Counterfeit or not? Still cool!

tokguy

tokguy

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Picked up this of a CGN'r, good deal and a good person to deal with.
It wasn't sold as authenticate. But until someone can prove otherwise...well, it's still cool, LOL
He bought it in the late '80's
I can't be bothered to blank out the S.N. and markings, not planning a drive-by any time soon
A couple of still discernible cartouches in the wood , one ahead of the magazine well



And one behind the trigger guard


The receiver has a dirty bird


And the bolt has several as well as faint SS runes (that I find a touch over the top, but the German experts will know more than I on Wehrmacht & SS protocol )


Even if someone can prove it's faked ( and will they ever really prove it?) I paid less than a pristine M44 goes for and this one is definitely a conversation starter.
And hell yeah , I'm shooting a deer with it this fall...after I D & T it of course.
Just kidding, simmer down.
OK folks, convince me it's faked or not
 
That is totally utterly fake. 100%.

You need better pics for me to detail why but its fake.

Starting with, they did not mark guns like this.
If a m44 was reworked by a nazi depot, it would have a single depot mark on the wood. Which is the eagle/swas with the depot code below.

They would not have applied poorly designed stamps to the metal at random.
Waffenamts are for german made and accepted parts. Not captured rifles.

Also that is not an SS depot stamp either.


Drilling and tapping it would not affect it negatively at this point.


PAGING COYOTE UGLY.
 
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It was sold to me as a likely fake, but it's kind of like fake Boobs; still pretty cool.
I bought it as I needed an M-44 for my eclectic collection.


And as I said already; a pristine M-44 barely warrants a 2nd glance, let alone conversation.
Heck this one will get folks arguing, on the 2nd post I've got milsurp guys telling me to D & T it as it's worthless.
Now how often does that happen?
The controversy alone makes it worth every dollar
 
i would not drill it, but i also think it is fake. I used to have one dated 1945, and i sold it as a m44 with fake stamps. Still was a nice shooter and carbine, but i think it is sad as it reduce its value to a collector, but it is not wothless. The important is you like it! Your sling could be wwii made. The one i had with my m44 with fake marking was a genuine late wwii. Not often encountered. Most mosin sling we see are post wwii made.
 
I didn't say worthless. Lol. I just said its no longer original. Shoot it!! And if you want to shoot it with a scope have at it!
Its still a cool gun, just not genuine.
Love the boobs simile. Haha.
 
I know it's like spitting on the cross here, but...I don't consider most Mosins collectable.
The variants like Finn's or Remmy's sure. M-38's or snipers, yup.
But run of the mill clunkers; naw.
So as far as it's value; well... it'll get me 20 years of conversation so it's worth it. My kids will go bonkers over it.
Kinda like a bubba'd Krag; "it's not a real carbine, it's a cut-down rifle".
So what, still cool.
And I'm still smiling.
Someone said these things kick? Not by my standards , LOL
 
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John at Marstar had a bunch of M38 or M44's that were German marked and discussed on this site a few years ago. John states that they are legit. I had some doubts.

It is true that captured guns would more likely have a 'depot' marking vs. a waffen amt, especially an 'SS' waffen amt.

M44's are pretty hard to find these days so the rifle would retain most value.

We know of several instances of where fake or questionable waffen amts have been applied to rifles/pistols/field gear, including a Bulgarian import of Star B pistols to the US. Lots of times these markings are applied overseas in an attempt to increase the value of these firearms for export.

Then there is Michelle Mausers....
 
tokguy said:
Picked up this of a CGN'r, good deal and a good person to deal with.
It wasn't sold as authenticate. But until someone can prove otherwise...well, it's still cool, LOL
He bought it in the late '80's
I can't be bothered to blank out the S.N. and markings, not planning a drive-by any time soon
A couple of still discernible cartouches in the wood , one ahead of the magazine well



And one behind the trigger guard


The receiver has a dirty bird


And the bolt has several as well as faint SS runes (that I find a touch over the top, but the German experts will know more than I on Wehrmacht & SS protocol )


Even if someone can prove it's faked ( and will they ever really prove it?) I paid less than a pristine M44 goes for and this one is definitely a conversation starter.
And hell yeah , I'm shooting a deer with it this fall...after I D & T it of course.
Just kidding, simmer down.
OK folks, convince me it's faked or not
Click to expand...

I can prove it is fake right now. See the dimple on the forward part of your bolt? That is a hardness test carried out at refurb. Therefore that bolt at least was refurbed. No way the Russians would have left those dirty birds on that bolt. Definite fake.
 
davemccarthy707 said:
I can prove it is fake right now. See the dimple on the forward part of your bolt? That is a hardness test carried out at refurb. Therefore that bolt at least was refurbed. No way the Russians would have left those dirty birds on that bolt. Definite fake.
Click to expand...


One could make the arguement to that by stating that the WaffenAmts were supposed to be removed from all the captured/refurbed weapons (98k's, P38's, etc), but many of them still retain them in their entirety.

That being said, I also have a 1945 dated M44 with WaffenAmts. Even came with an original 98k sling. Do I think it's original? Hell no. Too many WaffenAmts in places they wouldn't have bothered, poorly struck, etc. Lots of things scream fake about it. But, it's all matching (sling and extra marks aside), and is in minty shape and is an excellent shooter. So, faked, sure, but a nice gun none the less.
 
Why would someone put fake stamps on a gun?, I don't get it. Was it a private individual or is it done at a armoury somewhere?
 
tokguy said:
It was sold to me as a likely fake, but it's kind of like fake Boobs; still pretty cool.
I bought it as I needed an M-44 for my eclectic collection.


And as I said already; a pristine M-44 barely warrants a 2nd glance, let alone conversation.
Heck this one will get folks arguing, on the 2nd post I've got milsurp guys telling me to D & T it as it's worthless.
Now how often does that happen?
The controversy alone makes it worth every dollar
Click to expand...

But it's got character.. lol
 
Magellann said:
Why would someone put fake stamps on a gun?, I don't get it. Was it a private individual or is it done at a armoury somewhere?
Click to expand...

Typically done in europe to boost the price of their mechandise. Before the internet, it was much harder to prove or disprove these guns.
 
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I have one of those "Nazi marked" M44's. I'm pretty sure the one I have was done by Hitler himself. Himmler and Goering were holding it for him when he stamped it. That's what my neighbor's cousin, who knew a guy that flew over Germany once, told me. :p

Whether they are fakes or not ( likely are) is neither here nor there to me. I think it is rather neat to own a fake, but it will not be touted as "real" until I find out otherwise. :)
 
Could be some ones practice piece for seeing how the stamps will turn out.better to practice on a mosin then a mauser
 
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