They are firing using middle finger; holding bolt with thumb and index. Commonwealth troops were trained to do that with the Enfield, leading uninformed opposition to think they faced machine guns. With practise, the middle finger engages the trigger in the same motion as closing the bolt.
Cycling speed - lever vs bolt
- Thread starter cdncowboy
- Start date
Combat hunting cool wonder how many WW2 vets hunted using this technique wen thay got back home
I bet none of them
- Location
- Steel Town and The Peg
Agreed, and when it comes to hunting accuracy, semi's are more than adequate. I was just recently surprized at how quick handling a M95 is! Pretty accurate to, if the bore is good. I find levers to be uncomfortable for my big hands (especially after a 45-70 pounding), and the "big-loop" thingys just don't resonate with me. I am a bolt guy, through and through. At the end of the day, I seem to favour the Tikka T3 and Howa 1500 rifles for quality, quick-enough handling, and hunting performance.
It all comes down to druthers. Like trucks - some like Ford, some like Dodge, some like Toyota, I hear some guys even like GM (but that's an unconfirmed rumour. I also hear the tooth fairy drives a Chevy) When it comes to women - some like blondes, brunettes, redheads. I guess how well each of those perform depends to a large extend on how well you can handle them, and what your fingers can do.
- Location
- Steel Town and The Peg
I'm not picky, I like blondes, brunettes, gingers, black, green, purple, and pink! 
People drive GM's still?
People drive GM's still? I'm not picky, I like blondes, brunettes, gingers, black, green, purple, and pink!
Hey, it's 2017. You're not allowed to judge. But I hear the 2017's have a huge improvement - they come with heated tailgates so you don't freeze your hands pushing them out of the snow.
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
I never believed in the tooth fairy until I saw my dentist walk.
Baddum-tiss.... he's here all night folks..... try the veal, and don't forget to tip your waitress....
Perhaps I can cycle a lever faster than a bolt action if I'm simply trying to fire as fast as possible but I'm not totally certain about that. What I can say for sure is that I've tried testing for speed and accuracy with the same Leupold 1.5-5x20 scope on my Marlin .30-30 and on my Winchester 70 Carbine .308 and I did better with the bolt action.
The test was a simple one of trying to fire two shots as quickly as possible on a target at 20 yards while recording times with a shot timer. As it turned out I was faster and more accurate with the bolt action. One significant difference is the higher comb of the bolt action stock lined me up behind the scope perfectly every time.
The test was a simple one of trying to fire two shots as quickly as possible on a target at 20 yards while recording times with a shot timer. As it turned out I was faster and more accurate with the bolt action. One significant difference is the higher comb of the bolt action stock lined me up behind the scope perfectly every time.
Eaglelord17
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Sault Ste. Marie
Why would you use that technique for hunting? It is designed to bring a significant amount of firepower down in a short amount of time well still being relatively accurate. As someone who has trained in it, I can personally do 22rds a minute on a target at 100m with a P14. It is possible, just difficult to do.
Last I checked hunting is supposed to be one shot, one kill, you don't see people with semi-autos laying waste when hunting just because they have a semi, so why would you expect a vet trained in the mad minute to do so as well (also it was primarily pre-WWI British troops who were trained in the mad minute, most those guys never made it home).
In regards to the original question I would say it really depends on the action and what is going on.
For example I can shoot much faster from the prone with a P14 or Lee Enfield than anyone will ever be able to do with a lever action. I can also reload those firearms significantly quicker than pretty much every lever action ever made. So if the goal is total rounds fired over say a minute the bolt action will win every time. If it is point blank range shooting well standing with no need to reload the lever action will win.
Also for those that are afraid of shooting a straight pull bolt action, keep in mind a semi auto is pretty much just a straight pull action with a couple springs attached.
I think it comes down to proficiency, and gun fit.
Cycling speed is just one factor, getting lined back up for each shot takes just as long.
I bought a '94. I can cycle it a bit faster than my bolts, but when I'm actually shooting the bolt guns will get rounds on target much faster.
Cycling speed is just one factor, getting lined back up for each shot takes just as long.
I bought a '94. I can cycle it a bit faster than my bolts, but when I'm actually shooting the bolt guns will get rounds on target much faster.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
The difference between shooting on the range and shooting in the field, is time. On the range if you have any time constraint at all, you know how much time you have, and you shoot as quickly as you have to, in order to finish within the time allotted. Its not that you don't have time in the field, its that you don't know how much time you do have, so you prudently shoot as quickly as you can shoot deliberately. You can do everything right, but its time that defeats you, if the game moves before you can fire. So you train to make your shot in the shortest possible timeframe, from the moment the target becomes available.
Since time is the variable that most likely defeats us, prudence suggests that the faster the rifle is cycled and readied to make the follow up, the better. Perhaps you'll hunt your entire life and never have need of that skill, or you might need it next time you're out. Regardless, its a valuable skill to add to your tool box, and it boosts your confidence knowing that you can solve any problem that can arise. As an example, one of the most difficult problems to solve is that of a target moving rapidly towards you. The tendency is to shoot where the target was, rather than where it is. Given such circumstances, its not unreasonable to assume that a fast follow up is desireable. Why not just shoot a semi-auto? Well, cycling a bolt gun gives you something to do while you'd have to wait for gas to cycle the action for you, and its only recently that gas guns been equipped with triggers that are comparable to those of a bolt action's.
Since time is the variable that most likely defeats us, prudence suggests that the faster the rifle is cycled and readied to make the follow up, the better. Perhaps you'll hunt your entire life and never have need of that skill, or you might need it next time you're out. Regardless, its a valuable skill to add to your tool box, and it boosts your confidence knowing that you can solve any problem that can arise. As an example, one of the most difficult problems to solve is that of a target moving rapidly towards you. The tendency is to shoot where the target was, rather than where it is. Given such circumstances, its not unreasonable to assume that a fast follow up is desireable. Why not just shoot a semi-auto? Well, cycling a bolt gun gives you something to do while you'd have to wait for gas to cycle the action for you, and its only recently that gas guns been equipped with triggers that are comparable to those of a bolt action's.
Very well said.
