. It does not say 'originally' designed. Rather, the 'design' is meant to refer to its current status.
 
Win 38-55 said:
Once the original gun has been modified so that it can no longer chamber any cartridge on the no-go list, then it can no longer be said to be designed to discharge them. The no-go cartridges simply will not fit or chamber. It does not say 'originally' designed. Rather, the 'design' is meant to refer to its current status.
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What He Said ^


heres some more ideas on this subject

If its a 45 Colt to start with its NOT a perscribed Antique but if a new cylinder is installed so it can only chamber say 455 Webley the gun cant chamber a 45 Colt anymore.
So it is now a Perscribed Antique.
As long as the frame was made before 1898 and its a Caliber that is not on the NO list your good to go.
 
win38-55 and dingus...thanks very much for responding.. i gotta ask; are the things you say commonly held opinions, or are they legal facts that have court precedent?

especially concerned with the 'design' part, win38-55. to my mind, 'design' implies 'original design' but i'm no expert.

don't mean to question your knowledge, but as you know, you cant count on the legal system to be logical all the time :) and i definitely want to remain within legal limits...thanks again for your time..

cheers..
 
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Curvy

Win38-55 and Dingus are very experienced in this area, their sage advice is darn near gospel on this board. There are no court cases that I am aware of that define the answer that you seek, but the RCMP issues antique status letters to firearms described in the manner Dingus and Win38-55 have explained. It don't get much better than that.
 
I wasn't aware you could convert a pre 1898 gun from the no-go caliber list and get it changed to antique status.

I'd love an antique sxs coach gun. So I could basically get a pre 1898 sxs 12ga and covert it to 14ga and then get antique status?
 
curvy said:
win38-55 and dingus...thanks very much for responding.. i gotta ask; are the things you say commonly held opinions, or are they legal facts that have court precedent?

especially concerned with the 'design' part, win38-55. to my mind, 'design' implies 'original design' but i'm no expert.
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It is not a matter of opinion, it is the position of the 'powers that be'. It is much easier to apply when it refers to 'currently designed' rather than 'originally designed'. It can often be impossible to know what the gun was originally designed to shoot. This is especially true for models that had multiple chamberings originally, some of which are now 'antique' and some of which are not (e.g., S&W top breaks, Winchester Model 1885's, and Colt SAA's). The rules to qualify as an antique centerfire handgun are just two, no more and no less:

1. Frame made before 1898
2. Not chambered for anything on the 'no go' list.

If the above two conditions are satisfied, it's an antique and a letter will be issued accordingly by the RCMP if you so desire.
 
dingus said:
What He Said ^


heres some more ideas on this subject

If its a 45 Colt to start with its NOT a perscribed Antique but if a new cylinder is installed so it can only chamber say 455 Webley the gun cant chamber a 45 Colt anymore.
So it is now a Perscribed Antique.
As long as the frame was made before 1898 and its a Caliber that is not on the NO list your good to go.
Click to expand...

lets say you take a 45colt case shorten it 100 thou and chamber a new cylinder to fit the new round .
if done right a 45 colt case won't fit but a 45 colt case shortened would fit ,45 Schofield should fit ( as well as possibly 455 webley assuming the rim doesn't get in the way ) .



would this work , or is this just asking for trouble ?
 
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