Critique my plan for building a precision rifle

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d4ve

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Good Evening,

I have been lurking on this forum for about a year now absorbing information and getting more and more excited about precision shooting. I have a savage semi-auto .22 that I plink with but have very little experience with center fire rifles and I would like to change that.

Of course I dont have a lot of money to put towards a gun and scope combo right now but at the same time I really want to destroy some paper (and gophers) before the summer is done. I have come up with what I think is an economical way to get into the sport while still having a piece of equipment that can grow with me and I am interested in hearing some input on it.

First off I am thinking I should start off with a .223 caliber as it is cheaper to feed, low recoil, and is accurate to at least medium range.

My first step would be to buy a stevens 200 put cheap rings/bases and a cheap scope so that I could get out there and fire off some rounds. The stevens 200 appeals to me because it is cheap (whats the best price you guys have seen for a new one?), it has multiple upgrades available, and it seems like a hands on person could do many of the upgrades themselves (I would love to be able to rebarrel it myself when funds are available to something heavier with maybe a faster twist to accommodate those 90gr bergers I spent 2hrs reading about).

Once funds permitted I would want to upgrade the scope to the rifle's permanent optic. I like the idea of a quality fixed power unit with tactical turrets such as the Sighton SIII, Bushnell Elite, or Super Sniper.

My next upgrade would be trigger and stock or barrel based on how comfortable the gun feels and which item I feel would make the biggest difference. The not chosen option would then be the next upgrade I would attempt.

At this point I would hope that I could say that I have a precision rifle with the ability to shoot sub MOA, one or two thousand rounds of once fired brass and a twinkle in my eye for a reloading kit.

So anything in the above sequence of events that should be changed? Any glaringly obvious uniformed assumptions that are making you shake your head and say to yourself "Why dont people stop asking where they can sign up to be a sniper?"

Thanks for read,

Dave
 
IMO I would go for better glass right off the start, this is where so to say , the rubber meets the road.

Can still get an economy rifle and built it up as you go.Most new rifles are more accurate than the shooters themselves.
 
Sounds like a plan to me! Only thing I would change is I would make the scope a variable power, not fixed. If you are doing target shooting (or gopher hunting) on a warm day, it doesn't take very many shots through a barrel till you start getting too much heat mirage off the barrel to see your target properly. Being able to turn your magnification down will help with this a lot. Good luck and have fun!
 
I'll argue and say fixed 10x get the sightron SIII 10x42 MMD.

Start with a Stevens sure, upgrade the trigger first. Stock one is like lifting weights with ur finger.

Mostly if I was you, a good idea would be to start setting ur self up for handloading ammo. You can have the most accurate rifle in the world and be David tubb, your rifle will still only shoot as good as the factory ammo let's it.




...... Ok maby being David tubb will help :p bit u get the point.
 
Consider a Savage 12FV or FP instead. The stevens is a wonderful base but the orig trigger really is heavy. Unless you are going to upgrade, it will be a hindrance to good shooting.

The Accutrigger on the other hand works very nicely and for most shooters 2lbs is plenty light enough.

Because of budget, I suggest the base synthetic stock. Bedded and the barrel channel opened WAY up, it will work just fine. Blind or detachable mag is entirely up to you. Most will single feed a dedicated target rifle but prefer a mag fed for varminting.

With handloads, you will get a sub MOA rig. Maybe even a 1/2 moa rig. Plenty accurate to keep you amused for a long time.

Now if your plan is to upgrade anyways, have a look at the factory offerings and if there is a model that would be your dream rig, buy it now. Adding aftermarket bits and pieces is great fun BUT sometimes hard to get and costs add up.

About the only thing that I would upgrade when the goal is peak accuracy, a quality match barrel. There is only so much good in a factory barrel even if the rare one is spectacular.

I also would suggest you lean your budget for better optics. I use the Sightron scopes on all my rifles and love them. Used to be a huge Bushnell Elite 4200 fan but their products have not kept up.

The SII Big Sky lineup gives you superb glass and mechanicals in a more affordable 1" tube scope. One of my favorites is the 6.5-20X50 w/ mildots. You will appreciate its many features when LR shooting.

The SIII is an amazing value but may exceed your budget total.

Also consider used, great scopes from 80's, 90's production for 1/2 the cost of new product.

Got lots of info on my website to help you get started but focus on a solid rifle that fits what you want a few steps ahead. optics should be as good as you can get cause, you can't hit what you can't see.

Quality ammo is everything in precision shooting. Start reloading.

This is the same theme that is repeated in many many posts and the conclusions are always the same.

Get a decent rig, tune it for best performance, feed it what it likes, top it with something that will let you aim properly and most important of all....

GET OUT AND SHOOT IT :)

Enjoy...

Jerry
 
to get yourself started off then a cheaper scope isnt a terrible idea, if you can afford it now, and really want to start now.. then go for it. but dont expect quality performance from a cheap scope..

i generally go with Leapers 3-12x44 .. with side wheel parallax. they work, they have good glass ( compared to the price ) .. and they have enough magnification... also come with tactical turrets and an accurate mildot reticle

I use their scopes on all my rimfires and on my cheaper .223's
 
Thanks for the replies. I like the idea of the fixed scope as it seems to me that extra options, like variable power, add cost and besides the 3x9 on my 22 never comes off 9x anyways. Is 10x mag high enough that it will be affected by barrel heat mirage? Do heavy varmit barrels help with that issue? Is 10x magnification acceptable for shooting gophers and bulls eyes out to 400 yards?

AKD, so you think it would be a better choice to start reloading before the upgrading the stock and barrel? Would it be cheap to get a starter reloading setup then do a barrel upgrade?
 
Thanks for the post Jerry, I was actually just checking out the sightron scopes on your site (once I have saved some money the SIII 10x42 would be my first upgrade I think) and I read your budget F class write up on Longrangehunting.com a few weeks ago. I guess my main question is this is what are the pros and cons to buy cheap and shoot now(ah instant gratification how you haunt me) with the intent to upgrade in the future vs wait a year and buy higher better but have no rounds down the tube?
 
Buy Once, Cry Once...

I personally think that if you spend a bunch of money on crap optics ect, looking to save money, you're only going to end up spending more in the long run.

Trust me, if you think you'll be happy with your cheap scope for more than a couple months, you'd be wrong.

I'm doing the exact same thing you are right now.

I bought a .223 Stevens 200. I got the trigger pull down as low as I can without ordering an after market one.
I bought a used Bushnell 3200 5x15, but I paid too much for it. I WISH I kept my money and bought a Sightron with at least 24x max power.
I bought Burris Zee rings (awesome). And an EBR one pice rail (AWESOME).
And you're going to want a real MOA or mildot reticle about 2 seconds after you mount your cheap scope, I'll tell ya that right now.
I have a Shilen SS Match barrel from Mystic which is in the process of being constructed.
I bought a Boyds' stock for the rifle as well.

All I can say is that you're going to immediately regret buying all that cheap s**t and wish you just put that $$ toward some quality stuff...
This is a rifle you're going to have for the rest of your life. There is no point in ever selling a project gun cause you'll lose your shirt on the deal no matter what (IMO).

So, build it right the first time. Don't second guess yourself. A crappy $250 scope is a waste since that was $250 you could have put toward a nice $750 Sightron.
Don't let the sticker shock get you down. After a little while, you'll start thinking $750 is inexpensive for a scope. Believe me, been there done that man.

Buy Once, Cry Once.
 
I shoot my 10x out to 1000 no prob. If you aim at a target and than focus closer in you will see the most amount of mirage I find. But use this as an advantage to see what the wind is doing. A fixed is the only way to go as well if you want to actually use your mil dots. 1 mil @ 100y is 3.6". You just times that by the distance. Ie, 1 mil @ 500y (3.6x5) is 18". And 1000y 1 mil is 36". Hope u get the idea.

Mystic had great advice on the 12fv. You can get them for around $600 and they are a much better rig to start with. Check out his site, very well done.

Yes start handloading befor you get a new barrel. If you get good at both shooting and loading first, you will be able to take advantage more. Espically because you will pick a bullet u like best and go with a matched barrel.

Ps. Welcome to the sport and be warned, highly addictive!
 
Don't dismiss the fixed SIII 16x42 MMD either.
The reticule is sized to fit. Same price just more fixed zoom. All your giving up is fov that you will only notice at 100m and not care about anyway. Espicaly when u start shooting with both eyes open.

24x is a little to high for a fixed zoom unless your a bench rest shooter. Not practical in the real world when ur out hunting n stuff.
 
Get the rifle, and get reloading. Reloading equipment will be a priceless investment, and most of the components you start with will still be in use many years from now.

I agree with investing in the best glass you can afford, but I would tend to suggest you wait on the glass and see if there is any way you can hook up with others at the range and see what they use. Fixed scopes can be a very economical way to get started, but they can be a powerful limitation in the wrong conditions. "Target" type shooting such as F-Class, really needs 3X magnification for every hundred yards as a bare minimum. Most use scopes up to 36 or even 50 power. Consider a Weaver T-36 or a sighton fixed 36X scope with a target dot if you are really on a budget, but above all, try and look through different scopes at the range.

Reloading will help you and the ammo reach its full potential. The last variable is the barrel. Most factory guns are capable of giving you great results, but it is up to you and the ammo.

Remember, there are very good deals on used equipment.
 
I would recommend starting off with the Model 12 FV, the trigger is good and chances are you'll have a sub-MOA gun without much work or money.

I'd also suggest you start reloading right away, you'll be able to shoot more for the same amount of money and learn how to tune your loads.

If you are really, really on a tight budget and require *instant gratification* I'll offer up a different approach for the optics (flame suit on) ..... get a cheap tasco variable with adjustable AO. At least this way you'll have not wasted much money, be shooting sooner than later and you can use this scope for a 22 (or door stop) when you do upgrade. It will also give you a better idea of what you want for power vs target vs distance in the future.

Steve
 
d4ve said:
Thanks for the post Jerry, I was actually just checking out the sightron scopes on your site (once I have saved some money the SIII 10x42 would be my first upgrade I think) and I read your budget F class write up on Longrangehunting.com a few weeks ago. I guess my main question is this is what are the pros and cons to buy cheap and shoot now(ah instant gratification how you haunt me) with the intent to upgrade in the future vs wait a year and buy higher better but have no rounds down the tube?
Click to expand...

You have to define what is cheap. I just helped a shooter get a rig set up and his cheap would float many shooters for YEARS of shooting.

A Sightron SII Big Sky and SIII LR are "cheap" vs the other brands of comparable performance BUT they cost some money.

There are some smoking deals like the Elite 3200 fixed 10X. A solid scope for around $200ish, less if you buy used. The optics are above many real cheap products and the tracking is solid. I think Barrett still uses them as part of the factory kits on their BMG's

Will you outgrow this scope? I know I did BUT that was after a whole lot of lead went downrange.

Bushnell 4000 and even the Balvar lineup are really decent scopes and come in a very popular 6-24. Think $200 to 300 and very nice glass and mechanicals. Do these have limitations? Of course BUT, you will get shooting accurately.

Define your budget and be realistic on what that will get you and you will be so very happy with the results.

I would definitely go "cheap" on the rifle to afford reloading gear. I did some very good shooting with a nearly FREE sporterised Lee Enfield and Enfield P models.

Optics and reloading will make or break your results. A generic used modern rifle will likely shoot MOAish or better given some TLC.

Without ammo and optics, you may not reach that with a full on match gun.

If economy is really the end goal, get a Savage 93 MkII FV ($270), some match ammo which is WAAAAYYYY cheaper then any centerfire, a reasonable scope and go play.

There is no one right answer to this puzzle and your solution will likely be yours alone.

Will you get it right out of the box? I doubt it. I am still changing what I do and that is after 15yrs of intense experimenting.

But get something and go shoot. There is no other way to travel down this road if you never leave the gate.

Jerry
 
Add up the cost of the gun and the parts you'll buy to upgrade that Stevens and compare it to the cost of a 12FV (I have one, deadly accurate) or one of the Savage target models. It is cheaper to go the factory built route and you're shooting right away. Also if you lose interest in the gun and want to sell, a 12 F/TR will resale for much more than a Stevens no matter what parts you hang on it or if you strip it down, the parts sell for less and take longer to move. If you do the build yourself you'll have to get a nut wrench and barrel blocks and a headspace gauge would be nice too. IMO you are way ahead if you charge the gun you really want and go out and enjoy it, shooting season is too short to waste time fiddling.
 
i have jumped off of the savage and remington bandwagon, due to sloppy quality. check out a used winchester stealth, great gun for under $800. my other suggestion would be the tikka varmint, which you can also find used in a wide range of calibers for $800 or less. you can't go wrong with any elite tactical scope, all great value for the money.
 
I would suggest doing it right the first time, but economics are economics. If he is on a budget let him go as economical as he can and he can buy what he wants.

To me, there isn't a bit of difference between a Savage, CZ, Winchester Browning or Weatherby... They all shoot the same, and you only pay for names and window dressing. The barrel is where the rubber hits the road, and NONE have exceptional barrels. The Savage 12 series target rifles are the exception. The barrel quality is mediocre, but the accuracy is there.

The problem with free advice is you get what you pay for.
 
Then, instead of waiting for a model 12, for the same price and waiting time, assemble a rifle that will meet or exceed its capabilities.
 
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